On Cap And Trade, What About The 95% Of Americans Who Weren’t Supposed To Get A Tax Hike?

While campaigning, Obama promised tax cuts for “95% of Americans.” Shortly after being elected President, Obama noisily promised that nobody in America making under $250,000/year would pay a dime more in federal taxes.
But now Obama is backing a cap and trade carbon tax, and that tax just passed the House. If the Senate passes it as well (click here to contact your Senators and tell them it shouldn’t) businesses across the nation would have to purchase permission from the government to emit carbon.
And since pretty much all businesses emit carbon, that amounts to a tax on just about every business in America.
Now, the liberals will no doubt tell you that this is just regulation, and that the payments for carbon credits are just a fee, but is something you pay to the government to be used as revenue because the government makes you do it not a tax? And if all Americans end up paying higher utility bills, and higher prices for goods and services, thanks to this new tax are they not the ones being taxed?
The liberals will play their usual rhetorical games with this. They’ll that it is not a tax, but rather a fee. They’ll say that even if it were a tax, only the “polluters” will be paying it and not all Americans (even though, again, we’ll all be paying higher prices for goods, services and energy). But here’s reality.
In 2008 Obama himself said that cap and trade would cause electricity prices to “necessarily skyrocket.”


Last time I checked, most of us pay an electric bill. Obama also said that cap and trade would probably bankrupt coal power plants:

Last time I checked, coal was the cheapest form of electricity available and supplied the power for roughly 51% of our national power grid.
The trucks that bring our food to the grocery stores emit carbon. The factories that make our cars and gadgets emit carbon. The plants that make our fuel emit carbon. The laboratories that crank out the prescription drugs emit carbon. The delivery vehicles that bring our online purchases to our front doorsteps emit carbon.
This is a tax on everything. You will be paying more for it (roughly 2% of your household income, according to the Tax Foundation, or $3,000 – $4,000/year according to MIT).
And Obama is already counting the revenues from it in his budget.

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  • e4bannan

    Little dino just makes things up.

    He certainly swung for the fence with that number.

    Before deregulation we were a captive audience. We had only one provider and we paid what we were told to pay. And the rates were different all over the state. Someone in San Antonio would pay significantly less than what I was paying. But since dereg I have dozens of providers competing for my business. But if you want to pay too much you still can. Just choose a provider that offers green energy.

  • sayanything-2407

    "Hope & Change"

    "Yes We Can"

    "I Won"

    Gives all new meaning to this administration.

  • RJ Richards

    It sickens me Rob. It is more important than ever for all of us to encourage participation by others. I've personally been working on a co-worker and my own mother to pick up the phone or get to typing. This bill passing shows the extremes that the Pelosi gang will go to destroy this country. I'm literally sick.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/america_is_back/#c397018 DINO

    The only reason electricity is cheap is because of REGULATION. Go find out what happened when Texas deregulated electricity. Texans now pay 40 TIMES more than the national average.

    Report: Texas electricity rates have soared since deregulation

    <a href='http://www.reuters.com/article/pressRelease/idUS102274+13-Apr-2009+BW20090413'>Texas Mayors Urge Legislature to Fix Electricity Deregulation Faults

    I hope the republicans of Texas are sitting in puddles of sweat because they can't afford their air conditioners. FUCK EM.

  • http://proof-proofpositive.blogspot.com/ proof_positive

    The only reason electricity is cheap is because of REGULATION. Go find out what happened when Texas deregulated electricity.

    Dino: Look what happened in California when Grey Davis and the Dems deregulated parts of the electrical industry! Can you say…"price gouging"?

  • Halatbis

    Yesterday, June 26, was a disaster for the United States in many ways: we have legislation dictating what we are allowed to do, buy, drive, eat, sell, etc. The federal government has taken the first step in a massive power grab to control us completely.
    This Cap and Trade is not Obama's agenda alone–it is the Democrat House and Senate as well.
    Coming next is the overhaul of healthcare—then comes the topper for it all: The union payback—EFCA.

  • e4bannan

    Texans now pay 40 TIMES more than the national average.

    What is the national average? I'm in Texas and my last electric bill was $147.76. And that's with TXU. One of the most expensive providers in the state. Because of deregulation I can switch providers whenever I want. So I did just that this month. I did the math and that same bill would have been $93.74 with my new provider. I find it very hard to believe I'm paying 40 times the national average.

  • pparets

    Texans now pay 40 TIMES more than the national average.

    Dino, like all liberals, depends on grossly inflated numbers – MILLIONS of homeless, MILLIONS of poor, GLOBAL TEMPERATURES, MILLIONS of persecuted gays, etc… to bolster an otherwise vapid point.

    Let's see here: If the national average for electricity by the month was $50; then by Dino's calculation, Texans would be paying $2,000 a month. HAHAHAHAHA!

    Is anyone in Portland as stupid as you are, Dino?

  • robert108

    I find it very hard to believe I'm paying 40 times the national average.

    Little dino just makes things up. Again, if you want the benefits of deregulation, you have to deregulate supply, so the price can reflect the relationship between supply and demand; if prices are too high, more supply will be called forth, and the prices will come down. Regulation is always the villain. As we saw with ENRON, partial deregulation doesn't work.

  • http://www.rabidamerican.net/ Rabid American

    NEVER AGAIN!

    <img src='http://i41.tinypic.com/epn0k8.jpg'&gt;

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/america_is_back/#c397018 DINO

    That should be 40 percent, not 40 times.

    Since Deregulation, Texas Utility Rates Have Soared

    In the decade since Texas deregulated its retail electricity market, rates have skyrocketed higher than any other state with such open competition, according to a report released Monday.
    Commissioned by the Cities Aggregation Power Project, a nonprofit coalition of Texas municipalities, the report found that residential electricity rates rose 64 percent between 1999 and 2007. Before that, Texans paid rates that were well below the national average, according to the U.S. Energy Information Administration.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/america_is_back/#c397018 DINO

    You still pay 40% more than you did before deregulation. Watch for phase II of deregulation, consolidation when the big boys buy up all the others and you end up with a monopoly able to charge you whatever it wants.

    But enjoy paying through the nose for air conditioning. Enjoy your free-market, sweaty humidity, republican.

  • robert108

    Dumb little dino: pay more or have shortages, unless you let market forces determine supply. That means no more govt controlled electricity.

  • sayanything-6955

    Id be willing to bet those of us who are working are paying part of Dinos electric bill,Im quite sure he is one of those bloodsuckers that needs a taxpayer to help him out.But thats what he voted for and got,unfortunately there are fewer of us left to pay for his marxist crap.

  • jimmypop

    Again, if you want the benefits of deregulation, you have to deregulate supply, so the price can reflect the relationship between supply and demand;

    well said

    dinorob tend to purposely miss lots of facts.

  • http://insanereindeer.blogspot.com/ Kenny

    That should be 40 percent, not 40 times.

    That's a massive difference. And given your ALL CAPS emphasis on times, it seems an unlikely mistake to make.

    Of course this ignores the fact that the state was paying a large portion of the bill before, keeping rates low. Much like comparing public vs private school, the meter of "how much people pay out of pocket" is not the same as "how much it costs". Ignoring this is deliberately deceptive.

  • http://insanereindeer.blogspot.com/ Kenny

    You still pay 40% more than you did before deregulation. Watch for phase II of deregulation, consolidation when the big boys buy up all the others and you end up with a monopoly able to charge you whatever it wants.

    So wait. Now it changes again. 40% higher costs vs 40% higher than the national average is also a massive difference.

    Not that Dino gets that.

  • Bat One

    With the nation's unemployment rate rapidly closing in on 10% (and still heading north) do Obama and the Democrats really think its a good idea to put the coal industry out of business? Or the railroads that carry the coal? Or the heavy equipment manufacturers that make the mining machinery? Or the Utility plants that use the coal to generate electric power? Or the steel manufacturers who also use coal? Or the chemical companies that use it as well?

    If only half the people employed in those industries are laid off, not to mention the businesses that will close because they cannot afford higher electric bills, we could be looking at 15% unemployment just in time for the 2010 mid-term elections.

    Are Democrats really this stupid?

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    Since Deregulation, Texas Utility Rates Have Soared

    And you assume that they rise because of greed and not because the cost of providing power has gone up?

    Look what happens when the government caps power prices. Everyone pays less for power, but what you get is rationed. Like the "rolling blackouts" in California from years ago.

    You cannot provide an unlimited supply of something on a finite budget.

  • http://insanereindeer.blogspot.com/ Kenny

    The purpose of government shouldn't be to do good, but simply to refrain from doing evil.

    Like the new sig Rob.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    Like the new sig Rob.

    Yeah, I've had it for a couple of weeks I think. It's actually from Robert Heinlein.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/america_is_back/#c397018 DINO

    If the meteoric rise in Texas rates was due to the rising cost of providing power, we would seen rates rise ACROSS THE BOARD.

    We didn't. And there's no shortages.

    In fact, the chaepest power is provided by PUBLICLY OWNED UTILITIES.

    You people will never learn. Even as your ideas fuck you HARD you still follow them off the cliff. Pure insanity.

  • zappatrust

    What will we tell our grandchildren about the "Gang of Three", Obama/Pelosi/Reid… ?
    We are all now officially living In a third world country, thanks to the passage by the House of bill HR-2454 yesterday. I can't wait to get re-trained for my new "green" job but I am having a little difficulty deciding which job would be more rewarding. On one hand oiling the gears of my neighborhood windmill sounds peaceful enough but being involved in the manufacture of energy-efficient light bulbs or washing solar panels on rooftops could be a lot more fulfilling. It really doesn't matter to much, I mean even though none of those jobs pay very well, the Obama administration has promised loads of government checks in the form of rebates or tax credits if I can't pay my utility bills.

  • sayanything-5371

    Global warming is a liberal hoax. They are imposing the cap and trade as another energy tax. My prediction is that liberals will impose tyranny until there is a revolution. Liberals have no grasp of history and how past events provide a predictable outcome for the future.

    We are now in the Apathy to Dependence Stage of our civilization.

    The average age of the world's greatest civilizations from the beginning of history has been about 200 years. During those 200 years, these nations always progressed through the following sequence:

    From bondage to spiritual faith;
    From spiritual faith to great courage;
    From courage to liberty;
    From liberty to abundance;
    From abundance to complacency;
    From complacency to apathy;
    From apathy to dependence;
    From dependence back into bondage.

  • brain trust

    We are supposed to listen to what he says and not pay attention to what he does.

    The Liberal's Golden Rule – We must all suffer equally!

  • realist

    you end up with a monopoly able to charge you whatever it wants.

    Exactly – that's why we don't want gov't run health care.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/america_is_back/#c397018 DINO

    But you'll be seeing a government funded health care insurance plan very soon.

    If the private insurers can't compete, FUCK EM.

  • Socks

    Those powers not specifically granted to the Federal Government are reserved for the States and Individuals. The power to provide healthcare or insurance is not in the Constitution.

    The Government has no business trying to compete with the free market. If it did, the Soviet Union would have won the Cold War.

  • robert108

    But you'll be seeing a government funded health care insurance plan very soon.

    Wrong, little dino; taxpayer funded.

    When someone can just reach into your paycheck for all the money they need, and aren't responsible to operate with price efficiency, there is no competition. There's no level playing field with the greedy govt.

  • navtechie

    FUck off Dino:

    Residential Electric Price Offers Falling in Texas; Consumers Support Competition
    Competitive electricity markets continue producing strong customer value nationwide
    Texas
    Released: February 9, 2009
    Texas residential electric price offers have fallen by more than 28 percent since July 2008, when natural gas prices were at an all time high, according to recent reviews. Texas serves as the most recent example of how competitive electricity markets across the nation are continuing to outperform monopoly structures.

    "Texas continues to raise the standard by providing real benefits to customers, illustrating how competition clearly outpaces monopoly structures in pricing, in addition to other metrics like the development of renewable energy. Because competitive markets respond faster to price signals, customers in these markets see reductions in their rates much more quickly than in monopoly markets, and Texas is a great example of how this works," said Joel Malina, executive director of the COMPETE Coalition, an advocacy organization representing more than 280 electricity customers, suppliers, generators and other stakeholders.

    Texas has developed a properly structured competitive market that benefits customers. This conclusion was determined by three recent reports, one by the Analysis Group and two by the Energy Retailer Research Consortium. These studies reviewed the qualitative and quantitative attributes of Texas' competitive market, and combined to find that Texas has several key attributes: low barriers to entry, many buyers and sellers resulting in many choices for consumers, transparency of prices and options and large investment in generation and transmission — including leading the nation in renewable wind generation.

    Among the other merits of a competitive market is its ability to spur economic growth. According to the Texas-based Perryman Group, competition has led to the development of more than 41,000 megawatts of new electricity generation, an investment of $36.5 billion in ERCOT and another $5.8 billion spent on transmission infrastructure.

    "Texas has clearly embraced competition and its energy customers are among the most supportive, demonstrating their preference for restructured markets," Malina said.

    Texans have voiced overwhelming support for competition, according to a poll released in November of 2008 indicating that nearly 80 percent of Texas energy customers favor the current competitive structure of the Texas electricity market. The poll, conducted by the Texas-based Baselice & Associates, further indicated that support for competition escalates when Texans learn that the competitive market encourages investment in power plants using diverse fuel sources.

    "Right now, the nation needs the power of competition to meet our energy challenges. Transitioning back to a monopoly structure would be taking a critical step backward," Malina said. "The economy is suffering and the relief that consumers desperately need is only found through the competitive market forces that place downward pressure on prices and increase reliability. The monopoly model has failed us before, to the tune of several billion dollars — a hefty price that we can't afford to pay right now."

    A study by the NorthBridge Group released in December of 2008 warns against turning back the clock on electricity restructuring, highlighting the pitfalls of the monopoly response to the energy crisis of the 1970s and the resulting $200 billion mistake that befell consumers. The report also indicates that the response and the inherent flaws of the monopoly model are still being felt, decades later.

    "Competition is and always has been the driver of innovation and progress," Malina said. "Texas energy consumers, and consumers nationwide, are seeing reductions in their rates much more quickly than monopoly markets because competitive markets respond faster to price signals.

  • navtechie
  • navtechie

    And a final fuck off Dino:

    We pay lower electricity rates in the northern states because Air conditioners pull harder on the grid than electric heating.

    Controlled monopoly rates in states such as Arizon/California range anywhere from 18-24c per kWh on peak, 5-10c off peak.

    whereas in Texas prices range anywhere from 9.9 to 13.1 per kWh. Note: Something the Texas system has is a "true cost" per hour charge. the 9.9c you pay for the kWh includes all fees involved, thus you are getting your -actual- cost per kWh. Take away the fees and you have a kWh charge approaching 7-8c per kWh.

    Hell, you even have the CHOICE of picking which company you want based on their percentage of renewable energy they generate with. One company, YEP, is 100% renewable and their rates are 2-3c higher than the others…but you have a choice to use them if you "want to go green".

    But, Dino, we all know you are a Little Joe in training so facts mean nothing to you. Piss on the people, you are getting your way and fuck the rest of em. You will be in power and that is all that matters….let them eat cake.

    As I said many days ago: Your kind are the first to have two new orifices added to their cranial container when the shit hits the fan.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/homosexuality_is_wrong_-_a_compendium move_zig

    We can be pretty certain that the price of energy is going to be artificially inflated by the Dims in Congress. What they are doing is finding a necessity of life, and then standing athwart it, demanding a huge fee for what we were paying less before. Kinda like the troll under the bridge.

    To pass this indirect huge, hidden tax increase, they need an equally huge LIE. That LIE is Global Warming (I don't think I need to convince anyone here about that) But one thing LIEs can't stand is the truth. And thus, it comes as no surprise that the Left are feverishly trying to stuff the truth down the Memory Hole:

    EPA Suppressing Report That Questions Global Warming

  • LoadTheMule

    Typical Dino rant (is there any other kind?):

    Blah. Blah, ba blah, blah…stems. Blah blah ba blah blah…conservative scum. Blah ba blah ba blah ba blah blah…hope you die. Blah ba ba blah, ba ba blah, blah blah blah…liberals rule! Blah ba blah, ba blah, ba BLAH…I take it up the ass.

    ad infinitum

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/homosexuality_is_wrong_-_a_compendium move_zig

    NavTech,

    Wouldn't you rather just see this?

    Post by Dino removed

    Very cool.

    H/T Suite

  • http://proof-proofpositive.blogspot.com/ proof_positive

    We can be pretty certain that the price of energy is going to be artificially inflated by the Dims in Congress.

    Just got back from Hawaii, and noticed that the price of gas in California (which is traditionally higher than the rest of the continental US) is 40 to 60 cents less per gallon than I paid in Hawaii this AM.
    Considering the amount of food and goods that must be shipped in to the islands by sea or air, the price of energy going up may hit Hawaiians the hardest! And their economy is none too robust as it is!
    It would be ironic if Obama's "adopted home state" were to suffer first or hardest (or both) because of Barry O's Economic Amateur Hour!

  • http://insanereindeer.blogspot.com/ Kenny

    In fact, the chaepest power is provided by PUBLICLY OWNED UTILITIES.

    Again, it is not. Measuring something by the cost paid only by the consumer, when the government pays in vs an only consumer paid system distorts the real price.

    Public school costs parents nothing out of pocket…but it certainly isn't free. It costs more than double the amount of private schools per student.

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