Weapons of Choice In Mexico Did Not Come From USA

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I’m fascinated by the Obama administration’s mentality that the fact that violent Mexican drug cartels are raising hell just over the border doesn’t justify additional border security or a fence, but it does justify making it harder for American citizens to own a gun. (Jim Geraghty)

So the latest reason why we American’s must give up our right to protect ourselves is because things are so out of control in Mexico. The theory is that all of Mexico’s drug violence can be blamed on the fact that the US is still a free country where you can legally own a gun. Mexican drug gangs supposedly exploit that by obtaining guns in the US and exporting them to Mexico. (Sounds like a reason to close the border to me.)
But what is the reality. If they couldn’t get guns in the US would their problems just melt away. Of course not!

Semi-autos, some very high-end Sigs and other European handguns were not uncommon along with piles of old revolvers. I thought I had seen everything in the states, but in Mexico it’s not uncommon for people to own full-auto military rifles. Everything from an M16, UZI machine pistols and the most popular, select-fire AK47 military rifles. These are not the so-called “assault weapons” you can buy at the local gun shop in the U.S., but full select-fire military-issue rifles. Now, I know you want to know and are dying to ask; Did I see any U.S. military-issue weapons stolen from the U.S. military? Not a single one was marked with U.S. military markings. Everything was marked with additional foreign markings on the receiver, including M16 rifles, or they had nothing at all. I saw firearms manufactured in Europe, China, Russia and South America along with U.S. manufactured weapons. I saw rifles that looked familiar with no place of manufacture, no serial number or manufacturer’s logo. The information was not removed, it was never there to begin with. I can only assume they came from illegal arms manufacturers in India or Pakistan that produce copies of weapons. It was obvious that none of these firearms came from a U.S. gun shop in Tucson or San Diego. You couldn’t buy them from a gun shop in the states if you tried.

The important thing here is that it doesn’t take all that many guns to terrorize the population, if the criminals have guns. And of course the Mexican drug gangs will be able to get guns no matter what happens to the US supply. They’re already getting machine guns made in unregulated foreign markets. Those kind of sources will ALWAYS be available.
Now I suppose that it’s not impossible to reduce the amount of guns coming into Mexico enough to raise the price over what an (otherwise) honest person can afford. But all that does is make that person an easier victim to roving criminals whether or not they were armed.
The right of Self Protection doesn’t come from a constitution. It’s something that we all have. Rogue governments can try to take that away, but when they do they are criminals themselves.
The corrupt Mexican government is responsible for their problems. They need to quit blaming law abiding Americans.

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  • http://Array 2Hotel9

    Tater? What buzzed is referring to is a money laundering and drug smuggling operation based out of Hermosillo and connected to businesses in Arizona. What he wants you to believe is that those 3 gun stores have supplied all the weapons to all the drug cartels in Mexico. For some reason I just don’t think you are going to bite.

  • http://ndgoon.blogspot.com/ goon

    Authorities arrested store owner George Iknadosian, 46, and two brothers, Hugo Miguel Gamez, 26, of Mesa, and Cesar Boroguez-Gamez, 28, of Phoenix, who are suspected of trafficking the weapons. All were booked into a Maricopa County jail.

    Is this what Buzz is talking about? Notice the names.

  • AR-15

    ignore,,deflect

    One story(questionable at that) and one gun shop busted. Yup, that proves it. I’m going to turn my AR’s over to the ND BATF tomorrow. I feel so guilty that my owning these type of guns has caused all these problems for the innocent, lawful, mexican drug lords and the trust worthy mexican military and Govt.
    Hey wait a minute,guns are ILLEGAL to own in mexico(except .22′s). how the hell can they be having problems with guns? I’m sure if Obama banned AW’s here the Russians,chinese, and venezuela would quit sending full-auto AK’s to the mexicans. Right Buzz?

  • Buzz

    We have more gang members already IN the US than troops in our military. Most estimates are over 1,000,000 active gang members outside prison walls. And the majority of them are not Mexican.

    Dozens of drug dealers were sentenced to death in a series of drug-related criminal cases across China as the International Day Against Drug Abuse and Illicit Trafficking draws near.

    In southwestern Yunnan province, Tan Minglin and three other people convicted of smuggling or selling five tons of drugs, including heroin and ephedrine, were executed after having all their belongings confiscated on Friday.

    Thats how you deal with drug dealers. Pop…Pop…Pop

  • http://proof-proofpositive.blogspot.com/ proof_positive

    These are not the so-called “assault weapons” you can buy at the local gun shop in the U.S., but full select-fire military-issue rifles

    Geez, Whistler! Now you’re going to have one of the trolls spend two or three days telling us why “so called” doesn’t mean “so called”! Heh.

  • http://northerngleaner.blogspot.com/ Gene

    What Merge? The German in me says, Mexico – Belgium, it’s all the same.

    Let’s invade.

    I’ll lead the charge.

    OLE

  • Brent

    If anything, the Americans on the border need to be immediately allowed to purchase better weaponry. After all, they are the ones literally being invaded by armed thugs.

  • welder4

    Mexico is a thing all to its self and no simple merge would solve anything . it makes me wonder what is the answer , it most certainly would involve some common sense approaches, Gang land would not do it justice in the description, it goes much farther then that , it appears to be a cartel unto itself and they are not leaving quietly , to much money and to much power at stake . An all out war is the only way you could even begin to control any portion of Mexico. I have met and know Mexican people and they are nice people but they should have to stand in line like every one else . I understand that we actually trained the people that are now running the drug show in Mexico. What a joke, we trained them to run the biggest drug cartel in the world .

  • http://ndgoon.blogspot.com/ goon

    Yikes this think on the south border could really blow up in our faces I hope NOBAMA handles this in an adult manner.

  • http://SayAnythingBlog.com The_Whistler_ofnd

    I know total potheads better behaved and more sensible than Dino for instance.

    Who’s to say dino hasn’t been mixing drugs with his anti-depressants?

    I don’t want invasion. I say it should be laid out for Mexico and let them decide for themselves.

    You’re going to have to break that to Gene yourself. He already bought his Zachary Taylor style uniform.

  • Buzz

    Officials pointed out that weapons come back to Arizona in the hands of drug smugglers and coyotes who confine illegal immigrants at gunpoint in Valley drophouses.

    “This is a despicable crime. It puts all of us at risk because these drophouses are in your neighborhoods,” Phoenix Assistant Police Chief Andy Anderson said.

    The investigation reveals the reach of cartel gunrunners and signals growing teamwork between U.S. and Mexican authorities. Mexican prosecutors sat in on suspect interviews.

    The federal Attorney General’s Office in Mexico issued a statement Tuesday saying the office “recognizes and salutes these actions carried out by the U.S. authorities to interrupt the illegal trafficking of firearms into Mexican territory.”

    Iknadosian was arrested Tuesday at his Glendale home and is accused of fraud, money laundering, illegal arms-trafficking and running an illegal enterprise. He started selling guns in Arizona in 2004.

    The Gamez brothers are accused of setting up a network of straw purchasers who acted as go-betweens to buy the guns on the brothers’ behalf. The two are suspected of then transporting the weapons to Mexico. Hugo is a U.S. citizen, and Cesar is a Mexican citizen living legally in Phoenix.

    ATF Supervisory Special Agent Pete Forcelli said Iknadosian knew the guns were going to cartels. In making the case, undercover agents bought weapons, and he coached them on how fill out paperwork to disguise the sales.

    Weapons traced to X-Caliber turned up at several Mexican murder scenes. In one recent Mexican case, an X-Caliber AK-47 was found alongside grenade-launcher equipment and 3 tons of marijuana.

    One of the guns sold by X-Caliber was a .38-caliber pistol recovered in January when the Mexican army arrested a Sinaloan cartel leader, Alfredo Beltran Leyva, in Culiacan. Leyva was suspected of running hit squads and is right-hand man to Mexico’s most-wanted fugitive, cartel boss Joaquin “Chapo” Guzman.

    Forcelli said a remarkable thing about the X-Caliber case is that owner Iknadosian knew he was under investigation.

    “If I had to describe this guy in one word, it would be arrogant,” Forcelli said. “He knew we were looking at him, and he did it anyway.”

    Undercover agents bought a dozen AK-47s and a specialized handgun like Beltran-Leyva’s from X-Caliber.

    Agents said Iknadosian paid less attention than liquor-store owners do in checking identification.

  • robert108

    Annexing Mexico under Bungler Obama would be a disaster. Mexican oil, when it became American oil, would boost our economy tremendously, but Bungler Obama wouldn’t develop it. Instead of eager workers who would work hard in our businesses, now that they are Americans, Bungler Obama would make them all welfare queens, supported by “the rich”, in typical Marxist fashion.

  • 2Hotel9

    Time to start rotating US military units to the border for “training” exercises. Each regiment do 90 days, NG, AR, Regular Army and Marines, with Navy and Air Force doing their “training” in the appropriate venues.

  • Buzz

    Federal agents swooped down on a north Phoenix gun store Tuesday in the biggest weapons bust in years, highlighting Arizona’s major role as an arms conduit to violent drug cartels in Mexico.

    Authorities said the store was a source for at least 650 high-powered weapons, including 250 AK-47 automatic weapons, smuggled to drug cartels for use in the escalating Mexican drug war. That war left 2,500 dead last year, and Arizona weapons were used to assassinate police and battle army squads near the border, authorities said.

    The raid on X-Caliber Guns on North Cave Creek Road capped an 11-month investigation by the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives, the Phoenix Police Department and the Arizona Attorney General’s Office. Agents pored over evidence in the store, seized 1,300 weapons and closed down the business.

    Authorities arrested store owner George Iknadosian, 46, and two brothers, Hugo Miguel Gamez, 26, of Mesa, and Cesar Boroguez-Gamez, 28, of Phoenix, who are suspected of trafficking the weapons. All were booked into a Maricopa County jail.

    The bust was noteworthy because of the large number of weapons seized and because licensed gun dealers are rarely the target of investigations. It was the first shutdown of an Arizona gun store in at least five years

  • 2Hotel9

    See, DD, the deal is buzzed don’t want you to know he got it from an article written by a New York Daily News staff writer and tagged by AP. Oops. Guess I left el cato out of the bag!

  • Buzz

    Wrong Buzz. These weapons are being brought into Mexico from other places in Latin America as well as the Middle East and former Soviet states.

    No, I’m right fuck-stick, there are Arizona gun dealers in federal custody today for selling them the guns. Federal agents operated a sting where they bought the guns, using the smugglers as there contact. The gun store operators even gave them advice on how to get the guns over the border. Do some research,idgit.

  • http://ndgoon.blogspot.com/ goon

    Again and again the blog post is a complete fabrication, an utter lie, and when proved to be a lie you simply ignore or the facts.

    Yet you keep reading it.

  • docdave

    2h, I also found the reference elsewhere. From this site

    It was the first shutdown of an Arizona gun store in at least five years, Attorney General Terry Goddard said.

    Yep there is a real epidemic of gun stores selling to drug gangs. /sarc

  • Gabby

    hello(:

  • Buzz

    So the latest reason why we American’s must give up our right to protect ourselves

    Yea, its hard to protect yourself if you cant but 30 guns a month.

  • AR-15

    I propose we fix this by executing any drug peddler and anyone using a gun in a felony.

    How about this. Actually seal off our southern boarder and when someone commits a felony with a firearm or drugs actually leave them in prison for their entire sentence. If that doesn’t work I’m all in on executions.
    I am in favor of executions for ANY politician who wants to further infringe on our 2A rights.

  • AR-15

    We have more gang members already IN the US than troops in our military. Most estimates are over 1,000,000 active gang members outside prison walls. And the majority of them are not Mexican.

    What does this have to do with illegal Russian kalashnikov’s in Mexico?
    Nice switch indeed Hannitized…..er, Fuzz.

  • http://ndgoon.blogspot.com/ goon

    Time to start rotating US military units to the border for “training” exercises. Each regiment do 90 days, NG, AR, Regular Army and Marines, with Navy and Air Force doing their “training” in the appropriate venues.

    I am all for it but the left is against that and they are controlling the USA right now.

  • http://magyartruth.blogspot.com/ Chief RZ

    No liberal can debate based on facts, just emotions or “feelings”. Pitiful excuse for a human being. The bad guys can get whatever they want while the useful idiots try to enforce upon the law abiding citizens what they “perceive” is their problem. What idiots. Blind to The Truth.

  • docdave

    Couldn’t agree with you more, 2h. If I recall correctly one of the constitutional requirements of the military is to protect our borders.

  • 2Hotel9

    Nice switch, that was smooth.

  • chris

    I love the logic here… Somehow if you ban the most popular guns being used my drug runners… They wont be able to get them… Nevermind the fact that they routinely deal in massive amounts of narcotics that are illegal in every damn country in the hemisphere… If only drugs were illegal in the US then they wouldnt be able to smuggle them… Oh wait…

  • Buzz

    ignore,,deflect

  • robert108

    We, our government, created the drug war with our unilateral zero tolerance drug prohibitions.

    Wrong. Our drug laws are due to the fact that the people who make this country work don’t do drugs, and don’t want to expose their children to drugs. Since we spend very little on educating people on the reality of drug use, and meanwhile Hollywood continues to glorify drug use, the sane population wants results. Personally, I favor more education on the realities of drug use, like videos of actual drug users while they are high on drugs, so that we can see first hand how stupid and destructive drug use is.
    The resistance to telling the American people the truth about drug use has created a market here of ignorant people who think drugs are the answer to anything.
    Education will decrease demand. Show the American people the reality of drug use.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/homosexuality_is_wrong_-_a_compendium move_zig

    The Left wants to disarm Americans and arm the enemies of America.

    This goes way back. Remember this one?

    Operation Dragon Fire

    “Assault Weapons” for U.S.

    But of all the decisions, waivers and export liberalizations executed on behalf of the Chinese by the Clinton White House, none rivals what the administration did for Wang Jun, the princeling chairman of China’s state owned arms conglomerate, Poly Technologies. For years, China had been doing a land office business exporting to the U.S. semi-automatic rifles and ammo made by Poly and another arms manufacturer, Norinco. Reportedly, the gun trade was worth hundreds of millions of dollars annually to the PRC. But suddenly in 1994, there was a problem: the Clinton Assault Weapons Ban. Overnight, China’s weapons cash cow evaporated.

    Not to worry. According to a Scripps Howard report by Michael Hedges, which ran on the front page of the March 14, 1997 edition of the Arkansas Democrat Gazette, the Clinton administration granted Wang Jun’s Poly Technologies importation permits to flood America with over 100,000 semi-automatic weapons and millions of rounds of ammunition — despite the president’s own cherished gun ban. That was on Feb. 2, 1996 — just days before Clinton issued the first satellite waivers for Loral Corp.

    It gets worse. On Feb. 6, just four days after the assault weapon waivers were issued, Wang Jun was ushered into the White House for a personal meeting with Bill Clinton. Wang’s escort was Yah Lin “Charlie” Trie, who had laundered over $600,000 from Chinese sources for the Clinton Defense Fund. Combined with his campaign donations to the DNC, Trie’s total contributions to Clinton coffers topped the million dollar mark in 1996. For that kind of money, it’s a good bet Charlie Trie could bring anybody he wanted to the White House.

    ….

    So why, instead of stopping with the March 18th gun seizure, didn’t they keep going? Stoltz and King had wanted to – but inexplicably, somehow word had leaked about Dragon Fire.

    First their office got a call from a Los Angeles Times reporter, who shocked them with his detailed knowledge of their supposedly still secret sting. This reporter’s silence was purchased with the promise of an even bigger exclusive after the investigation had culminated in indictments of Chinese kingpins. Shortly thereafter, The New York Times called and had to be promised a similar deal to keep the investigation secret. But it was too late. After the second inquiry Stoltz and King realized that their own undercover agents were now in jeopardy. They had to act fast before the entire operation came unraveled. That’s why Dragon Fire’s ultimate prize turned out to be Chinese AK-47′s rather than the Chinese operatives close to arms merchant, Wang Jun.

    and

    what national interest, pray tell, was served by sabotaging an investigation into Chinese gun smuggling? And just which Americans would have benefited when the White House tossed it’s own gun control policy over the side to welcome in 100,000 outlawed Chinese guns?

    Though the press has virtually ignored this aspect of the Clinton “China First” policy, House Government Reform and Oversight Chairman Dan Burton has not. Reached Friday on Sean Hannity’s New York talk radio show, Burton told me:

    We continue to investigate the Wang Jun connection. Our concentration has been on the illegal campaign contributions and Wang Jun is one of the people that we’ve been looking into. Obviously if there was a quid pro quo where the president signed off on those guns coming into the country in exchange for campaign contributions, that’s something that he should be held accountable for and we are looking into that.

    Quid quo pro or not, this president needs to explain why his administration waived its own gun law for a Chinese princeling arms merchant whose lieutenants were intent on smuggling even more to firepower to American street gangs.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/homosexuality_is_wrong_-_a_compendium move_zig

    Whistler,

    You are spot-on, fire for effect.

    Suite,

    My friend, you are shooting into the berm with that merger-thingy. That’s crazy talk.

    Close the border, arm our citizens, deploy ED-209s, HK’s and auto sentries (borrowing hardware from several Hollywood flicks) along the Rio Grande.

  • 2Hotel9

    Talk about lies, here is one from your source,”including 250 AK-47 automatic weapons”. No automatics arew sold over the counter in America. And in another paragraph, they mention grenade launchers, exactly which gun store did they buy those.

    And why did you not link the article? Eh, not confident of the source? It took me 2 minutes to find which one you used, and that with just one name.

  • 2Hotel9

    Does it not occur to anyone that tHugo Chavez purchased, 3 years ago, several hundred thousand military rifles and light/medium machine guns from Barri’s good buddy Vlad Putin? Or that the Castroties have been shipping weapons and ammunition to Venezuela? From where it makes its way into the hands of various leftist groups throughout Central and South America. Not to mention several tons of RPG rounds and launchers, explosives, various and sundry equipment and parts. All being sold in the streets of countries throughout the region.

    And we are still waiting for sanni and dinothefakehomo to give us that list of gun stores in America where WE can buy all these goodies the Mexican drug cartels are using. When y’all think that listing will be forth coming?

  • Buzz

    These are not the so-called “assault weapons” you can buy at the local gun shop in the U.S., but full select-fire military-issue rifles

    They were the guns bought in Arizona, traced back by there serial numbers.

  • dragon poker

    cool lookin’ gun by the way.

  • Buzz

    just Google- Arizona gun shop Mexico- you will get like 200,000 hits pick one.

  • docdave

    buzz, where is the link so one can verify your assertions? It’s not that I don’t trust you.. I lied, I don’t trust you.

  • dragon poker

    We, our government, created the drug war with our unilateral zero tolerance drug prohibitions. Remove the prohibitions and the root cause (profit) motive for drug lords vanishes.

    The first sentence is absolutely true, the second sentence is inevitable.

  • docdave

    We, our government, created the drug war with our unilateral zero tolerance drug prohibitions. Remove the prohibitions and the root cause (profit) motive for drug lords vanishes.

  • 2Hotel9

    How many? Give us the rundown, buzzed.

  • sayanything-4625

    You could never get past the culture of corruption Mexico has, it makes Chicago look like Candyland.

  • http://SayAnythingBlog.com The_Whistler_ofnd

    I think merging with Mexico would make us more like Mexico than the other way around.

  • robert108

    Stupidity looks the same with or without drugs.

    Once the stupidity is there, of course; the problem is that drug use creates stupidity, all on its own. Take an intelligent person, add drugs, and: instant stupidity.
    After all, that’s why people take drugs, isn’t it? It’s called “being stoned”, and is visibly different from intelligent behavior.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/homosexuality_is_wrong_-_a_compendium move_zig

    Oh yeah, looks like something out of HALO

  • Buzz

    And supplying there drug cartels with weapons helps how in that scenario.

  • Buzz

    Again and again the blog post is a complete fabrication, an utter lie, and when proved to be a lie you simply ignore or the facts.

  • Buzz

    I propose we fix this by executing any drug peddler and anyone using a gun in a felony.

    Where is Gort when we need him?

  • http://ndgoon.blogspot.com/ goon

    Opps I meant thing not think.

  • http://suitepotato.blogspot.com/ sayanything-4808

    Wrong Buzz. These weapons are being brought into Mexico from other places in Latin America as well as the Middle East and former Soviet states. Mexico is rapidly degenerating from a reasonably stable state to El Salvador or Nicaragua circa 1983 and when that happens, those masses of Mexicans looking to escape and let it fall are going to head north.

    Mexico has some damn hard working and very well educated people there. Mexico needs to keep them and their future advancement as a nation and culture is dependent on them and will lose them and thus their future if it falls apart.

    Keeping Mexico upright is a better move than just throwing a small army to the border to watch.

  • http://suitepotato.blogspot.com/ sayanything-4808

    Merging with Mexico would let us drop the boom on the drug traffickers thus taking the pressure off their law enforcement as here, if you murder our cops, we rain hell on your head. We’d immediately severely disrupt the supply chain to the street dealers here from Mexican sources as well as those passing through. We could throw resources behind the law enforcement there unlike anything they have now, which would be a major morale boost for the street level Mexican cops to have real back-up.

    We’d be able to get behind their infrastructure repair and upgrade efforts and cut a huge amount of red tape that currently strangles cooperation. They have gigantic amounts of very talented professionals in many of their cities but there’s only so much the central government can get done.

    We’d end illegal immigration by making every Mexican a citizen and allow our own current citizens the ability to move there as easy as moving from El Paso to Dallas.

    We’d gain a people who know what hard work, self-sacrifice, and family pride are, and our own people badly need to relearn those things.

    All the way around to my thinking the positives are long term and greatly outweigh the negatives.

  • http://suitepotato.blogspot.com/ sayanything-4808

    Stupidity looks the same with or without drugs. I know total potheads better behaved and more sensible than Dino for instance. I am of course solidly against drug use and any legalization thereof.

    And I am not looking at Mexico’s oil. I am looking at how close they are to sociocultural and economic stability with just a few bits of support once corruption is eliminated. These are a very much motivated people, but they don’t see a way through the current running in circles (much as is taken advantage of in our own country by the libtards).

    I don’t want invasion. I say it should be laid out for Mexico and let them decide for themselves. Leave the door open for them.

    Sooner or later on a long term view, we and Mexico and Canada are either going to be at each others’ throats (mostly if we fall to the enemy within, libtards who have no honor and would bite their own mothers’ tits off soon as feed as babies) or into something cooperative like the EU.

    My thing is that this be entirely by the political process of the people. Let the people vote on it and think about it. Sure, none of us is as stupid as all of us, but you have to have a less jaundiced view. It can’t be forced, it has to be because the people want to come together to make a larger stronger western hemisphere bloc.

  • http://twitter.com/dpcurcionenetze David P.Curcione

    Alot of the Military Weapons come from other countries do MFG arms too! True Alot of the Magor Counties in Aisa,Eurpean Nations too! true! Do sell guns to the Criminals Druge Carriers do buy Illeagal,Military Guns are Machines too! true! South American Nations too! True!!! Not just the U.S. is India,Chinia,U.S.S.R. too! South Afferica Nations too! True!!! There Large List of Arms Exporters& Importers Nations to on the List too! There 5 Internationl Arms Big Wigs Gun Dealers in the world too! They are Biggest Ones Arms Dealers Of Eurpean Busineses Men too! There is 5 Of them in the all the Nations of the hold Earth to true!! Solution is: They Should Checked out by International Police Organistions of Nations Law enorder too! Check Interpole World Police Police Deartments Headquarters of the World Nations of the U.N. Security Councel in New York City, New York State , in the U.S.A. too!! Our Laweforcement is part of Interpal World Police Departments of Lawenorder too! Agreed!! Thankyou, Mr. David P.Curcione is N.R.A. / I./L./A. to Federal & State Laws & Internations Laws of other Nations of the Justice Depts other Nations of the World too! True!!!

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