Page 110—Section 222(e) requires the use of federal dollars to fund abortions through the government-run health plan—and, if the Hyde Amendment were ever not renewed, would require the plan to fund elective abortions.

Let’s look at this provision now. There is already a law on the public funding of abortions. All the health care plan does is say that it will abide by the law at the time of claim. The fact that the current law allows for public funding of abortions in certain circumstances, such as health of the mother, is something that is appropriate and most Americans would agree with.

Page 94—Section 202(c) prohibits the sale of private health insurance policies, beginning in 2013, forcing individuals to purchase coverage through the federal government.

Public Option? Should be called a public mandate.

fascism, need I say it's also unconstitutional?

NO! to the tyrrany of high taxes! NO! to the tyrrany of Government control! NO! NO! NO!

Wanna bury our politicians up to their necks in the sun, pour honey over their heads, and let the ants get 'em? YES! YES! YES!

Beat me to it – I was just going to post the same clip from the bill. Of course it all depends on the meaning of Exchange in lawyer speak doesn't it? I mean, who is this Exchange? By whose authority are they the ones who approve what is acceptable coverage?

The fact that you're grandfathered before Y1 is a crock to! If you lose your coverage for ANY reason, your only choice then is an Exchange approved plan.

Lioncourt:

(1) IN GENERAL.—Individual health insurance

4 coverage that is not grandfathered health insurance

5 coverage under subsection (a) may only be offered

6 on or after the first day of Y1 as an Exchange-par7

ticipating health benefits plan.

Would it kill YOU to actually look up what's in the bill?

For one thing that does not say what Rob claims. You are not purchasing insurance from the government.

And BTW, read the next sentence of the bill.

Exchange is the government organ Lc. It mandates what the insurance must be.

Minimum coverage is going to be mandated and I am not opposed to that. But to say that private insurance is banned is incorrect. There is no grasping at straws. There is what the bill says and what it doesn't say. And what Rob claims is not what the bill says.

Are the plans going to be "purchased through the federal government" as you claim or not?

Why didn't you give attribution from where you took this analysis from?

Lioncourt, whether the plan is purchased directly through the government, or whether it's purchased through a government sponsored entity, is really a distinction without meaning. Sorry. Rob's right, you're wrong. Same thing with page 110. It clearly allows government funding for abortions.

And the very nature of tyranny is to compel a man to furnish funds for purposes he finds abhorrent. This is a tyrannical bill, and hopefully it will remind moderates why it's utter insanity to vote for Democrats.

So in the very first sentence of the post when I say that these are some "fun facts about the health care bill sent in by readers"…you didn't understand that?

No wonder you can't understand what the bill actually says either.

Let me tell you something about blogging. It's like crowd-sourcing reporting. Bloggers take information from readers and commenters and other bloggers and traditional media sources and synthesize it into posts with information.

Now, you can agree or disagree with my conclusions, but your pouting here seems to have less to do with facts than you just not liking me or my politics.

In short, maybe you should grow up.

I never claimed this was my analysis. I said this was something sent in by readers.

And it's true, for all the attempts to muddy the waters by questioning the source of the analysis rather than its accuracy.

Ford is reported to have once said that a consumer can have a car in any color as long as it is black.
Private insurance is not banned, but it will effectively be forced out of existence. Hence the only insurance you can "choose" from, will be government's.

In short this bill is an assault on constitution, just because something is passed through legislature by marxists does not make it right. There will be hell to pay on election days for anyone who votes for it.

And it's true, for all the attempts to muddy the waters by questioning the source of the analysis rather than its accuracy.

Page 94—Section 202(c) prohibits the sale of private health insurance policies, beginning in 2013, forcing individuals to purchase coverage through the federal government.

This statement is not true and your attempts to say that it is essentially the same thing does not make it true. If it was my decision it would be true because I would go with single payer health care and eliminate medical insurance.

This statement is not true and your attempts to say that it is essentially the same thing does not make it true.

Forcing Americans to buy health insurance only through the government is not private insurance.

Sorry, Lioncourt, but just because you want it the other way doesn't mean its true.

that's pretty much it.

So Lion, people post facts and paragraphs from the bill and you spout "nu uh". Am I caught up so far?

No I just point out that there interpretation of what it says is not what it says. Nowhere in section 202(c) does it say that you must purchase insurance through the federal government by 2013, yet that is what Rob claimed it said.

Nowhere in section 202(c) does it say that you must purchase insurance through the federal government by 2013, yet that is what Rob claimed it said.

Do you think that Aetna (a FL health care provider) can compete with the Federal Government with plans where they are forced to provide the same or better level of service? Why would anyone choose anyone other than the Government, who will charge less than the real cost due to public pressure to do so.

After 2013 we will be forced to by a plan that conforms to the same standards that the Fed Govt has… whatever arbitrary standards those may be.

Someone needs to give you a clue-bat.

Law of the Land – When was abortion voted on. That's the problem with your interpretation, Dem/Libs don't require democracy to chage law. You need only appoint as many activist judges as possible and they can legislate from the bench. If you think you can believe Democrats when they speak just rmember – if their lips are moving they are lying. (That's must be modified for Dem ventriloquists)

LC jsut drink the Kool-aid. Curious timing for laws to take effect. I guess it would ruin Obama's re-election chances if the people saw this legislation take effect before the next presidential election. How many people will die while Dems dither on this issue. Obama Dithers and People die. Health care, Afghanistan, Economy-Hope and Change ain't working so well is it? Dithers is a word with gravitas – don't you agree?

How many people will die while Dems dither on this issue.

I am glad to see that you agree that as long as the current system is in effect people will die. I agree that Obama should work faster on dismantling the current system.

Suppose that the Government hires a team of Actuaries that devises a revenue neutral plan. Blue Cross is free to offer the same plan or better, for, likely, more cost.

Anyone currently with a BCBS plan is free to stay with it, but since BCBS cannot keep a static plan each year due to changes in their costs, the plans change so then the people cannot stay "grandfathered" on their existing plan.

There is no way that the Government plan can stay revenue neutral as political pressure will force the cost to the lower payed consumer lower, and raising the cost to the higher wage earners will result in them choosing the BCBS plan, thus the Government will run a deficit and supplement the cost from taxes. Once the Government is comfortable with running a deficit (like they aren't already) they will reduce the cost of the plans to the higher end consumers, which will dry up demand for the private sector plans (BCBS and others).

Once BCBS is out of business, the Government will have a monopoly on health insurance with the power of a gun to force the people to pay into the plan. Higher wage earners will supplement the cost of the low wage earners, until the cost of the low wage earners exceeds the amount possible to collect from upper wage earners.

By that time upper wage earners will have determined a way of making money that is not taxed… or will have left the US for fairer soils.

Meanwhile, Doctors, who spend ten + years learning their trade while building mountains of debt from school, will not get paid enough to cover the costs and will leave the system or new people will not enter the field.

All because you needed to have your Government run health care system…

I'm sure you statists will have no idea what I'm talking about here… I pray that you don't have to learn what I'm describing first hand… but at least, if you do, you'll finally get it.

I am glad to see that you agree that as long as the current system is in effect people will die

He's talking about our troops in Afghanistan, fool. While Congress dibbles with a non-crisis, a real crisis is going on in a foreign land.

Next up on Congress's list of Crisis's is global warming… They have to hurry on that one… it's been unseasonably cool and people might start to notice.

So your claiming that the bill won't require people to buy insurance through government health care exchanges?

Because that is what the bill actually says.

I can almost understand the blind denial of Lioncourt, but the sheer hubris of TheTodd is astonishing. He has the gall to post the actual text of the bill, and then claim it doesn't say what it says. That's a special kind of lying that even LC doesn't jave the stones to try.

How is that different from Rob's bias and I am not the one lying. Purchasing insurance from private insurers that are offered through the health care exchange is not banning private insurance or purchasing insurance through the federal government.

A free market (private) system is one in which individuals are free to enter or exit the market (h/t R108).

If the government controls who may choose to sell insurance, and if you have to purchase it through the government, by definition, it's no longer a privately held and operated market, hence not "private".

You can continue with your monotonous litany about how this exchange system is an exemplar of private industry now.

In spite the odds, health care is very important. It's one consolation for life's hard work especially to the lowly workers.