Say Anything Blog

Who do you think was responsible for this comming up now?  I can betcha with almost certainty it was a Nancy Pelosi Democrat.  Why?  Power, Control, Greed!  The Dems now think they will regain control of Congress and certain Dems are posturing for Leadership. 

Whats my take.  The Dems are not going to gain control but if they did I think I would rather have Murtha then Nancy Pelosi.

Well, that is an interesting theory, but I didn’t think Murtha was actually going to challenge Pelosi for the leadership position if the Dems win back the house.

well i thought i recently(1 week or so) heard that murtha was interested in the position but maybe that has changed

I heard somewhere too that Murtha was trying to round up support for a leadership position.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Well then, this does seem to be heating up . . .

I must say though, this video doesn’t seem to be getting much play anywhere.

I have seen it at American Spectator and Hot Air, but that is about it.

Do either of you more, eh, elderly gentlemen remember Bloom County comics? Remember Senator Bedfellow and Milo as the undercover Arab Sheik, or the Bogus Bill the Cat Bag scandal? These were direct slams at John Murtha and ABSCAM. I was in the service when all this was going on and remember getting lectured by my battery First Sarg and Sergent Major about ethics and government. In ‘80 and ‘81. John Murtha mentioned specifically because he had been an Officer. Did no one else in the country talk about this at the time? Not picking on you Rob, I just figured you would not have been interested in politics in the early ‘80s.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

Is this the first shot of the Swift Boaters?

Anyone remember the Bel Air Arab’s skit Saturday Night Live did on the Abscam scandal?

It was basically the Beverly Hill Billies updated.  The Jethro character was done pretty well if I recall correctly.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Gregdn, it’d be a story and a “swift boating” if the cornerstone of Murtha’s reelection were related to the evidence presented on, and contradicted by, the tape.

Now explain to us why the tape doesn’t say what it says.

John Murtha’s a public figure.  Don’t we have a right to know what character he has?

This has never been seen before by the public. 

I remember the Abscam scandal I didn’t recall any names so it’s interesting that Murtha was tied into it.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

The fact that someone had to go back 25 years to find something to smear this guy with is almost a testimonial.
Not many pols would withstand that kind of scrutiny.

25 years ago Duyba was still snorting coke and driving drunk. ITMFA!

Thanks for pointing out that the left has to lie Don.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Thanks for pointing out that the left has to lie Don.

I’ll leave the dissembling to you, kid...Here’s Dubya’s arrest record.

Obviously President Bush admitted to his Drunk Driving arrest Don.  He also accepted the consequences for that action.  That’s the difference betweeen Republicans and Democrats.  While everyone can make mistakes Democrats never thinnk they should pay the price.

However he never did cocaine and you are a liar for saying that he did.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

First of all, you called me a liar, I proved your ass WRONG, and you respond with what? Platitudes about your Divine Boy King and more insults. Just what I expected.

Secondly, there is plenty of evidence of Dubya’s past cocaine use, including his own non-denial denial.

Don,

Only when your lips are moving and/or your keyboard is clicking.

Out Here
Rodney Graves

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

More insults without substance. Imagine my surprise!

We really don’t have to go back 25 years for evidence of bad behavior and lying on Murtha: there his lies about the military “killing in cold blood”.  Even if you think fantasies about what our President did in his youth are relevant, he has obviously reformed, and Murtha hasn’t.  Nice contrast.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

That should be: “...there are his lies...”

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

Don, Bush sends you his regard, ...

1, ..2 ..3 Here

Don,

Galatians 6:7 pertains.

Out Here
Rodney Graves

Out Here
Rodney G. Graves

Ceterum censeo Parthia esse delendam
Latin: “Furthermore, Parthia (Persia aka modern day Iran) should be destroyed.”

Insults and christian mythology mumbo-jumbo. Y’all are certainly showing your true colors!

Don, did your parents have any children that lived?

Fileitunder.com

And now childish taunts---it’s a Say Anything trifecta!

(BTW, why are you boys and girls so threatened and weak when your worldview is challenged?)

GregDN:

The fact that someone had to go back 25 years to find something to smear this guy with is almost a testimonial.
Not many pols would withstand that kind of scrutiny.

Not quite sure that Murtha’s ABSCAM tape is a testimonial to his character.  LOL!

Twenty-five years ago, George W. Bush was a private citizen, not a public figure and certainly not an elected official.

Jack Murtha, on the other hand, was a Congressman 25 years ago, as well as a Marine Corps Reserve officer, and was named as an unindicted co-conspirator in ABSCAM.  And if I recall correctly, when the decision was made not to prosecute Murtha, the chief investigator quit in disgust and protest.

Murtha is a Democrat sleazeball, whose ties to his brother Kit’s lobbying firm and that firm’s long list of defense contractor clients is well known.  His claim to any sort of military expertise, beyond handing out DoD contracts to favored firms, is ludicrous.  After all, Murtha himself bragged about the fact that he forced Clinton to abandon Somalia, an action publicly acknowledged by UBL as further proof that the US had no will to fight back against the al-Qaeda jihad.

Don: And I suppose “...christian mythology mumbo-jumbo...” is reasoned discourse?  The sad thing is, that is “reasoned discourse” for you.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

gregdn: Bat makes the important comparisons here.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

Twenty-five years ago, George W. Bush was a private citizen, not a public figure and certainly not an elected official.

So it’s okay to drive drunk and snort coke as long as you are a private citizen? Then I’m gonna par-TAY tonight!

Just kiddin’…

Don: And I suppose “...christian mythology mumbo-jumbo...” is reasoned discourse?  The sad thing is, that is “reasoned discourse” for you.

Uh, bob...do you have anything of substance to add? (hell, there’s a first time for everything...)

BatOne:

After all, Murtha himself bragged about the fact that he forced Clinton to abandon Somalia, an action publicly acknowledged by UBL as further proof that the US had no will to fight back against the al-Qaeda jihad.

Then things have changed indeed.  The Al Qaeda leadership now writes:

The path is long and difficult, and the enemy isn’t easy, for he is great and numerous and he can take quite a bit of punishment as well.

Well, Don, when Bat gave the appropriate context to your attempted smear of the President, you were unable to deal with it.  In addition, this thread is about the actions of Murtha, not your dyspeptic problem with the President.  You just try the pathetic “you did it too” leftie meme.  Substantive enough for you?

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

And now childish taunts---it’s a Say Anything trifecta!

(BTW, why are you boys and girls so threatened and weak when your worldview is challenged?)

Don, I don’t see you challenging anyone’s world view all you are doing is making brash calls for the Presidents impeachments.

Then things have changed indeed.

As a direct result of the leadership of President Bush.  Murtha, on the other hand, still wants to do the old “cut and run”.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

Robert:
The Abscam thing was 25 ago.
Bat:
If you have something on his relationship with his brother’s firm then by all means present it.

The Abscam thing was 25 ago.

Yes, and he hasn’t changed since then.  Maybe we should go after the Dem leadership, because they didn’t act to prevent this.  They shoulda known, man!

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

For fun, I went back and dug up bin Laden’s 1996 speech where he first mentions the debacle in Somalia.  Interesting contrast:

But your most disgraceful case was in Somalia; where- after vigorous propaganda about the power of the USA and its post cold war leadership of the new world order- you moved tens of thousands of international force, including twenty eight thousands American solders into Somalia. However, when tens of your solders were killed in minor battles and one American Pilot was dragged in the streets of Mogadishu you left the area carrying disappointment, humiliation, defeat and your dead with you.  Clinton appeared in front of the whole world threatening and promising revenge , but these threats were merely a preparation for withdrawal.

BTW, I didn’t have time to listen to the entire recording, but Murtha does impress me pretty savvy.  He’s smart enough to not get involved in graft up front. 

It probably would have taken a couple of years to reach that point, and would have involved dollar amounts far exceeding what the FBI had to spend.  Murtha was asking for money to be deposited to specific banks, under the label of “economic stimulus” for his district.  If they were who they said they were, moving a few million into an account would have been no big thing.  I doubt the FBI could have engineered this, on the other hand.  He also wanted to start it “clean” so that appearances of good propriety were met.  A little under the table “happy money” after that wouldn’t hurt anybody, right?

By using his brains and wile, Murtha got himself in a much less messy situation than a typical Clinton scandal, which required serious political muscle to avoid eventual convictions for old Bill.  Good to keep Murthy’s lesson in mind, kids, for when a sheik and his representative want to give you $50,000 in bribes. 

Carrick,

The bin Laden quote regarding the effect on Jihadist morale of the US cut and run from Somalia is from the interview with ABC’s John Miller, here,

After our victory in Afghanistan and the defeat of the oppressors who had killed millions of Muslims, the legend about the invincibility of the superpowers vanished. Our boys no longer viewed America as a superpower. So, when they left Afghanistan, they went to Somalia and prepared themselves carefully for a long war. They had thought that the Americans were like the Russians, so they trained and prepared. They were stunned when they discovered how low was the morale of the American soldier. America had entered with 30,000 soldiers in addition to thousands of soldiers from different countries in the world. ... As I said, our boys were shocked by the low morale of the American soldier and they realized that the American soldier was just a paper tiger. He was unable to endure the strikes that were dealt to his army, so he fled, and America had to stop all its bragging and all that noise it was making in the press after the Gulf War in which it destroyed the infrastructure and the milk and dairy industry that was vital for the infants and the children and the civilians and blew up dams which were necessary for the crops people grew to feed their families. Proud of this destruction, America assumed the titles of world leader and master of the new world order. After a few blows, it forgot all about those titles and rushed out of Somalia in shame and disgrace, dragging the bodies of its soldiers. America stopped calling itself world leader and master of the new world order, and its politicians realized that those titles were too big for them and that they were unworthy of them. I was in Sudan when this happened. I was very happy to learn of that great defeat that America suffered, so was every Muslim…

(It is a bittersweet delight to note that the interview is at the site of America’s premier leftist media outlet, PBS.)

Things have certainly changed from the Islamist point of view in the past 5 years, but as Robert notes, it is because of the determined leadership of President Bush and certainly NOT because of anything that has dribbled out of the mouth of Jack Murtha… or Don Myers.

greg,

I will be happy to add a more detailed comment regarding the relationship between Kit Murtha’s lobbying clients and his brother the congressman, as time permits.  Stay tuned.

Incidentally, please don’t drag up that leftist perjorative, “Swift boating” unless you want a re-hash of the full and frank discussion of John Kerry’s service history again (we’ve done it twice now, I believe.)

We can, of course, descend into trading insults, if that turns out to be the best you’ve got to offer, but as a Vietnam Vet, and a fervent supporter of the Swift Boat Vets, I have done an awful lot of research on what they actually charged with regards to Senator Kerry.  It’s not a debate you will win on points.

As for Murtha’s military expertise, while I respect his service as a former Marine, there is nothing in John Murtha’s record that could reasonably be taken as the basis for either tactical or strategic military competence… aside from doling out defense contracts, of course.

We can, of course, descend into trading insults, if that turns out to be the best you’ve got to offer, but as a Vietnam Vet, and a fervent supporter of the Swift Boat Vets, I have done an awful lot of research on what they actually charged with regards to Senator Kerry.  It’s not a debate you will win on points.

Well said!

Thanks for the pointer to the “paper tiger” quote by the way.  Our enemies spell out so well the danger in the Democrat’s approach to national security.

Bat:
I think you know the term ‘swift boat’ has now entered the lexicon as a verb meaning ‘to slander’ or something along those lines.  That was the way I used it.
When somebody dredges up a 25 year old charge against someone it kinda brings it to mind.

gregdn--I will try once.  The Swift Boat Combat Veterans decided to tell The Truth after John Kerry announced his intention to campaign as CINC.  Read the book.  Read his DD-214s that he has posted.  Count the numbers of Combat Veterans.  I will check back here later.

gregdn,

The term “swift boating” as you use it is itself slanderous.  It is particularly egregious when those being slandered are military combat veterans who have done nothing more than publicly express their political beliefs and opinions, much as we all do here.  Beliefs and opinions for which they have demonstrated a willingness to sacrifice their lives.

Actually, it reminds me of the Democrats’ maliciously deliberate attempt to discard overseas military absentee ballots during the 2000 presidential election in Florida.

If the term itself has “now entered the lexicon” as you aver, it is only because those on the Left who are so demonstrably adept at innuendo and snide criticism have made it so by constant repitition because they are congenitally incapable of defending themselves from legitimate, factual criticism.

Chief:  don’t know how you got on Kerry, but the topic was Murtha.

Bat:
“It is particularly egregious when those being slandered are military combat veterans who have done nothing more than publicly express their political beliefs and opinions...”
I’m sure Murtha would agree.

You, greg, brought up swift boat. Be careful what you wish for, for you will surely get it.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

gregdn,

I’m sure Murtha would agree.

is certainly a cute turn of phrase, and altogether predictable.  However, as you might know, there is a considerable difference between criticizing an official for what he does in office, the policy alternatives he proposes, or the reasons he puts forward for his election or re-election, and excoriating a person or group of people for having expressed their own political opinions. 

Murtha’s suggestion that the Marines in Iraq should be removed to Okinawa where they could be ready to deploy to the Middle East is patently absurd, as any 12 year old who can read a map will confirm.

However, your use of the term “Swiftboating” as an admitted perjorative is offensive and slanderous.  It is one more example of the fact that those on the Left can certainly dish it out when it comes to criticism, but simply can’t take it in return.  It is hypocrisy writ large.

Incidentally, earlier in this thread you suggested that events from 25 years ago (ABSCAM) should be off limits.  I wonder if you’ll be good enough to be more specific as to what time frame is “acceptable.” 5 years?  10?  Are John Kerry’s actions as Chairman of the Senate Select Committee on POW/MIA’s off limits as they are now 15 years old?

I don’t take ‘Swiftboating’ to be a pejorative.

To me, it means exposing someone’s flaws in their past. Kery was indeed rightfully swiftboated for the many lies in his history, and for his shameful behavior once he came back from Vietnam.

He deserved every bit of the truthful swiftboating he received, as does Murtha now.

Ken,

My personal feelings aside, I stand corrected.  thank you!

Terry Gross had Mark Halperin (ABC News) and John Harris (of the Clinton hagiography fame).  It was interesting to listen to them squirm as they tried to avoid telling us what they really feel when the issue of Kerry & the Swiftboat Vets came up.

The way they described it was “Kerry was taken by surprise” and had “Kerry no expectation that he would be attacked on this issue”.  What they really meant of course by “Kerry” is “they” as in the Democrats.  Kerry knew full well he would likely be attacked on this issue, because he had been attacked on it in the past.

Gregdn:

I think you know the term ‘swift boat’ has now entered the lexicon as a verb meaning ‘to slander’ or something along those lines.  That was the way I used it.

Apparently, “slandering a liberal” is tantamount to exposing the truth about their past.

So Gregdn, are you telling us that you really believe this happened as described in Kerry’s notorious speech on the floor of the Senate in 1986:

“I remember Christmas of 1968 sitting on a gunboat in Cambodia. I remember what it was like to be shot at by Vietnamese and Khmer Rouge and Cambodians, and have the president of the United States telling the American people that I was not there; the troops were not in Cambodia. I have that memory which is seared—seared—in me.”

What rubbish.

I think “swiftboating” means exposing a liar and a poser.  The Dems, without proving their case, are trying to make it into a synonym for what they are doing to Foley.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

By the way, I left it a bit confused for why Terry Gross had Halperin and Harris on her program (NPR’s Fresh Air… which I always interpret as “fresh” as in overly ripe).  They have just authored The Way to Win: Taking the White House in 2008 (Hardcover). They are experts on this because they are journalists, of course.  LOL