Maybe I’ve been misinformed, or misunderstood what I was told years ago, but I was under the impression that plenty of ozone is generated here at ground level from various sources, ranging from faulty electrical connections, d.c. motors with faulty brushes, welders, etc, anything that generates an electrical spark, however, if the molecule does not decay in the mean time, it would take, due to it’s buoyancy, approximately 50 years to rise to the upper levels of the atmosphere. Carric?
Spartacus - 04:05pm on 05/07/2008
Spartacus, most ground-level ozone reacts before it reaches the upper troposphere:
Near the ground, you start with a relatively small concentration level, which diminishes as you go upwards away from the ground. The large blip at mid altitudes is due to the production of ozone due to the interaction of ultraviolet light with O2 molecules…
Carrick - 05:05pm on 05/07/2008
Thanks Carrick, I’m smarter now than I was a few minutes ago...see this time I even spelled your handle correctly ~
Spartacus - 05:05pm on 05/07/2008
All of the planets have ozone holes, or more specificly permanent low pressure zones, over their polar regions. Even the Sun has this feature.
Why is it that only on Earth this is considered unnatural?
Show me a picture of the pole without an ozone hole.
Show me a planet without an ozone hole.
papertiger - 05:05pm on 05/07/2008
So high altitude ozone is our uv shield. That’s pretty remarkable for a molecule that is only 3 parts in 10 million. I guess the other 9,999,997 molecules don’t count.
docdave - 06:05pm on 05/07/2008
Show me a planet without an ozone hole.
I’d suggest looking at the moon, but that’s not a planet. Perhaps any of the other 8 planets (7 since pluto is now classified as a dwarf planet), each is pretty much lacking ozone as a whole, except maybe Jupiter, it’s gaseous and you don’t know what it’s full of, like me after a Mexican dinner. Sorry, TMI
Spartacus - 06:05pm on 05/07/2008
lol
dougee - 11:05pm on 05/07/2008
Not because it isn’t a planet, the moon won’t work because it doesn’t have an atmosphere. If it had an atmosphere it would have an “ozone” hole over it’s pole.
How do I know? Because the next planet over, Venus, has one. And Mars too
(NH of Mars showing circumpolar sandstorms with hole in middle directly over the ice cap).
True they vary in chemical content in response to the constituent gases, but every freaking planet we look at has their own version of an “ozone” hole.
And yes, Sparticus, that includes
Uranus.
papertiger - 04:05am on 05/08/2008
papertiger, we have data that predates the ozone hole, which was first observed experimentally in 1977.
The general phenomenon you are talking about, the polar vortex, is related to global atmospheric hydrodynamics. That is what is responsible for the concentration of Cl at the poles, with little effect being observed at the equator.
Generally I think Spartucus is right though, strictly speaking the Earth is unique in having an ozone hole, and its recent appearance, and rapid deepening, post-dates the use of CFCs
Carrick - 05:05am on 05/08/2008
Yes I agree Carrick, low pressure over poles is a general feature of planets. For instance the south pole station has a barometric pressure at 695 mb (20.5") on an average day. This in comparison with the average 1020 mb (30.0") for the rest of the world.
That’s minus 33% for every sort of air, versus the minus 2% of ozone at the height of the “ozone depletion” scare.
So why don’t we raise a fuss and bother about the O2 “hole” or the N2 “hole” over Antarctica?
Maybe I’ve been misinformed, or misunderstood what I was told years ago, but I was under the impression that plenty of ozone is generated here at ground level from various sources, ranging from faulty electrical connections, d.c. motors with faulty brushes, welders, etc, anything that generates an electrical spark, however, if the molecule does not decay in the mean time, it would take, due to it’s buoyancy, approximately 50 years to rise to the upper levels of the atmosphere. Carric?
Spartacus, most ground-level ozone reacts before it reaches the upper troposphere:
Near the ground, you start with a relatively small concentration level, which diminishes as you go upwards away from the ground. The large blip at mid altitudes is due to the production of ozone due to the interaction of ultraviolet light with O2 molecules…
Thanks Carrick, I’m smarter now than I was a few minutes ago...see this time I even spelled your handle correctly
~
All of the planets have ozone holes, or more specificly permanent low pressure zones, over their polar regions. Even the Sun has this feature.
Why is it that only on Earth this is considered unnatural?
Show me a picture of the pole without an ozone hole.
Show me a planet without an ozone hole.
So high altitude ozone is our uv shield. That’s pretty remarkable for a molecule that is only 3 parts in 10 million. I guess the other 9,999,997 molecules don’t count.
I’d suggest looking at the moon, but that’s not a planet. Perhaps any of the other 8 planets (7 since pluto is now classified as a dwarf planet), each is pretty much lacking ozone as a whole, except maybe Jupiter, it’s gaseous and you don’t know what it’s full of, like me after a Mexican dinner. Sorry, TMI
lol
Not because it isn’t a planet, the moon won’t work because it doesn’t have an atmosphere. If it had an atmosphere it would have an “ozone” hole over it’s pole.
How do I know? Because the next planet over, Venus, has one. And Mars too
(NH of Mars showing circumpolar sandstorms with hole in middle directly over the ice cap).
True they vary in chemical content in response to the constituent gases, but every freaking planet we look at has their own version of an “ozone” hole.
And yes, Sparticus, that includes
Uranus.
papertiger, we have data that predates the ozone hole, which was first observed experimentally in 1977.
The general phenomenon you are talking about, the polar vortex, is related to global atmospheric hydrodynamics. That is what is responsible for the concentration of Cl at the poles, with little effect being observed at the equator.
Generally I think Spartucus is right though, strictly speaking the Earth is unique in having an ozone hole, and its recent appearance, and rapid deepening, post-dates the use of CFCs
Yes I agree Carrick, low pressure over poles is a general feature of planets. For instance the south pole station has a barometric pressure at 695 mb (20.5") on an average day. This in comparison with the average 1020 mb (30.0") for the rest of the world.
That’s minus 33% for every sort of air, versus the minus 2% of ozone at the height of the “ozone depletion” scare.
So why don’t we raise a fuss and bother about the O2 “hole” or the N2 “hole” over Antarctica?