What a joke. Those who buy into “free health care” are fools. Truth is, you pay for it and still might not get it.
likwidshoe - 08:07am on 07/31/2007
Don’t get me wrong here, I am totally against socialized medicine. I just think your argument against Britain is kind of funny.
What’s more, the tool they’re using to determine who is and is not fat is an archaic measure that is hardly accurate. Under body mass index measurements, people like professional football player Emmit Smith are “fat.” Along with people like Dwayne Johnson (a/k/a “The Rock), George W. Bush and Tom Cruise
Yeah, but I guarantee you Tom Cruise and George W. Bush aren’t registering a 35. The Rock might, but I also guarantee you this lady isn’t all muscle. A BMI of 35 is HUGE! I’m at 18.5 now and I’m told I’m underweight. I definitely don’t look anorexic. Yes the scale is inaccurate, but 35 is massive and you have to admit it. 30 is where you become “obese” and 5 points represents a lot of weight.
k_lunch - 08:07am on 07/31/2007
Isn’t our health care already subsidized? (just not by the government) Insurance companies rarely work directly with consumers, they work with employers, and most employers in this state are stuck with blue cross blue shield…
Something also smells funny when:
1. Consumer is charged $100 for health care.
2. Insurance might pickup $15 of the $100
3. The insurance company has negotiated a rate with the health care provider (doctor) to pay him only $50 because he accepts insurance.
4. Doctors feel they must accept insurance or very few consumers will come to them.
The insurance companies in the US would be held more accountable if they had to deal with all of the consumers directly. (ie, no corporate offered health insurance plans of 1 size fits all)
Ace25 - 08:07am on 07/31/2007
That is only one example. I have heard other stories of people with cancer who could not get clearance for medication… Socialism is not the answer for any part of a freedom loving country. Let alone socialized medicine. ANYTIME the Government starts providing for its people , those people can look forward to programs such as Soc. Sec. that are bankrupt and do NOT provide enough for the people who have been paying into it and relying on it for their golden years…
Zsa Zsa - 09:07am on 07/31/2007
What would Michael Moore’s BMI be?
WVH - 10:07am on 07/31/2007
What would Michael Moore’s BMI be?
He claims that his weight is 300 pounds and his height is 6’2”. That gives him a BMI of 38.5.
likwidshoe - 10:07am on 07/31/2007
Sorry, but your argument is completely wrong that this was to ‘ration’ a health system and by a beauracrat. Yet another loose argument by those trying to fight socialized medicine.
(Which is really no different than our own, only instead of dealing with insurance companies you deal with the Government. Same deal, different middle man, only the Government isn’t required to turn a profit off you in the middle.)
Although BMI is not the most accurate tool to gauge obesity, it is still a generally accepted one that is usually somewhat close to correct. A person with a BMI of 35 is OBESE.
Their weight is now a health issue, and as a result poses to be a liability to the health care system. Not only do more resources like anasthetics have to be used to take care of the person, but would not excessive weight also cause more stress on an artificial hip to be put in, thus possibly necessitating another surgery in the near future to replace the one she just got.
Quite simply, if we take your qoute:
“The PCT had refused her treatment because of its policy of not providing surgery to most people with a body mass index of more than 35 unless they go through a weight-loss plan.”
All she had to do was go through a weight-loss plan, which would not only improve her health, further gauranteeing a successful operation, but also would lower her impact on the medical system as a whole.
She chose not to take the required course, so she didn’t get the surgery.
Can’t have your cake and eat it too, as they say.
It’s not like she was denied because the doctors she chose for the surgery weren’t in her preferred network…
SilverSurfer - 10:07am on 07/31/2007
What would Michael Moore’s BMI be?
He claims that his weight is 300 pounds and his height is 6’2”. That gives him a BMI of 38.5.
I’d say he’s fluffing his numbers. I know people who are 6’2” and 300 pounds and they don’t look nearly as morbid. I’d estimate his BMI to be at least a sloppy 40.
k_lunch - 11:07am on 07/31/2007
SilverSurfer - Their weight is now a health issue, and as a result poses to be a liability to the health care system.
So why is she paying for it? And can she stop?
This is where your argument fails.
She chose not to take the required course, so she didn’t get the surgery.
Can’t have your cake and eat it too, as they say.
What are you talking about? Why can’t the woman just have the cake she paid for? You don’t understand that expression.
It’s not like she was denied because the doctors she chose for the surgery weren’t in her preferred network…
Is that supposed to be a worse situation than the one she is in now? What was your point of saying that?
likwidshoe - 11:07am on 07/31/2007
I really don’t see anything wrong with that. The NHS gave her a choice; lose weight and we’ll pay for the surgery or don’t and pay for it yourself. She made a choice not to go on a diet. I don’t think they put a gun to her head and I doubt she’s a body builder like The Rock or anything along those lines. Yeah she has the right to sue, but I don’t know if I’d grant a full judgement if I had anything to do with the case.
What a joke. Those who buy into “free health care” are fools. Truth is, you pay for it and still might not get it.
Don’t get me wrong here, I am totally against socialized medicine. I just think your argument against Britain is kind of funny.
Yeah, but I guarantee you Tom Cruise and George W. Bush aren’t registering a 35. The Rock might, but I also guarantee you this lady isn’t all muscle. A BMI of 35 is HUGE! I’m at 18.5 now and I’m told I’m underweight. I definitely don’t look anorexic. Yes the scale is inaccurate, but 35 is massive and you have to admit it. 30 is where you become “obese” and 5 points represents a lot of weight.
Isn’t our health care already subsidized? (just not by the government) Insurance companies rarely work directly with consumers, they work with employers, and most employers in this state are stuck with blue cross blue shield…
Something also smells funny when:
1. Consumer is charged $100 for health care.
2. Insurance might pickup $15 of the $100
3. The insurance company has negotiated a rate with the health care provider (doctor) to pay him only $50 because he accepts insurance.
4. Doctors feel they must accept insurance or very few consumers will come to them.
The insurance companies in the US would be held more accountable if they had to deal with all of the consumers directly. (ie, no corporate offered health insurance plans of 1 size fits all)
That is only one example. I have heard other stories of people with cancer who could not get clearance for medication… Socialism is not the answer for any part of a freedom loving country. Let alone socialized medicine. ANYTIME the Government starts providing for its people , those people can look forward to programs such as Soc. Sec. that are bankrupt and do NOT provide enough for the people who have been paying into it and relying on it for their golden years…
What would Michael Moore’s BMI be?
What would Michael Moore’s BMI be?
He claims that his weight is 300 pounds and his height is 6’2”. That gives him a BMI of 38.5.
Sorry, but your argument is completely wrong that this was to ‘ration’ a health system and by a beauracrat. Yet another loose argument by those trying to fight socialized medicine.
(Which is really no different than our own, only instead of dealing with insurance companies you deal with the Government. Same deal, different middle man, only the Government isn’t required to turn a profit off you in the middle.)
Although BMI is not the most accurate tool to gauge obesity, it is still a generally accepted one that is usually somewhat close to correct. A person with a BMI of 35 is OBESE.
Their weight is now a health issue, and as a result poses to be a liability to the health care system. Not only do more resources like anasthetics have to be used to take care of the person, but would not excessive weight also cause more stress on an artificial hip to be put in, thus possibly necessitating another surgery in the near future to replace the one she just got.
Quite simply, if we take your qoute:
All she had to do was go through a weight-loss plan, which would not only improve her health, further gauranteeing a successful operation, but also would lower her impact on the medical system as a whole.
She chose not to take the required course, so she didn’t get the surgery.
Can’t have your cake and eat it too, as they say.
It’s not like she was denied because the doctors she chose for the surgery weren’t in her preferred network…
I’d say he’s fluffing his numbers. I know people who are 6’2” and 300 pounds and they don’t look nearly as morbid. I’d estimate his BMI to be at least a sloppy 40.
SilverSurfer - Their weight is now a health issue, and as a result poses to be a liability to the health care system.
So why is she paying for it? And can she stop?
This is where your argument fails.
She chose not to take the required course, so she didn’t get the surgery.
Can’t have your cake and eat it too, as they say.
What are you talking about? Why can’t the woman just have the cake she paid for? You don’t understand that expression.
It’s not like she was denied because the doctors she chose for the surgery weren’t in her preferred network…
Is that supposed to be a worse situation than the one she is in now? What was your point of saying that?
I really don’t see anything wrong with that. The NHS gave her a choice; lose weight and we’ll pay for the surgery or don’t and pay for it yourself. She made a choice not to go on a diet. I don’t think they put a gun to her head and I doubt she’s a body builder like The Rock or anything along those lines. Yeah she has the right to sue, but I don’t know if I’d grant a full judgement if I had anything to do with the case.