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Friday, March 16, 2007

The Irish Miricle

I’m one-eight Irish you know!

The key to Ireland’s success has been its excellent tax climate for business. In 1980, Ireland established a corporate tax rate for manufacturing of just ten percent. That low rate was subsequently extended to high-technology, financial services, and other industries. More recently, Ireland established a flat 12.5 percent tax rate on all corporations — one of the lowest rates in the world, and just one-third of the U.S. rate.

Inspired by the Celtic Tiger, many Eastern European nations have gone one step further and installed both low corporate taxes and simple, flat-rate taxes on individuals. According to my colleague Dan Mitchell, there are now 13 nations in the “flat-tax club,” including Estonia, Russia, and Slovakia.

It’s become fashionable to argue that increased government spending on education is the key to success for countries like Ireland. I’m skeptical. For one thing, booming economies today can attract high-skill workers from global labor markets. In Ireland, brain drain has been replaced by brain gain as smart people from across Europe are drawn into the country’s growing industries.

Ireland was an economic basket case 20 years ago.  Back then low wage call centers were set up in Ireland.  Thankfully for the Irish they managed to slash government taxes and spending.  This has led to a nearly unprecedented growth of a national economy.

Ireland realized that the business or Ireland was business.  Apparently they are welcoming businesses to come there and profit.  Unlike the Democrats in the US they realize that a what’s good for business is good for the worker and good for the country.

The last paragraph of what I quoted was an interesting comment.  In my opinion we have to spend enough on education (which we do).  But spending more than enough (which we also do) doesn’t do a thing more for the country or the students.  Pretty obvious when you think about it.

Comments

I’m one-eight Irish you know!

Yeah right.  Aren’t we all?

Wanna fight about it?


[Feet make good soup!]

Marty on March 16, 2007 at 05:30 pm

I have alot of Scotch in me… Ha!

Zsa Zsa on March 16, 2007 at 05:48 pm

Are we related Marty?


What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.


The Whistler's signature
The Whistler on March 16, 2007 at 05:52 pm

Wanna fight about it?

Nah! Don’t want to get in Dutch with Rob!



A troll is someone who only wants to stir up trouble, not have an honest debate.  Some signs that a poster is a troll:
* Dodges questions from other posters * Refuses to give sources
* When one of its arguments is shown to be false, either ignores the proof or moves the goalposts.  Heh. (From the LGF faq)

Proof on March 16, 2007 at 05:53 pm

Single person
tax rate euros
34,000 @ 20%
Balance @ 41%

IRISH TAXES

WOOF on March 16, 2007 at 06:03 pm

potatoes? ugly chicks?


rasberry

Sparkie Arbuckle on March 16, 2007 at 06:04 pm

ugly chicks?

I take offense to that. My fiancee is half Irish. Oh well, atleast she’s not one of those damn Gingers.

Andrew on March 16, 2007 at 08:31 pm

Are we related Marty?

You’re a time traveling dog… he’s a wizened orangutan.  No, you’re not related…

Seth Yantiss on March 16, 2007 at 08:45 pm

HAPPY ST PATTY’S DAY!  (Well, it is in OH where I am.)

Paulie B on March 16, 2007 at 09:12 pm

Paulie B: What part of OH?



A troll is someone who only wants to stir up trouble, not have an honest debate.  Some signs that a poster is a troll:
* Dodges questions from other posters * Refuses to give sources
* When one of its arguments is shown to be false, either ignores the proof or moves the goalposts.  Heh. (From the LGF faq)

Proof on March 16, 2007 at 10:15 pm
Avatar for LoadTheMule

I’m half-Irish and half-Scots, which creates a real dilemma; I love to drink, but I hate to pay for it.

Regards…

LoadTheMule on March 17, 2007 at 02:01 am

I’m a bit mixed. Spainish,Irish,French,English,Choctaw, and a dash of Negro, region unknown.

woofie, went to your link and it supports Toots post, he probably read that in researching this.


Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

2Hotel9 on March 17, 2007 at 03:48 am

Proof, it’s St Patty’s in ALL of Ohio!

I moved to North Central OH last summer.

Paulie B on March 17, 2007 at 05:04 am

Irish `miricle’ eh? You know that they received a lot of help (and cash) from the EU when they joined to improve their infrastructure? And then the government gave targeted tax-cuts to industries in areas of its economy it wanted to develop (South Korea and Japan both did the same). Not quite hands-off government.

Since Ireland has a low corporate tax-rate, businesses that set up shop there can sell to all other countries in the EU with few restrictions. This is plain ol’ comparative advantage at work. If all EU countries went to 12.5% flat corporate tax, there would be no more comparative advantage. I cannot see this `miricle’ that The Whistler sees.


“All the war-propaganda, all the screaming and lies and hatred, comes invariably from people who are not fighting.”
“Every war when it comes, or before it comes, is represented not as a war but as an act of self-defense against a homicidal maniac.” —George Orwell

Anarchist Vegetarian on March 17, 2007 at 06:15 am

Erin go bragh
Supporting the Irish.

US (and other) multinational corporations effectively transfer some of their profits to Ireland to take advantage of its lower corporate income tax rate. The Irish government thus effectively collects tax money from multinational corporations on income that was actually earned by those corporations in other countries, and which would otherwise generate tax revenues for other governments.

The US collects only about 1.8% of GDP in corporate income taxes, while Ireland collects about 3.7% of GDP in corporate income taxes

Such a Deal

WOOF on March 17, 2007 at 06:44 am

And what percent of GDP did they collect before this change? And what percent of individual earnings was taxxed before this change?


Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

2Hotel9 on March 17, 2007 at 07:54 am

I moved to North Central OH last summer.

Me? North Eastern! ...’cause I needs me some of that lake effect snow!



A troll is someone who only wants to stir up trouble, not have an honest debate.  Some signs that a poster is a troll:
* Dodges questions from other posters * Refuses to give sources
* When one of its arguments is shown to be false, either ignores the proof or moves the goalposts.  Heh. (From the LGF faq)

Proof on March 17, 2007 at 08:31 am

Wait! Lower taxes can create a business friendly environment, thus brnging more businesses, thus bringing more jobs, thus bringing up the standard of living overall and reducing the need for govenment nanny state welfare????

What a novel idea! I wonder if it’ll catch on?


Election ‘08 - We Are So Screwed

Pilgrim on March 17, 2007 at 08:34 am

What is being discussed is the ability
to pay taxes in the locality that is most beneficial, no matter where the income was earned.

Why pay US tax when you can discharge your obligation at half cost in Ireland.

Wouldn’t you like that ability?

Great for the Irish , not for US tax payers.

WOOF on March 17, 2007 at 08:55 am

I was born in County Wexford, Ireland.

Oh well, atleast she’s not one of those damn Gingers.

But the ginger gene is very common amongst the Celtic race. You could have ginger kids!


Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

ManofFireandLight on March 17, 2007 at 09:18 am

As usual, Woofie, you miss the point by a wide mile with this:

Great for the Irish , not for US tax payers.

Is the US would wise up to this then more business would stay here. More businesses, more jobs, less sucking at the government tit. Get it?


Election ‘08 - We Are So Screwed

Pilgrim on March 17, 2007 at 09:22 am

Ireland was an economic basket case 20 years ago.


Portugal and Ireland were the only western European countries to not be considered first world. This led to high EU investment (Now that the economy is stronger, it is safer for the EU to expand and it is the eastern European countries that are getting increased economic support). Portugal lost out after the reunification of Germany, but Ireland had the extra support for the Northern Ireland peace process and so the world’s governments were actively encouraging the country’s development.

Back then low wage call centers were set up in Ireland.
Thankfully for the Irish they managed to slash government taxes and spending.  This has led to a nearly unprecedented growth of a national economy.

Hurrah for the Irish! Happy St. Patrick’s everybody.

Sláinte chugat
Good health to you


Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

ManofFireandLight on March 17, 2007 at 09:54 am

If all EU countries went to 12.5% flat corporate tax, there would be no more comparative advantage. I cannot see this `miricle’ that The Whistler sees.

This is so obvious, I wonder why you made a point of it.  When govt “mandates” eliminate all choice, that does directly eliminate all competitive advantage for anyone.  Big duh.  Simply another reason socialism is stagnant, economically.


If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

robert108 on March 17, 2007 at 09:54 am

WOOF said, Why pay US tax when you can discharge your obligation at half cost in Ireland.

Wouldn’t you like that ability?

Great for the Irish , not for US tax payers.

Economics is not a zero-sum game. If you don’t like the situation, then lobby for lower U.S. tax rates so that the companies move to the U.S. rather than Ireland.

But who am I kidding? You gave us this link, which asserts at the end, “As I’ve argued before, the link between economic growth and tax rates has yet to be established.” How one can argue that while at the same time discussing Ireland’s economic growth brought on by lowering taxes is beyond me. Talk about having your head up your ass.

likwidshoe on March 17, 2007 at 10:03 am

Anarchist Vegetarian said, Since Ireland has a low corporate tax-rate, businesses that set up shop there can sell to all other countries in the EU with few restrictions. This is plain ol’ comparative advantage at work. If all EU countries went to 12.5% flat corporate tax, there would be no more comparative advantage.

Why are you leaving out the rest of the world that suffers under higher taxes? If the EU ever decided to lower their welfare state tax rates, then your comparative advantage is more than intact when looking at the global market.

I cannot see this `miricle’ that The Whistler sees.

I can’t either. It’s not much of a miracle. Rather, it’s an easily predictable situation given the economics employed.

likwidshoe on March 17, 2007 at 10:08 am

Likwid: Well said!  It is definitely not a miracle; the real miracle is that hardcore socialists would even try real economics.  It works every time it’s tried.


If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

robert108 on March 17, 2007 at 10:52 am

Whistler: I hate to misuse this thread, but here is the link to the free video produced by the BBC debunking Global Warming:

http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=54737


No matter the age or state of health, for a military man it is always glorious to tilt at windmills, rescue a fair Dulcinea and be a gallant knight in armor in a glorious cause.

Neiman on March 17, 2007 at 02:32 pm

Business did not move , where they reported their income did.
Ireland is collecting monies that
would have been in the US treasury.

WOOF on March 17, 2007 at 02:34 pm

Business did not move , where they reported their income did. Ireland is collecting monies that
would have been in the US treasury.

Not true.  It is true, though, that if and when our govt starts spending our confiscated money more responsibly, and starts spending less of it, along with easing back on the regulations hostile to business, more of our businessmen will choose to do business here.  It just makes sense.  People don’t leave a good thing.  On the other hand, they should leave a bad situation, and that is exactly what is happening.


If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

robert108 on March 17, 2007 at 02:44 pm
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