Say Anything Blog

As your Republican candidates pointed out tonight, what is there to lose? If we clean up the environment by becoming less dependent on foreign oil and developing alternative fuel sources, we will leave our children a cleaner planet.

In the process, we will develop other technologies and industries to spur the economy and create jobs.

If we choose to do nothing because we don’t believe in global warming and we are wrong, then we will leave our children with a problem they don’t need.

If we choose to do nothing because we don’t believe in global warming and we are wrong, then we will leave our children with a problem they don’t need.

A false dichotomy.  By continuing to improve both our technology and our supply of the best energy sources, we will prosper, unlike the grim future that will result from letting agendized politicians implement their self-serving social engineering policies.
It’s just wrong to say we will do nothing; we will do the right thing, rather than working from the false premise of human-caused global warming.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

If we choose to do nothing because we don’t believe (in global warming) and we are wrong, then we will leave our children with a problem they don’t need.

I’ve added the parentheses to suggest that the reasoning given here is as much a matter of political convenience and rationalization as it is principle.

Substitute the problem of coming government entitlement insolvency (Social Security and Medicare) and the question of the “needs” of our children dissolves in a flurry of liberal denial and higher taxes.  Odd how that happens!  After all, whose children “need” higher taxes?

“Poverty of goods is easily cured; poverty of the mind is irreparable.”

ews48 - As your Republican candidates pointed out tonight, what is there to lose?

Huh? Freedom and billions upon billions of dollars.

Did you not read it?

Notice that the vociferous Democrat Party shill ews has nothing to say about the tax. Being a socialist and lifelong Democrat Party voter ews entirely supports any tax that will help strip Americans of their “ill gotten riches”.

ews, what is your Party’s, the Democrat Party, position going to be as temps across the planet drop as much as they have risen? Going to be a bit awkward, all that backpedalling and stammering. But hey! You Democrats are quite used to changing your lies in mid-sentence, I’m sure you will get by.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

It figures that the centepiece to this story would be a consultant--from Switzerland yet.  It’s so typical of the Swiss, they don’t have a dog in the hunt (or any hunt), but they have already figured out a way to make a buck from the addled thinking of those who fancy themselves to be the friends of a planet.

the false premise of human-caused global warming

The real false premise is the rightwing delusion that there is no global warming. It doesn’t even take a scientist to prove that there is global warming and that it is caused by the ever-increasing emissions of carbon dioxide. Grade school kids can figure this out. Why can’t the neocons? Because they do not want to change, or worse they want to fulfill the Biblical prophesy of the end of the world. Or maybe they just hate liberals so much they are willing to see the destruction of the planet just to satisfy their appetite for revenge.

The only thing to do is tell the deluded idiots to get the hell out of the way and allow the sane people to resolve this crisis.

What we want is for you guys to prove that you know what you’re talking about.  The simple way to do that is to start making predictions and we’ll see if your models are accurate.

Everytime these climatologists make a prediction they show that they don’t have the thing figured out yet.

Heck the models don’t explain how we got here.  Why was it warmer in the 30’s?

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Why was it warmer in the 30’s?

You’re flogging a dead horse. This is based on revised figures for the continental US only, not the world.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

That is right! HCGW is a dead horse, and we will continue to beat it into a paste. Just as it deserves.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

The real false premise is the rightwing delusion that there is no global warming

Yawn....

I guess you have to just start shouting-down the “deniers” now that the global warming campaign is getting shot full of holes. Al won’t debate anyone, or take questions; the models used are being torn down (see hockey stick and PCA, mathematical distortions, etc.); the ”consensus” has been proven to be a figment of an unimaginative mind; and so on and on. Keep strong though, you collectivists still might be able to squeeze a few dollars out to “redistribute” despite the house crumbling down around you.

Otherwise, the rest of us will hang around to see this issue go poof much of the same way as global cooling, Y2K, the population explosion, the Jupiter Effect, BSE, bird flu,..........

""That’s the problem with you lefties, you’re not willing to get your hands dirty. I’d suggest you roll up your sleeves.”

-Jack Bauer

Of course there’s global warming.  19000 years ago there was a mile of ice sitting on top of Europe. 

The question isn’t just whether warming has occurred, but what are it’s causes, and what we can or should do about it.

Just because it warms doesn’t mean we are necessarily going into a less ideal environment.  Example: Global warming preferentially heats the poles, though not enough to melt the ice at high altitudes.  This results in two effects:  One is that we get an ice build up in the Antarctic interior (this is happening), which partially offsets the thermal expansion of the oceans.  The second is that the strength of the QSO (quasi-biennial stratospheric oscillation), which in turn drives hurricane genesis, is driven by the temperature difference between the poles and the tropical zone.  Global warming actually predicts fewer major storms, not more. (And that is seen:  the main index for major storm activity, the so-called ACE or average cyclonic energy, is at its lowest value in more than 30 years.)

It doesn’t even take a scientist to prove that there is global warming and that it is caused by the ever-increasing emissions of carbon dioxide. Grade school kids can figure this out.

Grade school kids aren’t figuring this out at all!  They’re being indoctrinated by liberal union baby-sitters who are certainly older than the kiddies they are supposedly educating, and just as certainly no smarter.

“Poverty of goods is easily cured; poverty of the mind is irreparable.”

Socialist:

It doesn’t even take a scientist to prove that there is global warming and that it is caused by the ever-increasing emissions of carbon dioxide. Grade school kids can figure this out.

Demonstrating socialist’s lack of understanding of the topic.

If it’s just CO2 that is driving global mean temperature, why has the temperature been stable (or even slightly decreasing) over the last decade?

You’re flogging a dead horse. This is based on revised figures for the continental US only, not the world.

Isn’t the US part of the world?  Doesn’t the US have the best system of ground based temperature measurements (flawed that they might be?)

I’d want to see why the US wasn’t following the rest of the world.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Otherwise, the rest of us will hang around to see this issue go poof much of the same way as global cooling still a possible outcome of climate change, Y2K [it wasn’t as bad as predicted, but then there was warning which people acted on, the population explosion the global population is still growing, albeit at a slower rate than predicted by alarmists, the Jupiter Effect of course it was tosh, BSE the long term effects and the number of cases of CJD are still unclear, as the disease can lie dormant for many years. We may yet have CJD clusters, bird flu bird flu is far from over, worldwide cases are still increasing. My home town is currently under restrictions due to nearby outbreaks

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

I’ll try again.

Otherwise, the rest of us will hang around to see this issue go poof much (of) the same way as global cooling still a possible outcome of climate change, Y2K it wasn’t as bad as predicted, but then there was warning which people acted on, the population explosion the global population is still growing, albeit at a slower rate than predicted by alarmists, the Jupiter Effect of course it was tosh, BSE the long term effects and the number of cases of CJD are still unclear, as the disease can lie dormant for many years. We may yet have CJD clusters, bird flu bird flu is far from over, worldwide cases are still increasing. My home town is currently under restrictions due to nearby outbreaks

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

Society has always had less problems with disease during warm periods.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

mofal,
All predicted to be dire IMMEDIATELY, and in almost all cases we were told millions will die tomorrow, next year, blah-blah-blah. Hell, ALgore’s been telling us for 20-25 years that we’re all going to be screwed in 5 years. Nothing wrong with taking precautions when possible problems may arise, but everything is becoming a case study in crying wolf. Going through a cycle of warmer temperatures? - I know, let’s make it a political cause that can be used to degrade America politically and economically, and put it on equal footing with the rest of the ”internation community”(and somewhere, somebody will decide it’s a good way to make a couple extra bucks: ie. Al). The environmental movement = watermelons (green on the outside, red on the inside).

Look, I’m all for renewable energy and doing what I can to help conserve(recycle, compost, rainbarrels for watering, hybrid work vehicle, programmable thermostat, energy efficient appliances and mechanical, organic garden,etc.), I’m just not willing to crush our economy and have my tax money confiscated for some redistibutionist scheme.

""That’s the problem with you lefties, you’re not willing to get your hands dirty. I’d suggest you roll up your sleeves.”

-Jack Bauer

Society has always had less problems with disease during warm periods.

Like the Black Death, which spread during the medieval warm period. Warmer weather patterns will lead to increases in disease and parasites. Read Dr. Paul Epstein’s work for confirmation. We might get less colds though.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

Hoss,

All predicted to be dire IMMEDIATELY

Gore preaching about ACC for 20-25 years? He started in 1982 did he?

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

Do you really think that Europe want to stifle American politics and economics? The same action that you guys take would affect our economies in much the same way, yet we are calling for it. That is just bullshit.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

Toot, read this

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

Without a crisis, socialism has nothing to advance its injustice.  Prospering, free people don’t need socialism, much less want it… with the exception of those who want everyone else to have it.

You liberals really ought to just back off. Society doesn’t need your help.  People can take care of themselves and those who are learning to are only hindered by your efforts.  Try taking care of yourself and quit worrying over everything everyone else is doing.  Live a little.

And here is the big lie, recycled from the Koyoto treaty:

wealthy nations like the U.S. would bear the biggest burden based on the “polluters pay principle.”

I guess the “Polluters pay principle” doesn’t apply to China and India?  Or are they suddenly 2 of the richest nations?  They certainly are in the top 5 for pollution.  How are we going to get them to sign on when it isn’t in their interest to either reduce emissions or pay a tax?

Oh that’s right, when he said “polluters pay” he meant the U.S. only.  The idiots can’t even pretend to sugar coat their socialist crap because they’re too eager to bring down the U.S.

Another point is that it’s the leftie commies that are responsible for much of the CO2 being emitted by the US. 

If they wouldn’t have stopped development of nuclear power plants we’d be emitting much less CO2. 

Nuclear power should be supplying most of our electricity because it’s a better cheaper source of electrical power.

So when the lefties fix the damage they caused we can maybe believe they’re being sincere about the issue rather than being a bunch of Luddites.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Man: The US was the only country that “prepared” for Y2K, but it didn’t affect anyone, because it was pure delusional scareological crap.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

If you want to see the greatest threat imposing global socialism, look no further that George W Bush.  By weakening the dollar he’s letting foreigners buy us up, piece by piece. (Both the public and private sector.) The dollar is weak and getting weaker.  The numbers don’t lie.

The US was the only country that “prepared” for Y2K, but it didn’t affect anyone, because it was pure delusional scareological crap

More navel staring. Thanks for that.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

HG, I ain’t no f**king liberal. Take that back!

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

The numbers don’t lie.

No but the conclusions are being distorted.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Toot, I agree. We should build more nuclear power plants, but we should also build more Combined Heat and Power plants, especially if we are building new towns etc.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

If you can do that economically that’s fine.  I don’t know if it would work in the US (at least around here) as the homes are maybe farther apart than in your country.  (More space to go around)

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Do you really think that Europe want to stifle American politics and economics?

Yes.

The same action that you guys take would affect our economies in much the same way, yet we are calling for it.

That’s true, but never underestimate the power of stupidity.

Toot, read this

I disagree with the very premise that us warming up a slight amount to temperatures we’ve seen in the past are that bad.  Perhaps IF we were to be many degrees warmer like the scare-mongers are pushing there could be some effects like that.

Warming up two tenths of a degree isn’t going to do it.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Mano’s right. What you get in a cold period is an upturn in opportunistic diseases, like TB for instance, because peoples immune systems are already stressed.
What we’re seeing right now is West Nile Virus in Oregon and New York and malaria coming back in some of the sothern states. It’s already happening. C
limatologists ARE constantly revising their models as they get new data. It’s called scientific method. The problem I have with the “they can’t even get the models right” argument is that the models keep getting revised in a more pessimistic direction. This is what’s known as a trend. The one I’m seeing disturbs me.
Now who’s responsible and who get’s to pay for it is another issue altogether. 10 years ago it was all about the US and Japan lowering their emmisssions. We should have done it then. Because now it’s rapidly becoming India and China that are the largest polluters and we as a people don’t have a leg to stand on if we ask them to cut their emmissions.
Let me point out that up until the current crop of luddites got control of the government we had a system in this country where the polluters paid. It’s the only reason it’s now safe to breath in many large US cities today. This isn’t a new idea and it’s one that we as a nation came up with.
The atmosphere is a global, shared rescource. It makes a certain amount of sense to manage it on a global level. We have in place a means written into the US Constitution for doing that without giving up any of our soveriegn powers that do not directly relate to the issue. It’s called a treaty. Since congress refused to ratify, and then Bush “unsigned"(his words not mine) the Kyoto treaty, we are now faced with the prospect of a more draconian one. We are also, after 10 years of doing nothing, in a worse position to negotiate with the rest of the world. But we must eventually negotiate with the rest of the world on this issue, because it is a shared problem and a shared resource and no one nation or even group of nations is going to solve the problem or manage the resource alone.
Anyone who has grown out of adolescence knows that he can’t do whatever he please all the time and that people need to agree on rules of conduct in order to live together. I’m giving everyone posting here the benifit of the doubt on having reached that level of maturity. If only because of the bloggers prayer I had to read before I posted this.

This is only a “problem” to those attempting to force socialism upon the human race. Buying into that pile of Marxist/socialist crap is a sign of mental illness.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

Everyone rambles on about the economic harm that cutting CO2 emissions would cause, but the trouble is that economic models are even less reliable than climate models.
Either the US stays in the 20th century (yes, I mean 20th) or continues to be at the forefront of science and technology by accepting emissions cuts and leads the way in developing new technologies to deal with CC.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

I’m still waiting for y’all to explain how you are going to reduce the Sun’s output. That is the only way you will stop global climate change, which will in effect kill the ecology of this, and all other, planet. Let’s hear it.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

What we’re seeing right now is West Nile Virus in Oregon and New York

I’m sorry but that’s a really bad point.  We’ve got west nile in North Dakota which is one of the coldest states in the country.  There’s no way you can claim that west nile in Oregon has anything to do with global warming.

malaria coming back in some of the sothern states.

Because of a lack of the ability to use DDT which is what it takes to eradicate that terrible disease.  A marginal increase of temperature that’s barely measurable couldn’t be responsible for that.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Everyone rambles on about the economic harm that cutting CO2 emissions would cause, but the trouble is that economic models are even less reliable than climate models.

You want to force us all to spend more to get less.  In no way can you claim that that is going to help the economy.

If there is a way to get more by spending less the market will take care of it, provided that the government doesn’t interfere as it often does.

Flamer you’re really way off base on the economic thingie.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Either the US stays in the 20th century (yes, I mean 20th) or continues to be at the forefront of science and technology by accepting emissions cuts
and leads the way in developing new technologies to deal with CC.

CO2 is not a pollutant.  There is no reason to “reduce” it.  It’s part of the cycle of life on this planet.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

In your opinion, Toot. Shame you are wrong.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

Great lack of a rebuttal.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

2H9, nobody denies that the sun is the principal forcing agent of climate.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

So, Flamer, you are actually attempting to tell us that socialism is the future? Shame you are wrong,eh?

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

Nuclear power isn’t the solution. I know it’s a sexy, easy answer to those of us who grew up reading Science Fiction and expecting that any day fusion reactors would come on line and electricity would be “too cheap to meter”. But that hasn’t happened. It may never happen. And fission reactions from Uranium238 are not very pracical over the long haul. Pitchblend is expensive, energy intensive and environmentally destructive to mine. Fissible Uranium is even more energy intensive to refine. Most of the energy used for mining and refinement pretty much has to come from fossil fuels, so nuclear isn’t either as economic or non-carbon emmitting as everybody says. And it will get more expensive as fossil fuels get scarce. And what do you do with the spent fuel?
The fact that nuclear power only works on a very large scale means that 10-30% of the power that does get generated is lost to heat over the transmission lines. But that DOES make it really attractive to companies who want to have monopolies on providing electrical power to major cities.
The reason that so little gets spent developing “alternative” sources is that they are distributable and scalable down to the single family home level.
Pick a reason other than nuclear power to blame “the left” for all of the problems that “the right” has been causing or ignoring for the last 60 years. I’m bored with this one.

R108, way to point out the bleeding obvious. Anyone who claims that CO2 is a pollutant is a fool. It is however a known greenhouse gas and so increasing the atmospheric concentrations of it will affect the greenhouse effect.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

it will affect the greenhouse effect.

But it doesn’t explain the extent of the warming we have seen, nor the lack of warming in the last 8 years.

It’s almost like the Earth is this huge complicated thing that we don’t fully understand and should quit pretending that we do.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

I ain’t no f**king socialist neither.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

So you’re in effect a socialist dupe since you’re advancing their agenda without believing in their creed?

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

...the trouble is that economic models are even
less reliable than climate models.

It is true that economic forecasting is usually not accurate; it’s mostly due to underestimating growth and overestimating negative movement.  Most leftie economists(who get reported in the MSM) are still unaware that the free enterprise system creates prosperity and is self-adjusting.  They tend to regard upward trends as temporary, and downward trends as continuing forever.
It’s the same thinking that makes all the inaccurate predictions about the climate, in order to advance the same agenda: world socialism.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

Whereas righties assume upward trends will continue forever and downward trends are temporary. Instead both are temporary.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

Umm, flamer, have you noticed the economic growth that we’ve always seen from the start of history?

I’m pretty sure that’s a trend we can bank on provided the socialists which you are not one of according to you don’t get their way.

The trend is people building up on the knowledge and wealth accumulated in the generation before them.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

It’s almost like the Earth is this huge complicated thing that we don’t fully understand and should quit pretending that we do

You’re half right. The earth is a huge, complicated, interdependant organism. We’ve been trying to understand it for about 10,000 years that anybody knows of. We’ve been getting markedly better at understanding it for the last 200 years. And we need to refine that understanding and act on that understanding or we are eventually going to go the way of the carrier pigeon.

So you’re in effect a socialist dupe since you’re advancing their agenda without believing in their creed?

Name calling, how adult of you.

I am currently doing a masters in Advanced Environment and Energy Studies, so excuse me if I seem to know more about the subject than you.
I will listen to Carrick’s arguments, which are at least reasoned and have scientific basis, rather than just reiterating Fox News talking points.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

Nuclear power isn’t the solution.

Yes it is, it’s the cheapest cleanest form of energy.  Supplies are currently plentiful.  I understand that we’ve got enough refined product to supply us with electricity for the foreseeable future.

The industry has paid for safe secure storage although the lefties haven’t allowed us to use it.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

so excuse me if I seem to know more about the subject than you.

Wizard of Oz syndrome.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

or we are eventually going to go the way of the carrier pigeon.

Our evolutionary ancestors survived the comet that killed of the dinosaurs without our intelligence.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Whereas righties assume upward trends will continue forever and downward trends are temporary. Instead both are temporary.

Wrong.  What part of “self-adjusting” didn’t you understand?  Conservatives aren’t “righties”.  The free enterprise system isn’t “right-wing” in any possible interpretation of the term.  Free people making free choices is about freedom.  Duh.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

It is however a known greenhouse gas and so
increasing the atmospheric concentrations of it will affect the greenhouse effect.

The so-called “greenhouse effect” makes life on Earth possible.  The main source of it is water vapor, not CO2.  In fact, CO2 is only 0.03 percent of our atmosphere, so doubling it would only make it 0.06 percent of our atmosphere.  The contention that such a small trace of CO2 in our atmosphere is a key ingredient in some catastrophic climate change scenario is laughable.  It’s just a propaganda tool for the agenda of implementing world socialism.
If the people of the world knew the truth, the lefties wouldn’t be able to sell this crap to anyone.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

Pick a reason other than nuclear power to blame “the left” for all of the problems that “the right” has been causing or ignoring for the last 60 years. I’m bored with this one.

The source of our problems in this area is that the so-called “progressives” are really Luddites in disguise, and have been hampering technological progress all along.  Now, you idiotically blame it on the phantom “right”.  What crap.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

I am currently doing a masters in Advanced Environment and Energy Studies…

Your agenda is now clear: you won’t have a job in the future if the truth about your global warming scareology come out.  Shame on you!

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

...or we are eventually going to go the way of the carrier pigeon.

The carrier pigeon was hunted out of existence.  It’s not a good analogy.

If you don’t know by now, don’t mess with it.

HG, I ain’t no f**king liberal. Take that back!

And you sure as hell ain’t no conservative either.  MMGW is a trojan horse concealing a whole hell of a lot of ideology and taxes.  Wake up, look, and listen.  What is a carbon tax going to do, reverse the MMGW fable?  This is just another power grab by people who can’t stand to see others happy and successful in life without their help, or in many cases in spite of it. 

Step back and take a look at the big picture and you’d realize just how stupid and silly this whole scare tactic is.  What’s funnier is that there are actually educated people who are defending it.  Which proves for some education leads to borderline madness. 

Come on, the universe is a cosmic accident without any intelligence whatsoever.  It was a mindless mass until it accidentally evolved consciousness and became self-aware.  Now that same consciousness is going to destroy the planet by simply pursuing wealth and happiness, which of course must be completely natural since there is nothing unnatural.  This is friggin’ ridiculous.  You people need some serious help.

R108, trotting out that old nag again. Yes, water vapour is a greenhouse gas and that is not in dispute, nor has it ever been. Methane is a known greenhouse gas and is known to have effects ten times more powerful than CO2, yet it makes up only 0.00017% of the atmosphere.
Listing the percentages of these gases sounds impressive to people who don’t know much about the science, but to those who do you just come across as ignorant.
Your claim that CO2 makes up only 0.03% of the atmosphere is also wrong, it is closer to 0.04% today, higher than it has been for hundreds of thousands, possibly millions of years.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

You people need some serious help.

Ditto. If you devoted one iota of your obvious intelligence to understanding the science behind climate change, then you too would see that it is not all hot air [ ] and that we can make a difference to it.
As a Christian, can you not see that we are abusing the gift that God gave to us? Because if you can’t, then you are blind to His creation.

Science does not have to be exclusive of religion, unless you make it so.

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

to understanding the science behind climate change,

I’m waiting for the scientists quoted in the media to understand it before I devote too much time.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

HG, I have never claimed to be a Conservative, though I do hold many conservative views. There are not two camps (Liberal and Conservative) in this world, but a multitude of them. It is not a case of “You’re either with us or against us!” (which seems to be a totalitarian standpoint, rather than a conservative one), but “We agree on some things and not on others!” Far better than a homogeneous world where everybody thinks the same way (socialism).

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

As a Christian, can you not see that we are abusing the gift that God gave to us?

Abusing the planet is using our God given intelligence to invent more efficient means of travel, using energy to make better use of our resources, and of course pursuing happiness in part through economic means?  Get a grip. 

Because if you can’t, then you are blind to His creation.

What?  That is ridiculous.  We aren’t perfect, but we sure are not abusing the planet by making use of natural resources.  MMGW is just one of the many liberal abuses of intelligence.

Maybe then you can tell me what our chances are for fulfillment and pleasant demeanor when faced by too numerous to count missiles of mendacity and ill regard being flung at us, the voting public, as well as flying out in all directions as if a whole gaggle of crazed monkeys broke in to the local armory, peppering the night sky willy-nilly with lead projectiles for know apparent purpose save that one might connect with the already badly damaged heart and bearing of the country and it’s institutions. Down in the land of inbred kissin’ cousins they say it sounds like a job for ole’ Jay-zuzz, though I don’t think even the great Oz has anything in his bag o’ tricks that could help us in the interim. And believe it or not, some GOP pinheads are completely baffled as to the source of our discontent, which are understandably many and not apparent to the typical stoopid political nanker pushing the stone up the hill whilst stuffing his/her pockets. It’s visions of Joanna as we try in vain to stuff socks in the mouths of the broken-record choir with their plaintive bleating, croaking “Cha-ching!!” as they toss the rotten vegetables of their own failed schemes on National T.V.. They sure got a lot of gall! These visions of Joanna keep us up past the dawn (Sorry Bob!), ringing truer as Kafka-esque nightmares. Somebody please tell me what salvation is like after a while. Jeez, I can’t find my knees.

I’m waiting for the scientists quoted in the media to understand it before I devote too much time.

Toot, relying on the (leftie) MSM to help you formulate your opinion, whatever next?

Do not fear to be eccentric in opinion, for every opinion now accepted was once eccentric.

No just pointing out that the scientists that are speaking to the media don’t really understand things.

Real scientists would be much more balanced in their thinking.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

MOFAL, sometimes I wonder about you…

You are, or Paul Epstein is (with you acting as proxy), suggesting that warmer weather spreads disease.  Have you even thought about his argument at all?

Just because somebody claims an authority on a given topic doesn’t make them one.

Let’s take a look at some common diseases:

Malaria, spread by mosquitos.  Mostly a problem in the tropic As big a problem in the arctic as in the tropic.  The only reason it remains a problem in the tropics is the lack of proper control (e.g., DDT).

Lyme disease, spread by ticks.Mostly a problem in the tropic Mostly a problem in temperate zones; spreading south not north.

SARS, tuberculosis, etc. Mostly a problem in the tropic Actually it’s spread pneumatically, and unless humans evolve into a cold-blooded creature, the rate of spread is not affected by external climate (humans maintain a constant core body temperature of course).  Actually ameliorated by warmer temperatures, because colds & coughs follow cold climate, not warm, and these facility the spread of SARS.

As another heads up, global warming doesn’t mean the equator is getting warmer, it means the poles are getting warmer.  That means a more temperate climate Earth-wide, and less chance of disease (or hunger), nor more.

Epstein’s work