Say Anything Blog

Mike, al Qaeda is spending some $20 - 40 million in Iraq every year opposing our forces.

That’s $20 - 40 million they aren’t spending on attacks in New York.  Or Toronto.

The goal is to change the middle east so that it quits fostering Islamic terrorism.  How do you propose we do that without putting boots on the ground?

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Rob...I’m not opposed to the boots on the ground so much as where the boots are...but you know that already.

"There are different kinds of truths for different kinds of people. There are truths appropriate for children; truths that are appropriate for students; truths that are appropriate for educated adults; and truths that are appropriate for highly educated adults, and the notion that there should be one set of truths available to everyone is a modern democratic fallacy. It doesn’t work.”

Irving Kristol

MikeA,

If you would prefer to put all those boots elsewhere, and assuming that their purpose would still be to route out the threat of Islamist terrorism, please explain which country we ought to have invaded instead of Iraq and how doing so would have made our anti-terrorism policies any more effective than they currently are.

“Poverty of goods is easily cured; poverty of the mind is irreparable.”

Batty One
How about East Africa? How about the Pakistani border region? How about the autonous areas in Georgia that are crawling with Islamists of every denomination? We are talking about Islamists hostile to the US and not our allies or others correct? Iraq was a poor choice, victory and GWOT wise. Its really expensive too.

Yun Chu said, “You must strictly not express in words what is very significant. Both dragon and snake are killed in one blow.”

That’s $20 - 40 million they aren’t spending on attacks in New York.  Or Toronto.

Boxcutters come in five packs for less than 10 bucks. The Iraqi insurgency is running a surplus. Remember that article? They give us a run for our money and spend less than 1/1000th what we do.

The goal is to change the middle east so that it quits fostering Islamic terrorism.

Lets build a wall around them then, to ‘protect’ them. Worked for Israel… not. Talk about how to conflagrate the problem. Look what mass blame gave rise to in Germany post WWI.

Yun Chu said, “You must strictly not express in words what is very significant. Both dragon and snake are killed in one blow.”

Sparkie, compare casualty rates between the terrorists and our forces.  I think you’ll find it isn’t working out quite as well for the terrorists as you suggest.  But Waziristan probably would have been a better choice than Iraq, assuming that Saddam never followed up on his threats of a widespread attack on Israel…

MikeAdamson, recalling just how independently these guys traditionally work, the fact that they are looking to consolidate forces may be yet another indication of how hard their forces have been hit.

Sparkie,

East Africa???  Forgive my chortling at the irony, but didn’t Jack Murtha and Bill Clinton abrogate any American interest in that area over a decade ago… in favor of Kosovo and the former Yugoslavia, as I recall?

Surely you aren’t suggesting that the previous administration may have erred in its foreign policy choices, or that it may have been mistaken in not pursuing Islamist terrorist with just a bit more determination and vigor?  Naaah!

“Poverty of goods is easily cured; poverty of the mind is irreparable.”

Bat
I suggest nothing of the sort, whether its true or not. You aksed for better candidates than Iraq. I rpvided some. East africa is essentially al Qaeda’s French Riveria. Its where they can vacation without worries, squat and reconoider without annoyance… save a few battalions of Ethiopian forces. I would put Sudan pretty high up on the list. I think kicking Saudi Arabia in the pants wouldn’t be too bad of an idea either. Or Pakistan. Iraq seems motovated by other rationale than the GWOT, to me.

Yun Chu said, “You must strictly not express in words what is very significant. Both dragon and snake are killed in one blow.”

I suggest nothing of the sort, whether its true or not.

Sparkie,

You should!  Your assiduous devotion to equal opportunity sniping at targets on both sides of the aisle while avoiding any hint of commitment or moral judgment is not only frustrating to deal with, but also clearly beneath someone of your intellect.  Doing lots and lots of push-ups is all well and good, but if you’re going to hire someone to pick up everything heavier than a pair of yesterday’s dirty socks, what’s the point of all that exercise?

Incidentally, I don’t necessarily disagree with the need to clean out East Africa, although there are more important strategic considerations where Iraq and Iran are concerned.  My own choice for the next target would be the Bekaa Valley in eastern Lebanon.  But then I believe firmly that our alliance with Israel should be defended and promoted.

“Poverty of goods is easily cured; poverty of the mind is irreparable.”

Rob...I’m not opposed to the boots on the ground so much as where the boots are...but you know that already.

Mike, this is the first I’ve heard of you favoring boots on the ground.  To my recollection, you have only favored vague “diplomatic solutions” in the past (I’m not suggesting that diplomacy isn’t part of the solution for the middle east).

If you support boots on the ground, I’m glad to hear it.  Where would you like our troops to go from Iraq?

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Bat One...they should have pursued Al Qaeda into Pakistan IMO, with or without Pakistan’s cooperation. I still maintain that without addressing the sources of money and resources, particularly in Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, and without encouraging more moderate alternatives to current Arab regimes and their extremist oppositions, particularly in Palestine and Lebanon, the battle against the jihadists is impossible to win.

I’ll also throw in that the sooner Israels’s right to exist is universally accepted then the sooner moderate and pragmatic elements in the West can seriously get to work solving the problem...leaving the heavy lifting to terrorists and neocons just isn’t getting it done.

Carrick...I think you’re right. I also think that it might reflect the lack of appeal that jihadist groups present in countries like Libya and Algeria...I read something about that somewhere but I forget where.

Rob...I understand that it’s hard to keep track of everybody’s position over the variety of topics SA covers but I have to say that your assessment of my opposition to the Iraqi adventure as rejecting any military options is hard to swallow. My position that the military option is one of several available has been quite constant since my arrival...perhaps the fact that I bring up the other options so often has you confused.

"There are different kinds of truths for different kinds of people. There are truths appropriate for children; truths that are appropriate for students; truths that are appropriate for educated adults; and truths that are appropriate for highly educated adults, and the notion that there should be one set of truths available to everyone is a modern democratic fallacy. It doesn’t work.”

Irving Kristol

Rob, it’s my position that diplomacy isn’t going to work in places like the Palestinian Territories or Iraq until the funding of terrorist organizations is halted.  Until then, the thugs responsible for indiscriminate violence towards purely civilian targets have zero motivation to stop what they are doing.

My position that the military option is one of several available has been quite constant since my arrival...perhaps the fact that I bring up the other options so often has you confused.

Well I’ve never heard you express it before, so color me surprised.

Again, where would you like to see our troops deployed?

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Oh! I thought this was an article about how the inattention of the Clinton administration allowed the establishment and expansion of Al Qaeda during the Nineties, resulting in 9/11...My bad.

Save America; boycott the MSM.

Not only has the Iraqi operation distracted American attention away from more relevant targets but Iraq is part of Al Qaeda’s training program.

Mike,

And you and other liberal utopian dreamers want to leave Iraq?  So what? So that they can train on our soil?  You libs never cease to stupefy.  If Al Qaeda is crazy enough to train in Iraq, then let Iraq continue to be the portal to hell for Al Qaeda. 

According to you we’re suppose to say: “oh no, Al Qaeda is in Iraq training to commit jihad!  Everybody out!!!” Well at least you now admit Al Qaeda is in Iraq.  That’s a good first step even if you libs will only admit the truth when you think you can color it in such a way to advance your anti-war agenda.

r108...did you ever see Wag The Dog? Not a bad film and quite ironic when one thinks back on those days.

HG...I’ll add “Saddam was toppled so now Al Qaeda needs kicking out of Iraq” to the list of justifications for the occupation although the list is getting quite unwieldy and probably won’t take too many more.

"There are different kinds of truths for different kinds of people. There are truths appropriate for children; truths that are appropriate for students; truths that are appropriate for educated adults; and truths that are appropriate for highly educated adults, and the notion that there should be one set of truths available to everyone is a modern democratic fallacy. It doesn’t work.”

Irving Kristol

Rob...I’ve already indicated where the troops should have been employed instead of Iraq. If you’re asking where they should go now, I would suggest home for a rest.

"There are different kinds of truths for different kinds of people. There are truths appropriate for children; truths that are appropriate for students; truths that are appropriate for educated adults; and truths that are appropriate for highly educated adults, and the notion that there should be one set of truths available to everyone is a modern democratic fallacy. It doesn’t work.”

Irving Kristol

MikeA: Yes, I did see the movie, and regard it as a very accurate picture of some aspects of the Clinton administration, especially the part about enlisting the Hollywood elites in his propaganda campaign.

Save America; boycott the MSM.

MikeA: One other thing; in the movie, the President himself was never portrayed as doing any of the coverup activities; they were all done by his subordinates, just like Clinton always passed the buck to his subordinates, like Janet Reno for the Waco mass murders.

Save America; boycott the MSM.

"Wag The Dog” isn’t that the movie where the president lobs a bunch of cruise missiles at a purported chemical weapons manufacturing facility in order to distract attention from the fact that he’s been screwing around with a bimbo intern less than half his age and barely over the legal age of consent?

No?  Wrong movie, I guess.

“Poverty of goods is easily cured; poverty of the mind is irreparable.”

Bat: Actually, it’s a completely fictional war with Albania, manufactured by the MSM and Hollywood, in order to cover up the President’s molestation of a teenage girl in the Oval Office.  The whole thing was done by his subordinates.

Save America; boycott the MSM.

R108,

Ah, yes… Albania.

Well, that certainly makes it of vital interest to the United States, indeed.  Must have been one helluva threat.  Tell me, please, were there any WMDs involved (Weapons of Mammarian Distraction)?

“Poverty of goods is easily cured; poverty of the mind is irreparable.”

Bat: I don’t believe so, but I certainly recommend the movie for your viewing enjoyment.

Save America; boycott the MSM.

I’m sure Vince Foster enjoyed it before Hilary offed him.

"There are different kinds of truths for different kinds of people. There are truths appropriate for children; truths that are appropriate for students; truths that are appropriate for educated adults; and truths that are appropriate for highly educated adults, and the notion that there should be one set of truths available to everyone is a modern democratic fallacy. It doesn’t work.”

Irving Kristol

I would suggest home for a rest.

Mike, it’s called R&R which is already a part of military life.  Of course, you want them not only to come home but be disbanded.

You don’t have to be a moron to be a liberal Democrat but it sure helps.