Laurent agreed that athletes and other students who sign a code of conduct to be involved in activities should face consequences if they break the rule against drinking alcohol. But he said the punishments were too harsh.
“They don’t have (the) support of the students to hand out arbitrary punishments and punishments that don’t fit the crime,” he said.
Once the photos on the social networking Web site came to the attention of administrators, 42 students were interviewed and 13 face some discipline over the pictures, school officials said.
School officials haven’t said how the students were disciplined, but Minnesota State High School League penalties start with a two-game suspension for the first violation. Laurent and other students said they knew of classmates who were banned from their sports teams for five weeks.
Rob, the only penalties imposed were on Student Athletes where we suspended from team activities for games based on the investigation conducted by school officials and based on an agreed upon code of conduct that they signed before the athletic season started.
Regular students--yeah, you cannot suspend them from school. But participating in extracurricular activities is a privilege and is governed by a code of conduct. You are representing your school in competition. If these kids didn’t sign and agree to the code of conduct during their time away from campus, they have no penalties imposed.
Funny, but guys like Pac-Man Jones of the Titans, Mike Vick, and Henry of the Bengals were suspended for violating the NFL Code of Conduct. They have a code of conduct and their activities were off the football field. You gonna argue that Mike Vick should be allowed to play football because he wasn’t dog fighting at a Falcon’s game? Now we can get into the burden of proof required to suspend these kids or into Due Process, but there is always an appeals process to the District, the Superintendent and the School Board, but part of the appeals process is generally not an organized walk out of students during class time.
Justin B. - 02:01pm on 01/10/2008
BTW, generally the code of conduct does not only cover drinking alcohol, but also attending an event where others are breaking the law.
Face it, the students were breaking the law and posted pictures on facebook. Someone, one of the students there, dropped dimes on his friends and got their ass suspended. And that is all it takes. Photos and the testimony of another person at the event and that is sufficient grounds for these kids to be suspended from their sports teams. Big difference between the burden of proof required to suspend them from school itself.
Justin B. - 02:01pm on 01/10/2008
Once again, we have two posts on the same incident/subject. Can we agree to comment on Rob’s post for the sake of continuity?
Bat One - 03:01pm on 01/10/2008
Ok, lol...I’ll say it again. I agree with Justin on this. These students broke the rules of conduct. They are well aware of the policy and the policy has been in schools for probably 100 years.
You break the rules… tough luck, you’re out.
Anna - 03:01pm on 01/10/2008
Justin B. - BTW, generally the code of conduct does not only cover drinking alcohol, but also attending an event where others are breaking the law.
That would preclude them from going to the drug and gang infested government schools.
Those times when I went to keg parties, usually Coca-Cola was in my red cup. I’d be pissed if people assumed that I was drinking alcohol. Where’s the presumption of innocence?
And we wonder why respect for the law is low. Not only can’t you go through life without breaking one of the tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of law, you are presumed guilty.
likwidshoe - 03:01pm on 01/10/2008
I suggest that if students want to drink and play sports, they refuse to sign the code of conduct--OR DON’T POST PICTURES OF THEM VIOLATING THE CODE OF CONDUCT ON FACEBOOK.
Justin B. - 03:01pm on 01/10/2008
OR DON’T POST PICTURES OF THEM VIOLATING THE CODE OF CONDUCT ON FACEBOOK.
School pictures are out.
likwidshoe - 03:01pm on 01/10/2008
Those times when I went to keg parties, usually Coca-Cola was in my red cup. I’d be pissed if people assumed that I was drinking alcohol. Where’s the presumption of innocence?
I am guessing that of the 50 kids, at least some of them admitted it and others were implicated by peers that ratted them out to save their own asses.
This is not a criminal conviction and presumption of innocence only applies to criminal proceedings. This is an adminstrative process governed by the School Board. And there is an appeals process. And if parents and students are upset about it, they should have elected a different school board that created different rules or they should have refused to agree to a code of conduct that has penalties for these actions.
They signed a contract that allowed them to compete in team sports, but included a provision that if they were involved in activities that violated that code of conduct, their right to play sports could be suspended. Are you arguing that the school shouldn’t have the power to enforce their own code of conduct that both parties agreed to? That the ACLU should sue on behalf of the students to invalidate the contract?
Justin B. - 03:01pm on 01/10/2008
So it is either:
--The students were not actually drinking
--The Code of Conduct was invalid
--Due process was not followed in determining whether the students were drinking or not
--Insufficient evidence was presented of the students guilt
--The punishment is too severe
--Or it is a bigger issue that schools should not be allowed to have codes of conduct for participating in sports in the first place
Please pick or choose your argument and/or add other arguments accordingly.
Justin B. - 03:01pm on 01/10/2008
BTW, Parents also sign the code of conduct with the students and also agree to abide by it. So it generally is a valid contract.
Rob, the only penalties imposed were on Student Athletes where we suspended from team activities for games based on the investigation conducted by school officials and based on an agreed upon code of conduct that they signed before the athletic season started.
Regular students--yeah, you cannot suspend them from school. But participating in extracurricular activities is a privilege and is governed by a code of conduct. You are representing your school in competition. If these kids didn’t sign and agree to the code of conduct during their time away from campus, they have no penalties imposed.
Funny, but guys like Pac-Man Jones of the Titans, Mike Vick, and Henry of the Bengals were suspended for violating the NFL Code of Conduct. They have a code of conduct and their activities were off the football field. You gonna argue that Mike Vick should be allowed to play football because he wasn’t dog fighting at a Falcon’s game? Now we can get into the burden of proof required to suspend these kids or into Due Process, but there is always an appeals process to the District, the Superintendent and the School Board, but part of the appeals process is generally not an organized walk out of students during class time.
BTW, generally the code of conduct does not only cover drinking alcohol, but also attending an event where others are breaking the law.
Face it, the students were breaking the law and posted pictures on facebook. Someone, one of the students there, dropped dimes on his friends and got their ass suspended. And that is all it takes. Photos and the testimony of another person at the event and that is sufficient grounds for these kids to be suspended from their sports teams. Big difference between the burden of proof required to suspend them from school itself.
Once again, we have two posts on the same incident/subject. Can we agree to comment on Rob’s post for the sake of continuity?
Ok, lol...I’ll say it again. I agree with Justin on this. These students broke the rules of conduct. They are well aware of the policy and the policy has been in schools for probably 100 years.
You break the rules… tough luck, you’re out.
Justin B. - BTW, generally the code of conduct does not only cover drinking alcohol, but also attending an event where others are breaking the law.
That would preclude them from going to the drug and gang infested government schools.
Those times when I went to keg parties, usually Coca-Cola was in my red cup. I’d be pissed if people assumed that I was drinking alcohol. Where’s the presumption of innocence?
And we wonder why respect for the law is low. Not only can’t you go through life without breaking one of the tens, if not hundreds, of thousands of law, you are presumed guilty.
I suggest that if students want to drink and play sports, they refuse to sign the code of conduct--OR DON’T POST PICTURES OF THEM VIOLATING THE CODE OF CONDUCT ON FACEBOOK.
OR DON’T POST PICTURES OF THEM VIOLATING THE CODE OF CONDUCT ON FACEBOOK.
School pictures are out.
I am guessing that of the 50 kids, at least some of them admitted it and others were implicated by peers that ratted them out to save their own asses.
This is not a criminal conviction and presumption of innocence only applies to criminal proceedings. This is an adminstrative process governed by the School Board. And there is an appeals process. And if parents and students are upset about it, they should have elected a different school board that created different rules or they should have refused to agree to a code of conduct that has penalties for these actions.
They signed a contract that allowed them to compete in team sports, but included a provision that if they were involved in activities that violated that code of conduct, their right to play sports could be suspended. Are you arguing that the school shouldn’t have the power to enforce their own code of conduct that both parties agreed to? That the ACLU should sue on behalf of the students to invalidate the contract?
So it is either:
--The students were not actually drinking
--The Code of Conduct was invalid
--Due process was not followed in determining whether the students were drinking or not
--Insufficient evidence was presented of the students guilt
--The punishment is too severe
--Or it is a bigger issue that schools should not be allowed to have codes of conduct for participating in sports in the first place
Please pick or choose your argument and/or add other arguments accordingly.
BTW, Parents also sign the code of conduct with the students and also agree to abide by it. So it generally is a valid contract.