Obama Wants A Bailout For The Auto Industry

• November 11, 2008

A liberal friend of mine emailed me this link about Obama supporting a bailout for the auto industry and asked, “Why is ‘socialist’ Obama supporting big business?”
My answer: Because Obama and the Democrats aren’t really supporting the bailout for the sake of Ford and General Motors. They’re supporting the bailout for the sake of the union parasites who have attached themselves to automakers like Ford and General Motors.
Which is a bit like putting someone afflicted by a tape worm on life support rather than just removing the tape worm.
Union enrollment has been declining in this country for years now, and unions are getting desperate. This is a big reason why their Democrat puppets are going to cram card check – which removes secret balloting from the labor organizing process – down our throats under President Obama. All the better to bully workers into going union. It’s also why the unions want to bailout the autoworkers.
If Ford and/or GM go under, or even if they don’t go under but have to seriously reduce overhead to stay afloat, the autoworker unions are going to lose out. Big time. Lay offs will remove dues-paying union members from the rolls, and market share lost to foreign automakers that don’t have unionized labor forces isn’t going to do anything to help shore it back up.
Ultimately what would be best for this country as a whole is if the automakers had to either face the music and improve their business model (removing union parasites would be a huge first step) or go out of business to be replaced by automakers with better business models (that undoubtedly wouldn’t include union parasites). It would be rough in the short term to be sure, but in the long term taxpayers would benefit from not having to prop up failing corporate giants for the sake of keeping the unions that are killing them alive.
Sadly, I’m willing to bet that Democrats do what’s best for the unions instead of what’s best for the country.

Tags: Domestic Issues, Politics

http://Array robert108

Easy for you to say

It’s the way markets work; you had to go back to the FDR depression for the picture. FDR froze the economy out of fear(thus preventing growth and the ability to expand business and hire more people).
robert108

Give them a share of the bankrupt companies to save.

They have already been overpaid and underworked.
http://drudgereport.com/ FHJR

Thanks Robert. I think I now have a better Idea of where I stand with regards to unions. After listening to you discuss the topic with wolf, it is pretty obvious which argument makes more sense and is more logical… NOT wolfs.
http://www.DesertConservative.com/ Lee S Gliddon Jr

Let’s face it. The Automakers were forced into UAW contracts that made them pay for outlandish retirement and healthcare plans for their employees. This is the money they are seeking!

Well, let them close! Let UAW swirl in the toilet and go down the drain right along with the idiots that kow-towed to their outlandish pension/healthcare demands.

A little know fact about working for an automaker. If they lay you off you continue recieving your FULL SALARY! Go to work elsewhere and YOUR SALARY WITH the automake CONTINUES!

Toyota, NISSAN, VW and othwer impoorted vehicles will be built in America and fill the gap!
robert108

FHJR: Unions exist to fix the price and supply of labor at higher than market levels. Furthermore, they enforce work rules that impede productivity. Then, there are the pension funds that get looted by the ruling elite, and the forced support for leftie politicians…
http://drudgereport.com/ FHJR

My undestanding of unions is that they support fair wages and protect hard working individuals from being fired or mistreated by their employer. They seem like a pretty good thing. My understanding is also very limited so i was wondering if anyone could further explain the downside to unionization.
ollie-B

As I have said before, we should not bail out the auto industry or the banks or the mortage houses. Failure could be a GOOD thing at this time in our history.
robert108

Oh, and then there’s “collective bargaining”, which gives them an unfair advantage at the negotiating table. Unions want to abolish secret ballots, so that they can intimidate workers into joining. Both that and “collective bargaining” are unAmerican.
robert108

See how many voluteers you’ll be getting.

As has already been pointed out, the foreign automakers have no trouble getting workers who don’t want to be enslaved by the unions. Typical ignorant leftie, Os.
Mike

Where were all the arguements when we gave $150 Billion to a company that has 4k workers, and produce nothing. Instead we want to fight like hell…..in principle to say to Hell with the auto industry. Sure we need to have strings attached, but to say screw them. Is just STUPID. Do you think the 13 million workers that jobs are related to this industry….will pay their mortages, or frekin buy anything?
Wrong time for the moral stand. If and when we start to recover from this mess, the money we collect from the theives will probably pay the auto loans back. 2 Billion people on earth make $1.00 a day…..Ask the Soviet Union how they financed their war machine without an Economy…opps, their gone. Wake up!
Oswaldo

My husband is a retired worker from Ford. Yes the pay and benefits were excellent—but he worked very hard

.
The less you pay workers and the fewer their advantages, the less incentive they’ll have to work as hard as Irene’s hubby. The problem with the auto industry is the incompetent overpaid management, not the unions. CEOs are the real cancer, along with the Republican Party’s excessive laissez-faire and partisan maneuvering. We’ve managed to cut out most of the GOP rot, now it’s time to get at the creeping CEO metastasis.
Irene Howard

I understand the concern about bailing out the GM, Ford and Crysler. But if they go belly up–so do a lot of others. Just think of all the materials they use–those companies could go under too. Have to also think about the tricker down effect. I don’t really have an answer. My husband is a retired worker from Ford. Yes the pay and benefits were excellent—but he worked very hard.
robert108

Os: Do you support socialism or not? Is your BDS so bad that you can’t support that which you love so dearly, just because the wrong guy did it? Hypocrisy much?
By your own standards, then, you should love President Bush; why don’t you? Why all the hatin’?
B. Dammann

The People voted for this idiocy, now we have it.
Unions have bean a growing cancer in the U.S.A. and now the foolish sect has chosen to feed this hideous cancer.

America, it is time for radical surgery to remove this hideous parasitic cancer; yes, my fellow Americans, it will hurt for a bit but unlike keeping the unions (cancer) alive, healing can happen if we cut out this cancer, not bail it out.

Let’s support real Americans by giving them, and us- the ones who pay the price, the opportunity to not be regulated to death by excessive high prices and low quality,due to unions.

Support America– BUST THE UNIONS!!
Posted by an American who appreciates real working,thinking and creative American workers.
http://sayanythingblog.com/ likwidshoe

Oswaldo – Sure. Next time you or yours are in need of a job and are able to find one in the auto industry, make sure you refuse any union coverage or advantages.

Been there, tried to do that, couldn’t do that.

I wasn’t allowed freedom of association in Michigan because it isn’t a right to work state. It’s a union thug state where membership is mandatory at shops that have been taken over by the goons.

And, I’m sure you’ll love this part, the rules stated that we had to pay union dues for a year before we had representation, which came out to just over 500 bucks. Can you say thuggery? Not that you care, seeing as how you’re consistently against freedom.

Tell your boss you’ve got your principles and you don’t mind getting paid less than the union workers. If you prefer a lower salary, you could even form of a group with other non-union workers to fight the union and wage increases.

That’s just stupid shit talk.

In any regard, what good is a high wage if the job disappears because of that high wage?

That question requires logic and should be rhetorical, so no need to answer.
robert108

If any of your pro-union claims are true, why is union membership declining, and why are foreign automakers located in the US beating the pants off of the unionized domestic automakers?

Again, unions exist to fix the price and supply of labor at higher than market levels. That creates inefficiency.
The facts are not on your side here, Os.
Oswaldo

Union enrollment is declining. Unions are desperate for membership. That’s why they want to bail out the status quo in Detroit. That’s why they want to prevent workers from voting on whether or not they want to join a union

According to Professor Harley Shaiken of the University of California-Berkeley, [1] unions are associated with higher productivity, lower employee turnover, improved workplace communication, and a better-trained workforce.

UNIONS ARE GOOD

Shaiken is not alone. There is a lot of reliable literature out there on the benefits of unions and unionization to employers and the economy:
Productivity
Competitiveness
Product or service delivery and quality
Training
Turnover
Solvency of the firm
Workplace health and safety
Economic development
http://claude.betancourt.us/blog/ Claude

The One also expects Bush to sign all this into law before he exits. I say leave it to the messiah to handle so hr can put it on his resume.
Mickey

The unions voted for Obama, let Obama deal with this mess.

Under Obama you can expect unions to grow from 9% to 15% in three years because of Card Check.

The investment market is frozen right now because of Obama. There is NO incentive for investors to plan for the future because Obama wants to raise capital gains tax.

Class Warfare works. karl marx loves ya baby.
robert108

Which is it, “laissez-faire” or “partisan maneuvering”? Again, you contradict yourself. As a Marxist, you hold the false belief that only workers create value, but without the capital and capital equipment, no cars would be made. It is the province of companies in private enterprise how much to pay their workers, not the govt’s. You favor totalitarian socialism, which is no surprise to me.
Unions exist to fix the price and supply of labor at higher than market values. They rip off the buyers of those autos, and disadvantage the unionized automakers in the market, which is why the foreign automakers are eating their lunch. Your incentive bullshit is refuted by the fact that the non unionized automakers have no problem getting all the workers they need, and are also more efficient producers than the unionized ones. The facts are not on your side here, as usual.
robert108

Thanks! Glad to be of help.
Oswaldo

“Why is â€˜socialist’ Obama supporting big business?”

The outgoing GOP administration is responsible for the greatest socialization our country has ever witnessed with the nationalizing of banks and insurance interests.
And you call Obama a socialist? Did you see how McCain — who opposed Bush’s tax cuts in 2001 — boasted about halting his campaign to run to Washington and help implement the comrade Bush’s nationalization process.
I think we should seek advice from Russia and China to make sure we don’t screw up the process.
robert108

This is no longer the early years when workers were treated like slaves.

Leftie mythology.
Oswaldo

Thanks Robert. I think I now have a better Idea of where I stand with regards to unions. After listening to you discuss the topic with wolf, it is pretty obvious which argument makes more sense and is more logical… NOT wolfs

Sure. Next time you or yours are in need of a job and are able to find one in the auto industry, make sure you refuse any union coverage or advantages. Tell your boss you’ve got your principles and you don’t mind getting paid less than the union workers. If you prefer a lower salary, you could even form of a group with other non-union workers to fight the union and wage increases. See how many voluteers you’ll be getting.
Good luck.
http://www.rabidamerican.net/ Rabid American

“Obama Wants A Bailout For The UAW”

There, got that for ya……

The demmies owe the unions big time for this last election.

I can foresee the auto manufacturers being allowed to go to the brink of bankruptcy. Only then will a government bailout happen.

Could you imagine the coming administration nationalizing the automotive industry, with the caveat that the unions will be put in charge of the companies? A bit extreme, but possible…

A more likely scenario would be that a bailout would be under the oversight of the UAW…. control over the board of directors and supplanting executive management…

A good setup for “Card Check“?
mnconservative

I agree that the unions are strangling our US auto makers. As painful as it will be it is time for GM & Ford to re-make themselves to become more competitive. #1 priority is to break the hold the unions have. This is no longer the early years when workers were treated like slaves. It is proven that companies without unions are sounder, especially in dicey business climates, and companies that treat their employees well have stronger and more profitable businesses. There needs to be an incentive for employess to perform to keep a company lean. Unions take that incentive away and many employees become dead weight, need I say National Education Union.
di butler

Good goog a mooga! I am agreeing with Ollie twice in one day! You are right OB! Let them file chapter 11.

My sister has been with UPS for 25 yrs., non union. No problems, good pay.
robert108

Put 200k mid westerners out of work is a disaster. For them, their families, their towns, their states.

Typical leftie static thinking. They will be able to find jobs at the profitable auto companies, which will increase their business. The union workers will actually have to work productively for their pay, of course.
robert108

Somehow the overpaid and underworked were able to make their companies the largest and most profitable in the world.

Another lie from you. FIAT is the largest automaker in the world, and the Japanese automakers are more profitable than US automakers, due to the freedom from oppressive unionization.
The purpose of unions is to fix the price and supply of labor at higher than market levels.

When somsone ay Toyota usa needs extensive medical care they go to Medicare.

Another lie from you. I guess you don’t know what Medicare is. If union labor is so great, how can the nonunionized companies attract any workers?
robert108

If they go “belly up”, the demand for autos will be supplied by companies that can do it without going into debt. Profit will rescue them, not “bailouts”.
robert108

Socialist Obama is not supporting big business; he’s supporting corporate welfare(real corporate welfare, not the leftie bullshit you all have been slinging all this time); I thought it was evil, so why is now a “solution” to anything?
WOOFX

You can tell from your years on the line?

They have already been overpaid and underworked.

Somehow the overpaid and underworked were able to make their companies the largest and most profitable in the world.
Management ran them into the ground. Fighting every idea that would have made them successful;.

Fuel efficiency Safety that would bankrupt us , let em buy a Toyota.

They did.

When somsone ay Toyota usa needs extensive medical care they go to Medicare. Who do you think pays for that?
http://sayanythingblog.com robport

Unions are an anacrhonism from a by-gone age. They represent inefficiency and sub-par quality.

Just look at how the US auto industry lines up with the foreign auto industry.

Who are you going to believe? Some professor or your lying eyes?
WOOFX

There are 200K Big three auto workers.
Give them a share of the bankrupt companies to save.
WOOFX

Easy for you to say

They will be able to find jobs at the profitable auto companies,
WOOFX

Get the UAW to forgo some health and pension benefits for a share of the companies and productive work .

Put 200k mid westerners out of work is a disaster. For them, their families, their towns, their states.
http://sayanythingblog.com robport

The less you pay workers and the fewer their advantages, the less incentive they’ll have to work as hard as Irene’s hubby.

Smart business people pay for the level of productivity they hope to get out.

Union workers are over paid and under productive. And labor contracts that force companies like GM to employ thousands of workers who don’t do anything are ludicrous.

Labor is a market like anything else. Employees are worth what they’re willing to work for, and a job is worth what an employer is willing to pay.

Nothing more, nothing less.
http://sayanythingblog.com robport

The outgoing GOP administration is responsible for the greatest socialization our country has ever witnessed with the nationalizing of banks and insurance interests.

I’d say the greatest socialization of our country would have to go to either FDR or LBJ, not Bush. Though Bush’s nationalization of the banks and expansion of entitlement spending was certainly awful.

That’s the sort of nonsense that put Republicans in the minority.

But as for Barry and bailing out the auto industry, it’s not really about the auto industry. It’s about protecting one of the last bastions of organized labor in this country.

Union enrollment is declining. Unions are desperate for membership. That’s why they want to bail out the status quo in Detroit. That’s why they want to prevent workers from voting on whether or not they want to join a union.

Because they’re desperate.

It’s going to get ugly before this is over.
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