Say Anything Blog

Dang it, Rob. You have to stop looking at stuff rationally. It’s just going to cause you frustation!

Yet what would most of us think if the roles were reversed and it were employees who weren’t allowed to leave their jobs?

Because the whole premise of unions is based on the old Marxist “class struggle” crap, where it is believed that businessmen “exploit” their workers.  The truth is, unions exploit everyone, even the workers.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

So why aren’t more people upset at what labor unions are doing to our businesses?

Because some of us are aware of history and don’t want to go back to a time when people were forced to work in sweat shops.  The industrial revolution was not a good situation for most people.

Yeah, the labor unions worked wonders for the auto and airline industries.
Labor bosses need intimidation tactics to keep the members of their collectives in line.
Just ask Jimmy Hoffa, if you can find him.

Hawk said, Because some of us are aware of history and don’t want to go back to a time when people were forced to work in sweat shops.

This, ladies and gentlemen, is known as a red herring. Notice that Hawk in no way addressed the central topic; instead he chose to bring up a scenario that wouldn’t and couldn’t happen given today’s current labor laws.

Kevin - Labor bosses need intimidation tactics to keep the members of their collectives in line.

We see this illustrated beautifully with Hawk’s comment. When one doesn’t agree with the imbalance of power granted to unions, union supporters inevitably paint a dark intimidating picture of going back to sweat shops and child labor if the vaunted unions weren’t around to protect all of us.

Notice that Hawk in no way addressed the central topic; instead he chose to bring up a scenario that wouldn’t and couldn’t happen given today’s current labor laws.

You mean the labor laws you want to get rid of?  And I answered one of the questions he posed, that is not a red herring.

You mean the labor laws you want to get rid of?

Who said that I want to get rid of labor laws? You pulled that one out of your ass.

In reality, I often use the labor laws as a reason why unions are no longer needed!

Pay attention sometime. You just might learn something.

And I answered one of the questions he posed, that is not a red herring.

No, you brought up a red herring and then proceeded to argue from that false red herring premise.

Who said anything about getting rid of labor laws?

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Real simple Hawk - no unions does not equal sweatshops.

Can’t make it any more simpler than that.

The industrial revolution was not a good situation for most people.

This is an outright lie.  Before the Industrial Revolution, the vast majority of people were trapped in an hereditary class system that left them as peasants, trapped on the land, which was owned by the minority(royalty).  The Industrial Revolution opened up the peasant class(the proletariat) to the possibility of upward mobility and prosperity, not to mention freedom from a rigid class system.  The Industrial Revolution was good for everyone but the royalty and the lazy.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

The way to stop union intimidation is to make them subject to the antitrust laws, just like everyone else.  It’s time to end their “special rights”.  Let’s have a level playing field.  Unions are a business, and the products they sell are fear and envy.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

Rob,

Excellent post, excellent point.

I notice puzz has decided to stop while she is down and skip over this thread. How typical.

hawkie, eliminating Unions would expand our manufacturing capacity over night. It would free up millions of dollars in capital for small businesses and family run operations who are currently having to waste that money fighting Unionscum lawyers.

Politics would also benefit from destruction of the Unions, their backroom, under-the-cover-of-darkness tactics are one of the primary causes of the massive corruption of the Democrat Party. With the elimination of their agents provocateur the Democrat Party may actually return to what it once was. Though, rooting out Maxists is going to be a long and bloody process.

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Guttermouth, it’s nice to see that you miss me so very very much.  No need to comment on this one since I have commented extensively on the other one.  So I will just say this: ditto to what I said on the other thread.

There,happy now?  Oh, gees, I forgot, you still haven’t found your pig.

You have said nothing on any other thread. You have had your socialist ass handed to you. Repeatedly. You are circling the toilet, and I look forward to the day that socialists in America are bloated corpses. That will be a day of rejoicing and celebration. Death to socialists, death to Unionscum.

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And spare us the melodrama and mock outrage. Look at Zimbabwe. That is the result of your ideology. That is the end result of Unionism. Right now, as we speak, your ideology is killing innocent people in what used to be the second most prosperous nation in Africa. The country that used to export food to all its neighbors and had a growing industrial base.

Go to CNN and BBC and MSNBC and take a good long look at your ideology in action.

Death to Socialism, and all its spawn.

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My son became a Teamster on Friday. It’s like graduating from college.

He will be driving a forklift and operating other material handling equipment for a large distributor at $18 per hour. That’s $720 a week without overtime. He has medical coverage, vacation pay, a retirement fund, and overtime pay. He can take his union card to any Teamster Hall in the country and get work.

Home Depot pays $10 per hour for the same job with limited benefits. That’s $400 per week without overtime. Their yearly raises, if you get one, are $.10 per hour.

Corporations are not good guys. They only care about making money. When they ask an employee to do something dangerous and he/she gets hurt, they say, “Well you’ve got disability”.

Management at the rolling mills in Indiana ask the workers to insert an identity card in the roll as it comes off of the line. One of these rolls got loose one time and rolled through a box car. They also occasionally rip a guy’s arm off. He gets a job for life.

Unions keep workers from being exploited and the higher labor costs drive manufacturing technology resulting in more efficient, safer, manufacturing and better products. If they didn’t have to pay for it, the corporations wouldn’t make the investment and we would be where many older countries are today.

A group of people joining together and negotiating better lives has nothing to do with socialism. They are selling a product and maximizing their profits. It’s capitalism at it’s finest.

Corporations are not good guys. They’re not bad guys, either.  They are employers.  Without them, no jobs, no unions. They only care about making money. That’s what they’re supposed to do. It’s how they get the money to pay the employees. When they ask an employee to do something dangerous and he/she gets hurt, they say, “Well you’ve got disability”. What would you have them say?

Unions keep workers from being exploited and the higher labor costs drive manufacturing technology resulting in more efficient, safer, manufacturing and better products. If they didn’t have to pay for it, the corporations wouldn’t make the investment and we would be where many older countries are today.

This is completely false.  Unions exploit workers by promising them things they can’t deliver.  Unions drain off money that could be used to improve technology, and union work rules prevent modernization.  Without having to pay the inflated costs unions create, our auto industry would be competitive.

A group of people joining together and negotiating better lives has nothing to do with socialism. Actually, it’s collectivism, one of the hallmarks of socialism. They are selling a product and maximizing their profits. If that’s true, why are they exempt from the antitrust laws all other businesses are subject to? It’s capitalism at it’s finest. It has nothing to do with “capitalism” at all.  Unions don’t invest any capital, they drain it from those who do invest capital; unions produce nothing; they simply increase the cost of doing business.  What they take is not Profit in any sense of the word.  Unions are parasitical; they can’t exist without business as a “host”.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

ews48: You forgot to mention the amount of his union dues. How much of that is the difference between the $10 and $18 figures?

A troll is someone who only wants to stir up trouble, not have an honest debate.  Some signs that a poster is a troll:
* Dodges questions from other posters * Refuses to give sources
* When one of its arguments is shown to be false, either ignores the proof or moves the goalposts.  Heh. (From the LGF faq)

Didn’t we recently learn of a guy at a Democrat debate who cries because he can’t pay his wifes health care?  He’s a big hit on the campaign and talk show circuit now.  He paid his dues, so where is his Union?  What’s that sound? That’s the sound of another manufacturing plant being built in Mexico.

WOW! I am IMPRESSED!! You managed to transcribe that EXACTLY, WORD FOR WORD, from the monthly AFL-CIO newsletter. Your typing teacher should be impressed, also. And you managed the little personalization touches masterfully.

Bravo!

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You managed to transcribe that EXACTLY, WORD FOR WORD, from the monthly AFL-CIO newsletter.

Are you saying our ews48 is a plagiarist?

A troll is someone who only wants to stir up trouble, not have an honest debate.  Some signs that a poster is a troll:
* Dodges questions from other posters * Refuses to give sources
* When one of its arguments is shown to be false, either ignores the proof or moves the goalposts.  Heh. (From the LGF faq)

My son became a Teamster on Friday. It’s like graduating from college.

The only reason that’s like graduating college is because the person at home depot who knows and does the same things as you gets paid 7/hour less for no reason. Teamsters are lazy fucks. I have lived in Providence and Philadelphia which are both union-polluted shitholes and I know what of I speak. Imagine how much better off all of us would be if your son wasn’t helping legitimize and prop up the mafia with his hard work. That IS what he’s doing. Did he get his red wooden shoes yet? We used to deliver stuff to many jobsites that had mixed union/nonunion jobs. Unions function to exacerbate racism and laziness. Doing a typical delivery, I would show up with something heavy or oddly shaped and a few fat union guys would be sitting in the office watching TV. I would announce my presence and my need for help which is met from the union guys with a grunt and a wave at the phone. Fatass clasest to the phone usually throws the phone to fatass waving for the phone unless fatass near the phone is a capo or someshit. After the phone is used, they go back to watching TV and an illegal alien who doesn’t speak English will generally show up. The fat union guys will wave at him, then me, then my vehicle and go back to watching TV. The illegal will help me unload, fast and effectively. Now, if I can get 10 bucks an hour at home depot for watching TV and grunting and waving at things… sign me up. I’ll work for three or four hours a night in the evening. I have a friend in a union. He’s a lazy drunk. I must say though, I do have one buddy up in Southie, MA that’s in a union… and he’s honest and hardworking in the last place one would suspect it. There are anomalies, but for the most part unions suck is a fair theory to hold. Actually, I’m not being fair because they do work hard, down in Rhode Island, at shooting witnesses on their doorsteps.

I was following the Rhode Island Unionscum story while we were on Cape Cod. I noticed right off that they did not go to New York and protest in front of the company who was violating the “rights” of Unionscum to get paid for not working, they protested in front of a restaurant, whose employees were happy Unionscum, instead.

Just why do ya think that was?

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Sparkie the only thing you forgot was the guy at Home Depot is serving the public much better.  Home Depot is thriving where the unionized workplaces are contracting. 

I’m sure even those working for union wages are going to spend their money where the workers work hard and aren’t gouging them on price.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

People are not forced to work at Home Depot.  On the other hand, unions force their agenda on employers all the time.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

I deal with Home Depot and Lowes on a regular basis, and I am less than impressed with both. Their lumber is consistently crap and their employees do not know where anything is or how much it costs. And goodgooglymoogly, do not even ask any question of a technical nature.

Now add Union labor. Prices triple, materials quality drops, and employee competence follows merrily along. No thanks. I’ll stick to the current situation. And yes, I will continue to say no each time they ask if I am interested in applying to be an “associate”.

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The invasion of unions into American business, with their work rules and inflated wages has driven American business to cut quality and service.  The invasion of PC into American business, with the help of unions, has further eroded the quality level of both products and services in American businesses.  It’s typical socialism: mediocrity for the proletariat, luxury for the political class.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

Gregory - What’s that sound? That’s the sound of another manufacturing plant being built in Mexico.

And why wouldn’t they Gregory? Union supporters have made them the enemy. Why would they stick around, only to serve ungrateful people? Think about it.

Yes, that’s exactly what I meant.

Which is exactly why Unionscum like puzzledfuck want to Unionize illegal aliens.

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robert108, you say:

Because the whole premise of unions is based on the old Marxist “class struggle” crap, where it is believed that businessmen “exploit” their workers.  The truth is, unions exploit everyone, even the workers.

As the old saying goes, the truth might be that:

in capitalism man exploits man, whereas in communism it’s the other way around.

As the old saying goes, the truth might be that:

in capitalism man exploits man, whereas in communism it’s the other way around.

That “old saying” is pure crap.  There is a universe of difference between the totalitarianism of “the dictatorship of the proletariat” and free people making free choices.  You illustrate your extreme ignorance caused by your corrupt ideology.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

robert108 you said:

That “old saying” [about capitalism/communism] is pure crap

When I said it’s the other way around, it was supposed to be a joke:
In Capitalism:

man exploits man

In Communism it’s the other way around:

man exploits man

When I said it’s the other way around, it was supposed to be a joke: In Capitalism:

man exploits man

In Communism it’s the other way around:

man exploits man

It’s still crap.  If you now say it’s a “joke”, what’s the funny part?

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

So, Oswaldo? You support Socialism above human beings. Glad you cleared that up for us. We can now happily dump buckets of shit on you whenever you toddle through. Thanks.

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