Say Anything Blog

The signs and portents continue to amass....

"Here lies, in honored glory, an American soldier, known but to God.”

The times, they are a-changin’...
Bob Dylan

This is far to serious to joke about, but somehow I’m compelled to say:

“Just like Sherman.”

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Georgia is a member of NATO…

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

Georgia is a member of NATO

Ugh.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Wow, that area of the world is about to blow up.

I wrote a piece a while ago about international relations that is worth looking over again, IMO. Especially in this context. Balance of power works in odd ways in the international arena - I wonder what Iran and Russia have been talking about of late. One sees odd alliances when the balance of power needs to be maintained.

I believe that this post is also relevant to the current situation. Perhaps it can shed light on some of Putin’s more general motives.

Might be worth giving both those a quick peruse as they can both shed light on the current mess in greater Mess-o-potamia.

Yun Chu said, “You must strictly not express in words what is very significant. Both dragon and snake are killed in one blow.”

sparkless-arse-fuckin-buckle,

I’m sure the all the deep thinkers will beat a path to your door.  Heck, ask Rob to place a counter so you can see just how many find your thoughts on the matter relevant.

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

Georgia is not a member of NATO.

http://www.nato.int/structur/countries.htm

Graves,
Read the pieces. The first one I linked, aside from my biases, has very interesting information about International Law, Diplomacy, and Balance of Power. The second one is also relevant. If you don’t think that Russia’s invasion of Georgia has anything to do with our recent deployment of further forces to the Iran area, so be it.
If you wish to consider every conflict in isolation, then all the worse for you. Noting the relations between Russia and Iran, I think we may be starting to see something larger emerging.

Yun Chu said, “You must strictly not express in words what is very significant. Both dragon and snake are killed in one blow.”

Also, Graves,
At least my original pieces amount to more than namecalling. I’m sure, however, if anyone needs to be counciled on which invectives to use, you are the go to guy.

Tart.

Yun Chu said, “You must strictly not express in words what is very significant. Both dragon and snake are killed in one blow.”

Georgia is not one of the 26 member of the NATO alliance, but is part of the 50 members of the sister EAPC economic alliance.

A notable distinction.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

I sit corrected.

Georgia has applied for NATO membership but has not yet been accepted.  So NATO can do what they do best, and sit this one out.

Sparkless,

Hold your breath waiting for it…

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

Brilliant Beardsley says:

I’m sure the all the deep thinkers will beat a path to your door.

Such pompous arrogance from someone who clearly regards himself as intelligent and deep thinking.

What does this man have to say about calling Georgia a member of Nato?

I sit corrected.

I recommend you spend time doing what you do best Rodney, Re-booting computers.

But to be fair, Beardsley, at least you had the raisins to admit you were wrong.

If Rob, Robert108 and Poof were half as stupid as you are maybe this site would be a better forum for real debate.

Eunichized the beardless boy catamite offers:

I actually self corrected before seeing Proof’s message.  You should try that sometime…

sparkless-arse-fuckin-buckle,

Have Rob set that counter for you…

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

Must not blame the tools…

Now then.

eunichized the beardless boy catamite offered:

Such pompous arrogance from someone who clearly regards himself as intelligent and deep thinking.

Well, I guess eunichized the beardless boy catamite is as close to a deep thinker as sparkless-arse-fuckin-buckle can manage.  Which would be sad, if it weren’t so hilariously ironic.

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

Beardsley,

I don’t see any correction from you or proof.  I only see factcheckingisgood’s post.

Link me.

And why is McCain acting like the presumptuous nominee by acting like the president by telling Russia to back off?

Where is the criticism Pubs?

If Rob, Robert108 and Poof were half as stupid as you are maybe this site would be a better forum for real debate.

If we didn’t have to constantly refute the lies, illogic and puerile nonsense of the Kahuna of the Kiddie Pool, some real debate might break out!

Better to have it and not need it than need it and not have it.

H idiot has never engaged in real debate, obviously.
He has neither the knowledge nor the skill to have a debate on anything.

"Give the lefties a pile of money, and they’ll spend it buying votes.” - Rush Limbaugh on the “bailout”.

Russia will independently determine its place in the world and seek a balanced and multipolar world order, Putin said.

Countries like Iran, Russia, Venezuela, Saudi Arabia, et al. are islands of exception to the rules of markets and trade sweeping the world. In this way capitalism and market fundamentalism have their own, well-funded opposition and a balance of power occurs, joining unlikely allies to balance out the concentrations of money and power that result from free-market economics.

Yun Chu said, “You must strictly not express in words what is very significant. Both dragon and snake are killed in one blow.”

Georgia has applied for NATO membership but has not yet been accepted.  So NATO can do what they do best, and sit this one out.

Do you really think we should go to war with Russia?

hawk,

I think we saw how this plays out in 1938.

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

I read about this in our local newspaper this morning.  Maybe Russia will be successful, maybe they will not.  The question is:  Who else will become involved?

Communism is evil

Graves
My thoughts from a year ago were irrelevant, eh? Nope. They were spot on.

Analysts said the escalating conflict in South Ossetia risked major consequences for a region that has become a test of the post-Cold War balance of power, as well as a key energy transit point for Europe which needs oil and gas from Asia.
...
He said Russia’s growing influence in South Ossetia and in another breakaway region, Abkhazia, was steadily undermining Georgia’s hopes of joining the NATO military alliance and putting itself firmly in the Western camp.

Yun Chu said, “You must strictly not express in words what is very significant. Both dragon and snake are killed in one blow.”

sparkless-arse-fuckin-buckle,

You can even post it a third time to indicate you really mean it, and I’ll still consider the source and move right along.

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

I think we saw how this plays out in 1938.

Maybe my history is a little bit off, but I don’t think Germany had the second largest nuclear arsenal in the world in 1938.

I’m not even sure whose side we should take in this.

Hawk,

Last time I checked, there weren’t a whole lot of nuclear weapons (precise count 0, as I recollect) in 1938.

The point is that expansionist totalitarian states don’t stop until they draw back a bleeding stump.

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

This is really bad news.  Putin leads a coalition of Russians who yearn for the ‘glory’ days of the USSR and this may be the first step in that direction.  Cold war renewal soon??

You don’t have to be a moron to be a liberal Democrat but it sure helps.

Cold war renewal soon??

I don’t think things cleave up as nicely as they did before.

Yun Chu said, “You must strictly not express in words what is very significant. Both dragon and snake are killed in one blow.”

sparkless-arse-fuckin-buckle could more concisely and accurately state that he just doesn’t think.

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

Last time I checked, there weren’t a whole lot of nuclear weapons (precise count 0, as I recollect) in 1938.

So I am glad you understand that WWIII could be much more devastating than WWII.

Our first response should not be war with Russia.

Also, how did you determine that Russia was not justified? 

You seem to be advocating war without really knowing what is going on.

Does anyone here remember Chechnya. spark, Chief, I know y’all do, we had that basic discussion last year when S. Ossetia was an issue in the NATO/Georgia debate.

As for Russia’s claim to be uninvolved in the arming and training of Kokoyev’s forces, exactly where have they been getting all those new Russian weapons from?

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

And has anyone else noticed that google has blanked out all cities and roads in the Georgia/Azerbaijan/Armenia region? Satellite image has some cities, regular map is just border outlines.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

Just entered Tiblisi, Georgia and it took me to a map of central Georgia, USA! My, my.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

Did it at google earth and scrolled in, it shows a patch of woods about 5 miles east of Jeffersonville. And it does not matter which spelling, Tblisi or Tiblisi, it goes to central Georgia, USA. Lets try scrolling there by hand, shall we? Found it! And trying the T’blisi variation gets me a “search returned no results” tag, even though I am looking at it.

Too weird.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

OK, after working through 4 separate steps I got Tblisi, Georgia to come up in google maps satellite images, though when you scroll out it turns into a landscape only image. Countries around them have cities and roads, not Georgia,Azerbaijan, or Armenia.

No wonder google is cool with China’s internet policies.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

Hawk,

I’d prefer to let the Georgians do the fighting.  I’d start by getting their contingent currently in Iraq back to Georgia, along with as many Javelin missiles as we can spare.  I’d like to see Georgia envelop the Russian armored column and then reduce the envelopment.

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

Georgia is an interesting country. They had some valley, the name escapes me, where they had mujahadeen hiding out from all places those types come from. From what I hear there is some damn good skiing in Georgia. I met a judge from there at one point in my travels. I hope they can iron out these difficulties so I can go skiing there someday.

At any rate, the post Cold War sans diplomacy, sans UN, arcane NATO…

international relations scenario is turning out to be quite interesting… I will be interested to see what the EU does, what we do.

My intuition is that Russia and Iran are talking. We’ll see…

Yun Chu said, “You must strictly not express in words what is very significant. Both dragon and snake are killed in one blow.”

I’m not even sure whose side we should take in this.

...You’re kidding right? You somehow make it seem like we need to take sides in this.

Balkan conflicts are none of our business, and from a political and military standpoint, we have no business being involved.

Naive notions of party-alliance are what brought us into the first World War.

The Georgian military has been shelling and sniping civilians for the past two days, those that could not escape the city during the few-hour cease-fire (the loosely observed one, at that). If the rumors of ethnic cleansing are true, they’re deserving of everything the Russian 58th is throwing at them.

Now, with that said, Russia has very strong ties to the South Ossetian separatists, and between Georgia and Russia, Tschinvali has been leveled. The capital’s hospital was totally destroyed in a Russian air strike. Russia has always had an affinity for it’s old republics, and has a long term goal of re-assimilating all of them.

It’s a shit situation, and unless we want to make it worse, we won’t deploy.

"Experience… that most brutal of teachers. But you learn, my God do you learn.” -CS Lewis

I’m not even sure whose side we should take in this.

...You’re kidding right? You somehow make it seem like we need to take sides in this.

Balkan conflicts are none of our business, and from a political and military standpoint, we have no business being involved.

Naive notions of party-alliance are what brought us into the first World War.

The Georgian military has been shelling and sniping civilians for the past two days, those that could not escape the city during the few-hour cease-fire (the loosely observed one, at that). If the rumors of ethnic cleansing are true, they’re deserving of everything the Russian 58th is throwing at them.

Now, with that said, Russia has very strong ties to the South Ossetian separatists, and between Georgia and Russia, Tschinvali has been leveled. The capital’s hospital was totally destroyed in a Russian air strike. Russia has always had an affinity for it’s old republics, and has a long term goal of re-assimilating all of them.

It’s a shit situation, and unless we want to make it worse, we won’t deploy.

"Experience… that most brutal of teachers. But you learn, my God do you learn.” -CS Lewis

Real tough choice there…

Russia, which has fallen back to it’s totalitarian default.  Russia, which has systematically returned the press to state control while gutting the political power of the Duma (their legislature).

Georgia, one of the few democratic states to emerge from the wreckage which was the Soviet Union / Warsaw pact.  Georgia, which has bee fighting alongside the United States as a long term partner in the coalition of the willing in Iraq.

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

Graves, I know you don’t necessarily agree with Sparkie, but have at least the dignity to abstain from the name-calling.

Each lash you put on him is compensated by the embarassment you’re bringing on yourself

dirl,

Noted and appropriately filed.

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

Graves, that binary view is not the most accurate one, methinks. The real case’s a bit more involved than any sort of black-and-white dichotomy.

Putin’s Russia is not a totalitarian state. There have been some gross abuses of the citizens’ rights there, and most mainstream media is in government hands. But the Russians do hold real elections and permit independent Opposition forces are , but permitted. That makes Russia’s government autocratic, but not totalitarian. Russia is not a democracy, but it is a mix of direct government power and democratic activities.

Georgia is not much of a democracy for its part, either. Wikipedia, in its article on the 2007 Georgian protests (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_Georgian_demonstrations) writes that Saakashvili responded to 50,000 protesters charging his government with corruption and calling for resignation with helmited police beatings, tear gas, and water cannons.  I will not further dwell on Saakashvili’s securing the presidency in 2004 elections with over 96% of electoral support. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mikheil_Saakashvili)

It’s not at all a black-and-white picture. But Georgia—the aggressor in the Georgia vs. Ossetia and Russia war—is portrayed by the administration and media engines reliant on them and the Georgian government as some sort of plucky champion of democratic values against a Communist emerging superpower (the U.S. government will always use the language of “democracy” as their PR shibboleth to whitewash over any talk of America’s desire for power in regions of the globe). This is a foolish move—duplicitous, ambition-seeking, dishonest, and dangerous.

It’s best for the United States to stay neutral. Propping up a quasi-democratic Georgia, right opposite us on the other side of the globe, does not cohere with any of our real strategic interests, which should be trade, cooperation (particularly with Russia) against terror cell proliferation and Iran, a loosening of tensions (since fears of foreign enemies only entrench power-hungry regimes, in America as well as Georgia and Russia) and a peaceful world.