A few years ago I was working as a FEMA inspector and inspected many homes on the Turtle Mountain Chippewa reservation. Rob’s “shocked” does not even begin to cover the deplorable situation there. In fact, I’ve done inspections for FEMA and HUD in the worst neighborhoods in Detroit, Memphis, and (pre-Katrina) New Orleans, and NOTHING comes close to the abjectitude of the situation on the Turtle Mountain reservation. The first thing I said to myself when I got home from my first day of work there was, “My God, it’s like a third world country!” Having grown up in Panama and having seen real, actual third world shanty towns, I know of what I speak. I can see why the tribe would want to keep this secret, but Rob speaks the truth… sadly. And no: I don’t work for FEMA or HUD any longer… thankfully.

…any statements made by you that may have been construed as offensive.

You mean “misconstrued”, right? Rob has no control over the thought processes(if you can call them that) of the haters; they hate everything that doesn’t conform to their ideology. They actually hate diversity.

THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED that, Rob Port, author of the aforementioned article and webmaster of SayAnythingBlog.com, be excluded and removed from all land on the Turtle Mountain Indian Reservation in the State of North Dakota…

But they’ll accept your tax money!

I wonder if the tribe will next move to ban the members who have agreed with the article. Probably not. That would require intellectual honesty; something that they clearly lack.

i also think rob is a big effing hypocrite on this one because he is always stamping his e-foot, complaining that dissent is unpatriotic

Sparkie: Do you have any quotes on that? I don’t remember Rob ever having said that “dissent is unpatriotic”. I’d like to see exactly what you base that on.

fishing with such good bait…

and as you’ve demostrated here many times Ron, you are a Master Baiter!

Take a walk about six blocks in any direction of the US Capital, Warshington, DC and experience the poverty that exists there, if you dare. It doesn’t take an rocket surgeon to see the poverty that is there is much worse than any area of the Turtle Mountains.

The cause of both is government dependence and entitlement. The solution to both is the same.

Interesting that as close to the capital as those slums are they just keep getting worse and worse. Maybe because we keep trying to fix the problem with more poison.

Did Rob claim that there was no poverty elsewhere? In fact he said that parts of the reservation rival slums elsewhere.

Why does Wonald want people to be stuck in poverty.

If it isn’t apparent by now that Rob has offended some members of the Turtle Mountain indigenous people, you have your head in the clouds.

The question, oh, Clueless One, is not whether or not they were offended, but the verity of the thing that offended them.
My ability to make cogent argument and your ability to respond only with drooling babble may offend you, but that is not a reason for me to quit, or to apologize to you for making you look so petty, small and illiterate by comparison.
I’m certain the less than subtle nuance of the arguments escape you Ronald. I would expect nothing less!

No wonder the reservations have so many problems if this is the way they deal with them.

Don’t like outside criticism? Ban them!

Investigate and cure obvious poverty? No need! File useless lawsuits instead.

There is deep, deep denial going on here.

Those crazy peasants would have forced you to beg for mercy and still would have thrown you into a hellfire. Consider yourself lucky for just getting banned.

Translation: “we’re slightly more civilized than bloodthirsty revolutionaries.”

Really, not idiotic in the least.

So….he shouls issue a public statement saying that he alologises for any comments he may have made that were offensive?

Whether Walter knows it or ont he just illustrated a classic example of the left’s ongoing effort to crush free speech. Don’t disgree with the politically correct. Ever. That whole I-may-disgree-with-what-you-say-but-I’ll-defend-to-the-death-your-right-to-say-it stuff is just a load of crap, right, Walter.

Orwell would be scared of you guys.

RaeMarie70 said, Rightists blame poor people for the problems in the country. If Rightists had the solutions that worked, there wouldn’t be any problems right now.

How does this make sense in a country awash in New Deal and Great Society programs?

Oh right – it makes no sense. Rae is just talking shit, as usual.

A lawsuit would be deeply, deeply stupid, and any retaliatory action would be similarly ridiculous. Being a fairly partisan liberal, I obviously disagree with the thesis of the original article, but the only non-stupid remedy is to publish a rebuttal.

What a bunch of babies.

Let’s translate the response:

We’ll take all of the federal tax money we want and you better not have any opinions about it.

This situation is very telling. No wonder the Indian reservations are in such dire straits.

Who is being totally ignorant? Who? Who?

Someone let an owl in here?

Proof,

My congratulations, Sir! To be labeled the “ultimate useful idiot” by the likes of Ronald is truly a high honor… especially considering the source. Bravo!

Rob has no control over the thought processes(if you can call them that) of the haters; they hate everything that doesn’t conform to their ideology. They actually hate diversity.

Which is exactly the same thing that could be said for those who are rightards!

Leftists will blame anyone and everyone but themselves for the ideologies that have led millions to decades of despair, desperation, ruination and hopelessness.

Rightists blame poor people for the problems in the country. If Rightists had the solutions that worked, there wouldn’t be any problems right now.

Who is being totally ignorant? Who? Who?

B1: I thought he was auditioning to do the opening theme to CSI -Loserville!

That’s true Bat, but the larger problem is the government who is empowered by more poor people.

Who lives better because of the welfare system. Not the people on welfare, they’d be much better off if they were productive. Not the taxpayer. No it’s the politicians and bureaucrats that skim off the system to empower themselves.

Ronald Walter said, If it isn’t apparent by now that Rob has offended some members of the Turtle Mountain indigenous people, you have your head in the clouds.

I would argue that the truth has offended the Turtle Mountain “indigenous” people.

I have driven through the Turtle Mountains many times. I just don’t see where there is such abject poverty.

You caught all of that just driving through? Wow. Tell us more.

Take a walk about six blocks in any direction of the US Capital, Warshington, DC and experience the poverty that exists there, if you dare. It doesn’t take an rocket surgeon to see the poverty that is there is much worse than any area of the Turtle Mountains.

So what? What does this have to do with anything that is being discussed here? Nothing.

You know what’s sad with your example? If we were to examine the figures, we’d find out that Washington D.C. is significantly less impoverished than Belcourt.

It is also shameful and disgusting to point with pride and view with alarm. Get a clue.

More jibberish.

Warren: Thanks for the clarification. It’s just that I hear a lot of NA “spokesmen” saying that we should keep out of their affairs, because they are independent, but then they complain when they don’t get enough “assistance” from us, and they also complain about the conditions on the rez(when they aren’t defending themselves from any outside criticism). It seems contradictory to me. I have no problem with everyone in this country being citizens, if they satisfy the requirements, but it’s hard to keep hearing the “stay out of my face” when it suits them.

likwidshoe said:

If we were to examine the figures, we’d find out that Washington D.C. is significantly less impoverished than Belcourt.

Sure, why not?

D.C. vs. Belcourt:

Population 582,049 vs. 8,331
Poverty rate 16.9% vs. 108% *
Unemployment 6.5% vs. 70%
Median income $46,211 vs. $15,500 **

* This is tounge-in-cheek. Based on the article linked to in the unemployment rate link above, “If poverty were a city here in Turtle Mountain, it would be made up of about 9,000 people.” Since the population link above lists the total population as 8,331, well, I think you get it.

** Estimated as of 2005.

In his 2008 budget, President Bush proposed a $16 million increase in law enforcement funding in Indian country to help combat methamphetamine, a godsend to police departments.

“The heartbreaking part of it is, it’s had this absolutely devastating effect on our community,”

“I have tribal leaders coming to my office all the time just crying. I mean, how do you fight this?

How do you function as a government when 30 percent of your tribal employees are now using meth?”

If it isn’t apparent by now that Rob has offended some members of the Turtle Mountain indigenous people, you have your head in the clouds.

Not to pile on here, but so what?! Why is that fact important?

It seems to me the only persons who are entitled to make note of the offense taken by someone else, or their righteous indignation, would be those who demonstrate that such a courtesy is a consistent concern and make every effort themselves to avoid giving offense… including gratuitous personal insults, Ronald.

Stuff a sock in it! You are the very last person to be taking note of someone else’s indignation.

SanskritG – To me, it seemed as though you had already reached your conclusion and visited the reservation as “research” to document your existing positions. No?

Rob went there on a business matter and then blogged about what he saw. As for having reached conclusions,…well…63% unemployment kind of gives one some conclusions.

I have to thank you for the laugh SnakritG. You are complaining about assumptions while making your own.

I’M baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaack!!!
Rob, yes you are truly banned from the rez. Read the Turtle Mountain Star! Good Job Andy L.! If he comes here, he will be jailed !! YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!

I am amazed by a couple of things in this thread.

The 1st is the long, long string of name-callers and “cute-comment-posters” who believe they can post their view in a couple of paragraphs of sour-laced words.

The 2nd would be the attempts by those who are representing the liberal side to deal with this original column by trying desperately to hold the column up for ridicule without offering any answers to the charges.

My view of this, from outside and far away, is that there appears to be a two-tiered problem on the TM reservation…..1st, those who are living in such a sad state of affairs involving unemployment, drugs, etc. while accepting vast sums of government money.

Once I get beyond that to the 2nd problem it becomes apparent that there is a tier of enablers on the reservation itself. Those in charge. It seems this group, perhaps more life-organized, and living a bit better, has become the group seeking to both offer excuses for the 65% unemployment, and offer platitudes about fighting the drug problem…. all-the-while continuing the cycle by trying to fight hard to perpetuate the government support which will wane in the face of their success.

Thus this group responds with threats to writers who name the problems. They wish to keep a lid on the problem and want NO outside offerings of free-speech-protected information which might threaten their kingdom!

If these leaders would employ a carrot-and-stick method of funding the citizens of their reservation in return for actually getting a job, dropping drugs, etc. they might see improvement.

Oh wait, that might end some of the government money!

OOPS!

If the tribes are really independent nations, then FEMA isn’t obligated to help them, isn’t that true? And if they are independent nations, why should they expect Constitutional protection, in any form, much less for “hurt feelings”. If you’re really independent, then be independent, and take care of yourselves. If you’re dependent, then don’t get offended if someone points out that truth. You can’t have it both ways. Only a three year old expects that.

To me, it seemed as though you had already reached your conclusion and visited the reservation as “research” to document your existing positions. No?

Likwidshoe:

Why would he want to help a bunch of savages who he needs protection from? Fix it yourself!

Finally!!! I guess it takes Rob being banned from the reservation and you calling us savages for you to get the picture. We don’t want your help. Why the hell would we want help from someone who has a drug problem himself? You think we want you being a role model for our “savage” children? I think not!

I remember bringing up the fact that people get banned from the reservation and Rob told me if he got banned there would be serious consequences? What would those be, Rob? Is that a threat to our people? You said you only wrote the article to “help us”. Now you’re being banned from the reservation so we can “help you” stay safe.

All this stems from the half-truth you told. Didn’t your mom ever tell you if you only told part of the truth it was just as bad as lying? If you’re going to report things, report the WHOLE story.

Rob: You are such a goofball!! Again, free speech, if you would. You can say what you want, you can have your opinions, but we can’t? Well what the f?
As for your Governor banning me from “your” land? Actually, YOU don’t have any land! It was taken from the Native Americans unlawfully, and you know it, dude.
For all you whiners, shut the hell already. Maybe we could’ve taken care of ourselves if all our land wasn’t stolen from us. That is water under the bridge. No hard feelings, really.
Whistler: Who gives a rip if you don’t stay at the casino? I couldn’t care less.
Rob: If you cared so much about goes on here, why don’t you do something about it? A;; you are doing is blowing hot air. You are all talk and no action.
Oh, you can say what you want about the Turtle Mountains, it doesn’t matter. Why do you care in the first place? Ph, yeah, you pay taxes. Wait!! Sound the trumpet, so do I!! Any who, I am outta here, yet again!

Rob: Just answer the question…What are you doing to resolve the problems here? Again, all talk, no action.

Robert108, I don’t disagree with you.

I’ve never been on the Turtle Mountain Res but Rob’s report smacks of the truth, from my own experiences and from what my rez Indian friends tell me.

It’s just that I hear a lot of NA “spokesmen” saying that we should keep out of their affairs, because they are independent, but then they complain when they don’t get enough “assistance” from us, and they also complain about the conditions on the rez(when they aren’t defending themselves from any outside criticism).

Seems to be the preferred pastime for the “activists” and remember that like Jessy jackass and Al pinhead most of these “spokesmen”, are self appointed and speak for themselves.

It seems contradictory to me. I have no problem with everyone in this country being citizens, if they satisfy the requirements, but it’s hard to keep hearing the “stay out of my face” when it suits them.

Ain’t it the truth!

The reservations were practice for the ghettos of the big cities.

Janel said, You can say what you want, you can have your opinions, but we can’t?

STRAW MAN.

Talk all you want. We don’t care. We respect free speech.

But seriously, you did make a lot of people angry.

Think about what they’re doing: making Rob’s voice very important.

Rob – this is a tacit admission that your words carry heavy weight! Congratulations man!

In the paper, they did mention that one reason was for your own safety. Whic is is true Rob. I am not trying to threaten you or anything, but you did make several people here mad.

SAVAGES! Uncivilized, irresponsible, ignorant savages! Who else threatens violence because poor wittle feelings are hurt? Savages!

Rob: Just answer the question…What are you doing to resolve the problems here? Again, all talk, no action.

Why would he want to help a bunch of savages who he needs protection from? Fix it yourself!

If you don’t like seeing people suffer, then don’t come her. Oh, wait, you can’t. So you’re ok.
I do care, why do you think I am here, defending my people?
As far as excusing the conditions, who said I was trying to do that? The conditions you talked about are few and far between. You were here for 15 hours!! 15 Hours!! What is that? I know social workers who have worked in our schools for decades who said that they have never seen the conditions that you descibed. But oh, well, this is going in circles, so I will be the adult here, and let it go.

I guess next time we get together we’ll have to find a different place to go then the Sky Dancer Casino.

I think the problem is the Reservation system – a mini-kleptocracy where private property is not allowed.

What is the most important asset that most people accrue in their lifetime?

Their homes – when they pay off their mortgage, they have at least a couple hundred thousand dollars in assets. They can borrow against it to start a business, get an education, or anything else that they want.

But a house on the reserve can only be sold to other band members – for peanuts.

The people running the reserves want to maintain the status quo, handing out jobs, money, and housing to friends and family.

Going to a reserve is like going to a Third World country because, like most Third World countries, the concept of private property is compromised by the system.

And let’s get one thing straight.

I smoke occasionally. If that makes me a “pothead”, then there are a lot of “potheads” out there in America. Doctors, school teachers, cops, U.S. Presidents (both Democrat and Republican) and the majority of everybody else. Most of America from those who are aged in their sixties (the 1960′s generation) on down to today’s generation. Most of us have done it.

If you don’t? Good for you. I would never argue that smoke is in any way good for the lungs; no matter what kind of smoke it is. If you want to take it a step further and develop a superiority complex based on that, that’s up to you.

By the same token, apply the same standards to alcohol. I had a grand total of four 16 ounce bottles of beer last year. For the entire year. I don’t suppose that you’ll label me an “alcoholic” now too, will you?

Additionally, if I’m a “raver”, then there are a lot of “ravers” out there. My generation raved. Today, I go about 50 times less than what I would have to to be considered a “raver”. Meaning: I don’t go. I was once one about half a decade ago. And I make no apologies for that. I had so much fun. The politics there were dancing and having fun. Thankfully it didn’t get all wacked-out political like the hippies. Given all of that, I don’t see how it’s an insult. If you don’t like it for whatever reason, then good for you. If you want to take it a step further and develop a superiority complex based on that, then that’s up to you.

I’m not Native American myself but I remember reading somewhere (it must have been Howard Zinn’s A People’s History of the United States) that the Native peoples of the Americas viewed the European invaders as “unclean” (they didn’t bathe) “child beaters” (you know, the medieval and barbaric concept of “spare the rod and spoil he child”).

Didn’t your mom ever tell you if you only told part of the truth it was just as bad as lying?

Very true, Misty C. That’s somewhat of a mantra of mine when trying to comprehend what these idiot potheads are trying to say.

Why didn’t your mom teach you not to lie, Likwidshoe?

I find it troubling that you would speak half-truths. I certainly don’t have a problem with free speech. I enjoy being able to what I say, but I make sure that I cover the whole story. I can’t teach my students to be safe practitioners if I only teach them partially. I have tried to stay up to date on what people on the “con” side of your original article have said and I believe that 99% did not deny what you wrote. Those same 99% were upset that the other half of the coin was not presented. Granted you have the right to write whatever you choose, but you can’t tell me that you didn’t know what kind of response you would get. Did you think people would express gratitude? Every community has deplorable conditions but you don’t only focus on those to skew the public’s thoughts. Likwidshoe is a perfect example. He hangs on your every word although he has never even been in Belcourt. I keep hearing the two of you state the 63% unemployment rate. Yes, we have a high unemployment rate. We will probably always have a high unemployment rate. Does this mean all of the unemployed people are living in the conditions you described? No!

And did the tribe say they were banning you because of your “free speech” or for safety reasons? You can’t tell half truths about a group of people and not expect repercussions, whatever they may be.

I’m sorry, I didn’t know this site was your house.

It’s not.

And yes, I was taught manners, unlike you which is precisely why I didn’t tell you to “shut the fuck up” as you’ve told me a few times.

If you were taught manners, why do you continue to lie?

You’re just an idiot anyway. You mean nothing to me.

Then why are you here?

You pretend to be something you’re not. I despise people like you.

Really? What am I supposedly pretending to be?

Misty
That is not a drug problem, IMO. So am I. Big deal. Its no worse than having a cocktail here or there. In fact, in the long term, its probably much better on one’s cognitive abilities than alcohol is.

Spoken like a true druggie, Sparkie! So do you (or will you) tell your children it’s ok to smoke pot? Where is the scientific evidence stating smoking pot is better than having an occassional drink? Are you kidding me? It’s no worse? IT IS ILLEGAL!!!! This is the kind of mentality that gets communities into trouble!

Rob, sorry, couldn’t stay away. You are right about title 39. But, you are wrong about not being banned. As of 3:15 pm on Thursday, May 10th, you were officially banned from the reservation, in “order that the peace, health, political integrity, economic security and general welfare of the Turtle Mountain Band of Chippewa be secured”. That was a direct quote from the resolution. Your article caused a great deal of damage to the integrity of the Turtle Mountain Tribe. If you have a problem with the resolution, you are welcome to tribal court, once you receive your notice and paperwork pursuant to title 39.

The resolution is serious business. The tribe means business, and business it shall be.

I’m sorry, I didn’t know this site was your house. And yes, I was taught manners, unlike you which is precisely why I didn’t tell you to “shut the fuck up” as you’ve told me a few times. I simply said, “shut up.” You’re just an idiot anyway. You mean nothing to me. You pretend to be something you’re not. I despise people like you.

I can be a little disrespectful towards all of the little Eichmanns on this site at times.

Little Eichmanns? Oh my…

Vincenzo, Likwidshoe just likes thread-jacking so he can talk about himself.

Egh. Please. It wasn’t me who started. I’m the one who has been pointing out the deflection. I guess you’re just being disrespectful.

…and the few crumbs of assistance to be taken away too.

Billions of dollars is a “few crumbs”?

I’d ban Rob from my reservation if I had one too.

So much for being an anarchist. Fraud.

Thanks for the insulting lies and hypocrisy Dorothy Vallens, Janel, Misty C and Dirk Gently. Because you can’t answer for the horrendous conditions on the reservation (and get mad at those who point it out), you’ve decided to ignore it and attack the messenger.

How typical. Pat yourselves on the back for partaking in the crushing of dissent. Congratulations. You’ve become the savages I was speaking of.

When you hear the word racism, most people think African American or Hispanic, but there is an entire other race in America who experiences racism on every level without a real sense of justice, it is the American Indian.

Racism far exceeds just Black and White or Hispanic and Asian. Often forgotten, the American Indian has experienced a great deal of racism in the U.S. Although many people overlook or excuse the behavior of the settlers, this was the home of the Indian person before Christopher Columbus. Contrary to popular belief, Columbus didn’t discover America, the Indians already called this vast land home. And like any person defending their home or territory, the Indians fought to keep their land.

It seems a shame that Native Americans are subjected to racism in a country they called their own but they do. According to the United States Department of Justice Native Americans experience per capita more than twice the rates of violence as the average American citizen. American Indians are the victim of violence by those of other races more than 70 percent of the time. So why then is the public not aware of these statistics? The answer is horrifyingly simple; the justice system in American does not tend to care for its native sons and daughters.

According to the US Department of Justice, by its own admission, crimes against Native Americans go unpunished. The DOJ states that some of the problem is reporting of crimes by Indians but they also admit that police officers nationwide are not equipped with the knowledge needed to fight crime within Native tribes. Many times because tribal members live on reservations local police are reluctant or discouraged from responding to crimes against natives. In affect this leaves many tribes policing themselves that can get difficult because of tribal ties.

Another consideration in this sad situation is that there is still a racism barrier between Caucasians and Natives as well. There still remains distrust between Native Americans and White people thus creating an atmosphere contusive to racism. Many Native American still refer to the justice system outside the reservation to “white man’s law” because many feel they don’t get a fair shake. Until there is an acknowledgment that three is a problem with racism and Native American people it will continue. Admitting that there is a problem, after all, is half the battle. The Native American people have grossly been overlooked, their culture and values have been stolen and devalued. One wonders why alcoholism is a major problem with the Native American population.

It’s sad commentary that in this country there is so much racism or prejudices against different groups. Much of this racism is generational, past down from one generation to the next. Hopefully, at some point racism will be eliminated.

When did I lie? Please, enlighten me. Considering I also despise liars, I’d be curious to find out what I lied about.

I’m sorry, I didn’t know this site was your house.

It’s not.

Then why ask if I act this way in a guest’s house?

Likwid, pop your big head. I’m not here for you. I’m here to speak my mind, just like you are.

You are pretending to not be racist yet you take every opportunity to spew racial slurs. If someone says something you don’t like, they are called “savage”, “bastard”, “welfare queen”,etc. You also enjoy pointing out the fact that we have a drug and alcohol problem on our reservations yet you’ve never been to our reservation. In addition, you have admitted to using drugs yourself. I’d say YOU are the HYPOCRITE! I don’t care how often you use or don’t use, the fact is you admit to smoking pot.

Misty C – do you always act this way in a guest’s house?

Didn’t anybody teach you manners?

And once again – if you don’t want my opinion, then stop buying it. Until then, too bad. I’ll talk all I want. Learn to live with that reality.

There watching you!

A vivid reminder of the historic depth of American racism surfaced in April when the United Methodist Church, at its national convention in Denver, formally apologized to the Arapaho and Cheyenne Indian tribes for the Sand Creek Massacre of 1864, which was planned and led against a peaceful and unsuspecting Indian village by a Methodist lay preacher and U.S. Cavalry officer, Col. John M. Chivington. Over 200 victims, mostly women and children, were slaughtered in this unprovoked attack.

Long forgotten by most whites, including the Methodists, it has remained a bitter memory among the present-day descendants of the Arapahos and Cheyennes. A Native American Methodist pastor, Alvin Deer, who currently serves the two tribes, now located in Oklahoma, brought the grievance to the Methodist convention. “Working with people on a daily basis, I learned how intense this is in their memory,” he noted. “An elderly woman told me this is one of the first things they teach their children.” They also kept alive the memory that the assault was led by a Christian minister.

The massacre was a result of economic factors and political ambitions that had spawned widespread racism among the white immigrants flooding into the western Indian homelands. The 1858 gold rush into the Colorado region brought in hordes of fortune seekers who soon built towns and became permanent residents, squatting on Indian lands. The newcomers, with their growing population, farming, ranching, merchant economy and permanently settled villages, would soon clash with the Native Americans’ vastly different hunting economy, which required an extensive territory and freedom of movement to follow the bison and other game.

Although initially Indians came and went freely in the growing city of Denver, and at William Bent’s fortified trading post along the Arkansas River, most whites began to resent the Native Americans as a growing nuisance and as inhibitors to white “progress,” i.e., ownership of the entire territory. Except for those white men, like Bent, who had Indian wives, many others looked down upon the Native American as “different” and therefore inferior.

As whites started to infringe upon Indian hunting grounds and unruly gangs began to steal Indian horses and rape Indian women, the Indians were forced into smaller and smaller areas and began to face starvation. Their frequent seizure and butchery of cattle to fend off the threat of starvation aroused the ire of ranchers. Indians also sometimes robbed wagon trains of food but did not harm the passengers.

For governmental authorities there was no “white problem,” but only an “Indian problem.” And clearly something had to be done to relieve tensions. What was done by the U.S. government through the 1861 Treaty of Fort Wise was to pressure the Arapahos and Cheyennes to give up most of their land and to restrict them to an even smaller territory called a reservation, with promise of government annuities worth $30,000 annually for 15 years, including assistance to make the transition to farming.

According to historian Stan Hoig (THE SAND CREEK MASSACRE, 1961), the spot picked out for the reservation was “a gameless, arid section of southeastern Colorado,” an area useless to whites. Hoig has aptly described the treaty negotiations: “The whites in Colorado now legally own the land they had invaded, bought for them at a price that would never be paid. Before that, the Indians would be driven to war.” The treaty was a swindle.

Hostilities broke out in 1864 when a cavalry unit of 40 men attempted to disarm some Cheyennes who had cattle with them, despite the fact that the Indians were friendly and were willing to give up the cattle peacefully. Seizing a Plains Indian’s gun was a deliberately hostile act, and the Cheyennes successfully fought back.

Misty C – is this Associated Press report also “falsification in [your] book”? It’s a story, and it’s not the “complete story” since it only focused on the crippling meth problems the Indian reservations have been suffering with.

Now you can dismiss that point and bring up my occasional marijuana smoking (as if that even compared to meth rot) if that makes you feel better, but it won’t go unnoticed that you have very big double standards.

For the next four years, the gang sold pounds and pounds of meth, much of it 98 percent pure. The drugs came from Mexico, then on to Los Angeles; Ogden, Utah (where Sagaste-Cruz lived); and finally Wyoming, where gang members had a handful of local distributors, each with their own customer base.

You can’t blame the White Devil for that problem. Notice, too, that the article “showed one minute portion of the reservation” and it limited it’s focus to that one area. In short, it is written like a normal article. Will you apply the same criteria in judging that article?

Be careful with throwing out damaging racism accusations Mrs. Misty Lynn XXXXcXX, 23 years old. Some people don’t appreciate those attempts and will take steps to protect their names, (yes, even their online nicknames). If you would like, I could give a phone call to your house to discuss this matter more intimately. Or we can avoid all of that by discussing this matter like adults. Your choice.

I’ll start:

The banning of Rob for his own protection tells us all we need to know about the dysfunction in the Turtle Mountain Indian reservation.

How do you respond? (Remember, no libelous charges or threats.)

In another major instance that enraged the Cheyennes, soldiers approached the village of Chief Lean Bear, staunch friend of the whites, and shot him dead when he came forward to parley with them, holding the papers he had received from the president on a previous trip to Washington. This unprovoked killing, as Stan Hoig has noted, “exploded the wrath” of the Indian warriors “beyond the control of the chiefs,” and brought about the Cheyenne war in the summer of 1864 until chiefs such as Black Kettle could calm their warriors and bring about peace.

In November of 1864, after the chiefs had secured peace, Col. John M. Chivington arrived at Fort Lyon, Colo., determined to mount a massive expedition against any available Indian encampment, no matter how peaceful, and would not be dissuaded by those officers who protested such a betrayal. “Damn any man who is in sympathy with an Indian!” he exploded.

On Nov. 29, 1864, Chivington’s command reached the Cheyenne encampment of Chief Black Kettle at Sand Creek and began the attack immediately. Capt. Silas Soule, a severe critic of the attack, forbade his men to fire. Black Kettle, friend of the whites, hoisted a large American flag with a white flag beneath it to indicate a friendly village. It was useless. The soldiers slaughtered indiscriminately; and after the battle, scalped, bashed in the skulls and otherwise mutilated the dead. Many officers and enlisted men alike cut off the private parts of men, women and children and kept them as souvenirs. Others cut off fingers to obtain rings. One soldier claimed to have cut out a woman’s heart. After the battle, women and children prisoners were killed and scalped. Black Kettle and a number of his people had fought their way to freedom.

Back in Denver after the massacre, Chivington was received as a hero.

A congressional inquiry, which took extensive testimony on the horrors of the Sand Creek campaign, was a fact-finding enterprise only, and no one was ever prosecuted for the outrage. Denver residents were incensed over this congressional “meddling.”

Four years later, while encamped along the Washita River in Oklahoma Territory, Black Kettle and his people became victims of Gen. Phil Sheridan’s Indian extermination policy. In the early morning of Nov. 27, 1868, Lt. Col. George A. Custer and more than 800 members of the 7th Cavalry attacked Black Kettle’s sleeping village, killing more than 100, including Chief Black Kettle, the champion of peace.

The romantic notions that have grown up around the movement of whites into the American West conveniently ignore the often sordid and crass materialism of the bourgeois destruction of both the environment and the original human inhabitants. A nascent capitalism ruthlessly crushes every impediment in its road to dominance in order to establish the institution of private property and the exploitation of land. The Native Americans, with their far different economy and their communal societies, had lived in the West for thousands of years. They were destroyed by the capitalist juggernaut and its military vanguard in less than 50 years.

Anarchist, you quoted me out of context and the most logical explanation is that you did it on purpose because you’re a jackass. — Likwidshoe

Damn straight! I can be a little disrespectful towards all of the little Eichmanns on this site at times.

Vincenzo, Likwidshoe just likes thread-jacking so he can talk about himself.

Now to the topic, Rob talks of `tough love’, but if all the lands taken from the Native Americans were given back, then they might not need govt. assistance anymore.

It’s pretty cheeky to take a whole peoples land, and when they become somewhat worse off financially, then to say that what they need is tough love, and the few crumbs of assistance to be taken away too. I’d ban Rob from my reservation if I had one too.

Well certainly you can tell a story, but knowing it’s not the complete story, is falsification in my book. Certainly Rob had to know that what he observed was not the way the majority of the reservation lives. For God’s sake he was in a housing that I would never go into alone and that’s my hometown! But instead of finding out what the majority of the reservation is like, he ran with the worst case scenarios.

Anarchist, you quoted me out of context and the most logical explanation is that you did it on purpose because you’re a jackass. You’re being dishonest. It’s either that or you’re stupid, which I don’t believe you to be. I know that’s what you would say about me, but I won’t go that low. You’re not stupid. You’re just being a jerk.

And that is how you try to win debates. It isn’t cool. It doesn’t work either.

Btw, how did this get to be about me? Why did you guys make it about me? You’re all deflecting, just like I described up above.

The whining and censorship surrounding this article is laughable. God forbid some people expect others who they are supporting to become productive or responsible. Responsible people!?! The the corrupt tribal leaders would have less money to steal and less power to claim. Then the ‘turtles’ would stop contributing to the meth problems that affect many many many people on and off the reservation. Censors merely aid and abed the corruption and the drug use by stigmatizing these observations and preventing the appropriate public dialogues. Congratulations all.
Sparkie Arbuckle on May 16, 2007 at 05:27 am

Sparkie, get with the program! What the hell do you know about tribal politics? You’re from where? PA, RI, FL, OH, CA? I just can’t seem to remember, there are so many far away places “you guys” hail from. Anyone from North Dakota care to comment about tribal/state relations? HUH?

Looks like a good read Sparkie, will peruse later though. Gotta be somewhere.

Look at him run in circles AV. It’s like watching a headless chicken.

AV doesn’t believe in property rights though. Strange…

But he would ban someone from property which can only happen if he supported private property rights.

Someone needs to sit him down and explain a few fundamental things to him.

Billions of dollars is a “few crumbs”? — Likwidshoe

How many billions, for how many years, to how many recipients?

So much for being an anarchist. Fraud. — Likwidshoe

Even if I had a reservation I could still be an anarchist. Under the current system, land has to be owned by someone or some organization, so allowing a capitalist to take ownership of my imaginary reservation would be bad, and I’d be opposed to that.

Sparkie: After extensive exchanges with AV in the past, I have concluded that he is simply another collectivist, and is either lying or simply mistaken in describing himself as an “anarchist”. Originally, he called himself “Anarchist Vegan”, and now it’s “Vegetarian”, so who knows about that one, as well?

Sparkie, Sparkie, Sparkie, evidently that marijuana your smoking, in HOlland or the US, is affecting your amygdala. You should really control your emotions a little better! Just because I don’t want to read your little blog doesn’t mean you need to curse at me! I have better things to do with my time than read the garbage you post.

IMO anarchism is a lot closer to free marketism than many of the free marketists would willingly admit.

I’ll agree with you there Sparkie. I’d also say that the reverse is true.

Robert108: I was a Vegan, but I became possessed by the devil and started eating dairy again. I still feel bad for all those poor raped cows though…

Remember – no responding.

I’ll respond instead, you twit. (I am borrowing one of your words…hope you don’t mind. But it you do, oh well!)
My dad doesn’t live in Belcourt. How does living in Belcourt mean a person is involved with drugs? Your involved with drugs. Does that mean you live in Belcourt?

For someone who tells others they shouldn’t imply or assume, you seem to do both.

lik: You are about the most PATHETIC person on here. I believe Misty was “joking” when she said that. She commented about it later. But who are you suppose to be? Oh, yeah, the straw man. I think we should write a letter to the editor and tell everyone that lik is a Private Investigator. He finds out everything about everybody. You sure have a lot of time on your hands. I mean, to quote, blog, smoke pot and all that stuff. When do you have time to work? You know, to pay all those taxes you supposedly pay? You are a loser. It is sad that you are so full of hate. But you’re not our problem, you’re your parents problem, since you still live with them. So long straw man, Go spark up a wonder joint!:P

well that didnt help

I do not appreciate my school name being given. I was having a conversation with someone who was perfectly ok with my reason for not giving my school information. I think it’s a shame that people are allowed to misuse administrative privelages on this site, yet are concerned with curse words!

If you are going to post things about me, make sure you post everything. I did say that my husband had the same two faults, but in the next post I said I was being sarcastic and that obviously Rob didn’t learn about Native humor in his 15 hours on the reservation. I’m not sure what the point was about making sure my post was #1 on google. Everyone in my life knows that I am passionate about my people and Native issues.

I do appreciate the effort in finding out more about me. It shows you have a vested interest in who I am. Thanks. I’m so glad we could handle this situation “in an adult manner”.

Who said anything about me getting a PhD at a Tech school?

Oooh, I thought we were friends Sparkie.

Melissa, all you have to do is google me to find me. Likwid made sure of that. He’s such a sweetie.

All of your questions were answered, but since you’re not interested in the answers, I’ll refrain from giving them.
likwidshoe on May 22, 2007 at 03:11 am

Since when did you ever give answers?

I smoke occasionally. If that makes me a “pothead”, then there are a lot of “potheads” out there in America. — Likwidshoe

I sorta figured that you were a pothead since many of your posts tend to quote people out of context, and the most logical explanation is that your attention span and short term memory are damaged for pot-smoking, so you simply forget the previous sentence, and hence miss the context.

Amen Sparkie!

Janel, you’ve said essentially the same thing for quite a few comments now. Maybe branch out? I don’t know. Spread your wings or something.

Misty C – I forgot that you had used your real name on the other thread. You’re the one who called white skin a “fault”, then have the nerve to label others with the racism charge while providing no evidence. A real class act…

You’re a White Republican. It’s as simple as that. (I’m not a racist either, my husband has the same two faults.)

Sparkie, she goes to the University of Minnesota. It’s all right there. Misty, nice Google line-up! That will probably be number one for awhile. That’s too bad.

A Letter to The Editor Of The Racist Canadian Article

http://www.pantribalconfederacy.com/confederacy/racist/pdf/Leah.pdf

“The Human Race: Reparation Repercussions” in
the Barbados is racist hate speech that must be pulled off the internet. It is published by the newspaper The Nation, here is the link:
http://www.nationnews.com/editorial /297343495418739 .php

This Sounds Familiar!

Genocide is defined by the University of Hawaii as:
…an international crime for which individuals, no matter how high in authority, may be indicted,tried, and punished by the International Criminal Court (ICC).
According to Article 6 of the ICC Statute, This crime
involves, any of the following acts committed with intent to destroy, in whole or in part, a national, ethnical, racial or religious group, as such:
(a) Killing members of the group;
(b) Causing serious bodily or mental harm
to members of the group;
(c) Deliberately inflicting on the group
conditions of life calculated to bring about its physical destruction in whole or in part;
(d) Imposing measures intended to prevent births within the group;
(e) Forcibly transferring children of the group to another group.

you know even if the skins got their shit together.started to acually do something about there situation with poverty. the problem would still be there. they are the most regulated people in the united states, and i dont think american people would like it even if they did. it is still bad to be an indian in this country.they would find some way to put i down or just take it away.you know it is sad that the natives are still the enemy of the country,and i would like to say that even though they are in the situation that they are in,they have managed to contribute to the making of this land ,and the country of the united states in many ways.from every war this country has ever been in the indians have been there for the fight,for or aginst.some of the military stratiges used today they got from the indians,medical use,politics with other tribes.usage of land ,crop rotation , controled burning ,you name it. they were put on land that was pretty much useless and were told to live . dont forget about exterminatin.they took on the whole know world at that time. and in them days it was indian vs. indian.one tribe would go in and wipe the other out and would sell their land they took.a couple hundrad years of war, famin,and deseise takes some time to heal ,it wont happen over nite.alot of people really dont understand that plight.the most powerful counrty today,and you still worry about the indian.the only thing that would save them is if you aloud them to come together and unite as one like theve been trying to do. let them have a say in united nations ,let them have land ,and ports for world trade,and let them make valuable tys to other countrys on an international level.remember you gave land back to the jewish people why not the redman ,the skins never broke the promises you did.

If it isn’t apparent by now that Rob has offended some members of the Turtle Mountain indigenous people, you have your head in the clouds.

Oh no! Someone got offended? Stop the presses! (Oh, wait…that’s what the tribal officials are trying to do, isn’t it?)

Everybody repeat after me: There is no Constitutional right in this country to not have one’s feelings hurt. And may there never be such a day in the history of this great nation…

And for good measure, it’s very possible for someone in a bad state of affairs to be in said state because of poor choices that he or she has made. Pointing this out is not libel or slander, and lashing out at the person who does so should be considered a “temper tantrum” as opposed to honest dialogue.

It doesn’t take an rocket surgeon to see…

Wow, this would be such an easy target if I only knew for sure that he wasn’t phrasing it that way in jest…

Rob
That sucks. Don’t worry though, that is probably the worst reaction that those ‘Turtles’ could have had. I don’t think it will do much to paint you as a racist or a defamer – in fact, it strikes me as a defamatory move on the part of the Indians. It true, it does have some racial undertones, merely because the group in question is of one race and they would rather construe it as racist instead of taking the constructive criticisms as one should and/or responsibility for their own lives and futures. Personally, if I were a ‘Turtle’, I would have responded by canvassing the countryside for welfare-receiving, irresponsible Scandinavians and written a harsh expose on the burden they pose to the community and their inability to do positive things to improve the lives of themselves and their neighbors. Next time you should visit a white community that has similar issues and include both critiques in one piece so as to avoid the ‘race’ trolls.
‘De-nial’ is not a river in Africa. You have gotten a telling response from the beginning from the group in question.

Wow. ‘Flickertail’ is one pandering tart eh? What a racist!

…the Beacon is a private newspaper right? This kind of effort to quiet Rob is only going to draw more attention to the non-racist, non-defamatory critique Rob offered. If I owned the Beacon, I would give Rob a regular column, knowing that people are gonna buy it or visit the web site to view it. This PC Maoist approach the ‘Turtles’ and the ‘Progs’ have resorted to only draws support from idiots. Most people with a functioning brain, some sense of responsibility and dignity, and independence will know exactly what Rob is getting at. Furthermore, just because the ‘delivery’ is viewed as flawed doesn’t mean much. So far, from the ‘Turtles’, we have only heard people taking issue with the style of delivery Rob used (its racist or defamatory). What about the underlying criticisms of the various systems in place and the resulting apathy, at the public’s expense? What about the corruption that prevents these systems from working in the intended manner? Is exposing wasting, child abuse, drug use, and/or corruption now racist? If I’m not mistaken, just about all of those are illegal. Are the police racists because they are critical of illegal activities? The answer is ‘yes’ – in the minds of many people, apparently. The further question is: Do the ‘Turtles’ and the ‘Progs’ really want to continue to be taken seriously? If so, I suggest they loosen up as they live in a free country, however unfortunate they consider that to be. Next there will be calls for publicly funded pushes for debate in order to manufacture sides on this issue that just don’t exist. Fact is, most people believe in free speech. Only idiots feel they should be able to say whatever they want while others don’t. Only idiots think that they alone are able to judge what is fit for public consumption and what is not.

There are grave epistemic fallacies in thinking one is that infallible or knows what is ‘right’ – whether Rob or the ‘Turtles’. No matter who, they are wrong some of the time. Saying one is always right is like saying the lottery is unwinnable. People still buy lottery tickets though. Why? Because they know sometimes the lottery is winnable. Rob provided a first person account of what he saw on the Reservation. That lottery, unfortunately, is unwinnable. Rob’s inferences of the psychologies involved are necessarily a little more winnable (the chances they are wrong increase), however Rob did not make these on a case-by-case basis – it was broad. Rob has also admitted that there are exceptions to these generalizations. In other words, one can buy a lottery ticket… Its nowhere near as fallacious as people who believe they are endowed with the type of infallibility that allows them to know what should be censored and what shouldn’t.

And Misty, Likwid used “savages” in response to the idea that it’s not safe on the reservation for me. While that word is a bit harsh, it doesn’t speak much for your community that a simple op/ed could put someone’s physical well-being in jeopardy.

Misty

We don’t want your help. Why the hell would we want help from someone who has a drug problem himself?

What the hell makes you think Lik has a drug problem?

Misty
you dont know its garbage unless you read it. remember? nursing? a phd? that dont add up. what is the institution if you dont mind my asking?

Actually, Janell, that resolution isn’t binding. There’s another committee (the exclusionary committee or something like that?) which has to review the decision and make a ruling. And the chances that I’ll actually be banned are between slim and none.

So, nice symbolic gesture that ultimately means nothing, Andy.

I’m glad you’re so excited about it though, Janel, but think about what you’re supporting for a moment:

If I go on tribal land I will (apparently) be jailed. Why? Because I expressed an opinion and wrote about facts you and many others on the reservation find inconvenient.

If you’re happy about living in a society like that then good for you, but that’s not a place I’d want to live what with me valuing things like “free speech” and stuff.

Misty
Your eyes are brown sweety, and it ain’t becoming. I will tell my kids whatever I want to. I know what I speak of. I know a few people who have used alcohol and marijuana regularly for many many years and I can say, without a doubt, that longterm alcohol abuse screws up your cognitive abilities significantly more that marijuana. Jaywalking is illegal too. BFD. I don’t sell marijuana or use it in public. I am a responsible and productive member of society. What’s the issue here? Also, for all you know I fly to Holland to use it (I do, on occasion). That ain’t illegal.

Misty
I corrected that mistake – thanks for dissing on it anyway. I’m sorry you’re not interested in being smarter, but I am. Also, as far as neural damage goes… whatever you’ve been up to is definitely worse than whatever I’m doing. On the issue of altered states and neural damage, your views are obviously maligned by a lack of knowledge and/or understanding.

what racism? someone fill me in. lets see a quote or something. this is so much crap. my god. where the fuck do these tarts come from?

really. cite the racist content. then we will proceed from there.

Misty
Respectfully, this is the silliest thing I have ever heard:

You can’t tell a story if you don’t paint a complete picture.

People who begin telling stories would never be able to stop if that was the case.

Seriously.

AV is not an anarchist (or at least an individualist anarchist – more like a socialist anarchist or a socialist libertarian, both huge oxymorons). The most fundamental objections to government anarchists have are related to certain natural rights… i.e. property rights and the lot and the fact that govvy cannot infringe on those by forming. AV doesn’t believe in property rights though. Strange…

Misty
You didn’t read my fucking post. What the hell do you know about it?

It is not your community. So you shuold really just mind your own business. Why do you caer?

Because I don’t like seeing people suffer.

The bigger question is: Why don’t you care?

I am 99.9 % sure that your community has drugs and crimes, why deny it?

I don’t deny it, but my community doesn’t have crime and drugs and poverty on anywhere near the scale the TM reservation does. And even if my community did, would it excuse the conditions in Belcourt?

No. That wouldn’t be logical.

I think that you stretched the truth a whole lot.

No, I didn’t actually. And you just said in another thread that you didn’t dispute anything I wrote in that column.

Way to stay consistent.

Rob: Just answer the question…What are you doing to resolve the problems here? Again, all talk, no action.

You and some of the others here who have been critical of me keep asking that. Well, let me tell you: It’s not my community.

I could live my life comfortably without giving a second thought to the drug-and-crime addled reservation communities. I could go from day to day without giving a single thought to the crippling poverty in Belcourt. I certainly could have spared myself all the trouble this column has caused me.

But I didn’t do those things. I spoke up. I called attention to what I saw. Now, what are you doing to change things? Because it’s your community, not mine.

I remember bringing up the fact that people get banned from the reservation and Rob told me if he got banned there would be serious consequences?

When did I say that there would be serious consequences if I got banned?

And Misty, I’m not banned from the reservation. The tribal council passed a resolution, yes, but all reservation bans must go through the Exclusion Ordinance Board. They must have a hearing, I must be served with a notice of that hearing, and I must be afforded an opportunity to attend that meeting (with legal counsel if I wish it) and present evidence.

This is per Title 39.0110 of the tribal code.

The resolution the tribal council passed was, in effect, meaningless.

Again, free speech, if you would. You can say what you want, you can have your opinions, but we can’t? Well what the f?

When did I say that you can’t say what you want? You can say whatever you want as far as I’m concerned and guess what…I’ll never support you getting banned from anywhere because of what you say.

Because I believe in free speech.

As for your Governor banning me from “your” land? Actually, YOU don’t have any land! It was taken from the Native Americans unlawfully, and you know it, dude.

Janel, just answer the question: How would you feel if the Gov. told you to stay on the reservation because of something you wrote?