Interview: ND Superintendent Says We Don’t Need Armed Teachers Or Security Guards In Schools

Baesler-Picture-2

Like most parents who have followed the coverage of the school shooting at Sandy Hook Elementary in Newtown, Connecticut, my thoughts have drifted to the security at the schools my children attend. To that end, I interviewed recently-elected Superintendent of North Dakota Schools Kirsten Baesler about school security.

Baesler points out that in the 2011 legislative session, North Dakota passed a law requiring that all schools develop a lock down plan and practice it at least once a year. She said that her office isn’t seeking any additional legislation from the upcoming legislative session beginning next month, but she is looking to coordinate the school districts so that larger districts who have the benefit of a public safety director can help smaller districts develop policies. She said she may pursue some legislative appropriations toward that end.

Asked if she would support arming some employees in the schools, be it by allowing teachers or principles to carry or bringing in security guards, she said she would oppose it. She wants schools to remain “places of education, not armed stockades.”

Rob Port is the editor of SayAnythingBlog.com. In 2011 he was a finalist for the Watch Dog of the Year from the Sam Adams Alliance and winner of the Americans For Prosperity Award for Online Excellence. In 2013 the Washington Post named SAB one of the nation's top state-based political blogs, and named Rob one of the state's best political reporters. He writes a weekly column for several North Dakota newspapers, and also serves as a policy fellow for the North Dakota Policy Council.

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  • Jimbo

    Did this person not learn? Gun Free Zones don’t stop gun violence. Face Plant to desk. Dalrymple needs to go. His budget is bad enough and for appointing this individual to this position just magnifies how out of touch he and the rest of his staff and appointees really are.

    • Jimbo

      I know, she was elected, my mistake. Typing too fast.

    • spud

      She was elected to this position dumb-ass. Do you really think the mass populous wants teachers armed? As far as security guards of policemen at the school that is about local control the superintendent of schools should have no role in that decision.

      • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

        Well, it may not be an issue of local control much longer if Dalrymple gets his way and all local school funding is shifted from the state.

        So that we can, you know, “Keep It Local” and stuff.

        And I think the “gun free zones” should be shut down. It’s pretty clear that they’re bullseyes for people looking to go on a rampage. At the very least, let CCW holders (including teachers and other school employees) carry their guns there.

        • SusanBeehler

          It is still local to North Dakota. North Dakota has chosen to follow the federal laws on guns and those laws are not “local”. Schools will still have local options so Rob you could start lobbying Minot Schools to start packing heat and levy a property tax to pay for it.

          • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

            I’m not sure where you’re getting this idea that allowing CCW-qualified teachers to carry their own guns, and ending the fiction that is “gun free zones,” would cost the taxpayers anything.

            I don’t think you’ve spent a lot of time thinking about this, Susan.

          • SusanBeehler

            It could cost money to the school district if the parents do NOT want teachers carrying concealed weapons. How many qualified teachers have CCW licences? Would you rather have a teacher pull out their CCW than try and get all the children out of harms way? Rather have them running through a school trying to play superman instead of focus on the children in classroom? Rob, have you worked with a group of 20 kindergartners? I don’t think you spent alot time thinking about what a teacher does throughout the day, you may not even know what a caregiver goes through the day while taking care of your own children. Think about it Rob, what does a caregiver or teacher do throughout the day and how would the CCW work with bending to tie a shoe, wipe a nose, treat a scrape knee, calm a child, read a book and where is this teacher suppose to keep it concealed in their purse in a locked locker in the hall? I have spent alot of time thinking about protecting children in many scenarios and it has not been by playing gun battles in video games. It is real life scenarios thought about. They are not sitting at a computer pounding out a blog or asking for information or interviewing people, the teacher have real every minute demands on them. I don’t know, do you know how many are well trained with guns? What happens when a weapon is accidently discharged? You could bet your sweet bippy, a school district will be sued.

          • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

            It could cost money to the school district if the parents do NOT want teachers carrying concealed weapons.

            That’s something easily settled through the democratic process.

            Would you rather have a teacher pull out their CCW than try and get all the children out of harms way?

            I reject your premise. It’s not an either-or situation. They can try to flee, and the teacher can use the gun to protect the kids if they’re cornered.

          • SusanBeehler

            I reject your premise too it is not an either or of gun free or guns, it is somewhere in between. Guns in a school is not the answer.

          • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

            I reject your premise too it is not an either or of gun free or guns, it is somewhere in between.

            Huh?

            You’re making it either-or. I’m the one advocating something in between. I don’t want to mandate guns in schools, I want to give law-abiding CCW holders the option.

          • SusanBeehler

            No, you are advocating a gun opportunity, I am advocating other alternatives. CCW already have alot of options they do not need to be in the school. Just like in the old west days, the guns were checked at the door in many a drinking establishment .

          • camsaure

            Thge “other alternative” did not work out so well, did it?

          • http://proof-proofpositive.blogspot.com/ Proof

            ” Just like in the old west days, the guns were checked at the door in many a drinking establishment” Which was generally enforced by the bartender who had a shotgun behind the bar. Instead of the “gun free” zone you imagine, there was a “good guy” with a firearm.

            Prohibiting licensed and trained “good guys” with guns from schools, churches, etc. clears the way for the aberrant with a gun to attack with impunity.

            That doesn’t mean that every teacher needs to be armed. There is deterrence in not knowing who’s armed.

            For example, there was a high incidence of armed robberies of tourists in Florida. They would be robbed leaving airports, often with pockets full of cash to spend on their vacations. The State of Florida determined that the crooks were able to identify which cars were rental cars, filled with tourists who were disarmed on the inbound flight, unlike the residents of Florida who were permitted by law to carry firearms in their cars.

            In essence, each rental car had a “gun free zone” sticker on it. When the distinctive rental car identifiers were removed, armed robberies of tourists dropped precipitously, because crooks had no way of knowing whether or not any particular car contained an unarmed tourist or an armed Floridian. Deterrence does not require arming everyone. Uncertainty can be a deterrence.

          • dakotacyr

            that’s not really and option, since there would be guns in the schools.

          • SusanBeehler

            Right, like I asked before Rob, How many children have been in your charge at one time?

          • RCND

            Susan, you are clueless and letting your logic be driven by emotion. No one is for the idea of forcing a teacher to carry if they don’t want to. If they do choose to, they are smart enough people to know they will have to manage all the other challenges you detail along with their weapon. It also does not need to be a teacher; it can be another responsible adult that does not have responsibility for direct and continuous interaction with the kids too.

          • SusanBeehler

            If many of you posting here would be carrying guns in a school and teaching, I would not let my children attend. Many sound like you would shot first before seeing what is happening. It is the emotion of impulse which causes a trigger to be pulled; most “gunners” just do not recognize it as an emotion and it is a high emotional IQ which could save your own live and lives of others.

          • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

            If many of you posting here would be carrying guns in a school and teaching, I would not let my children attend.

            Which is an argument for school vouchers.

            Because i don’t really like sending my kids into totally unprotected “gun free zones.”

          • SusanBeehler

            Than lobby for it or keep your kids at home.

          • Lianne

            Actually, dismantling the school system, and setting up home school via internet would remove the masses from being a target.

          • SusanBeehler

            It is a idea, but do you think all the children left in their homes all alone while the parents are working would be a good idea?

          • RCND

            No Susan, shooting is always the last resort. You have no clue about dealing with an armed threat; I do. I would also never favor CCW in a school without additional shoot-don’t shoot training, and I am sure no one else here who you just villified would oppose that either. But shooting has to be an option. Get your emotions back in check again and join us later.

          • two_amber_lamps

            LOL!! Emotional IQ? In the world according to Ms. Suzy guess that’s the new paradigm… means, intent, opportunity, and fear of grave bodily injury for self or another just doesn’t cut it anymore…

          • SusanBeehler

            You have a thing against emotions or just being human? No one else maybe on this blog, but I know I am not alone in my thinking CCW is not a good idea in school. Go ahead start talking to your children’s teachers see what they think.

          • RCND

            They have no concerns with it actually

            As I stated in another post, emotion is nothing to be basing major policy decisions on, especially ones with constitutional ramifications

          • two_amber_lamps

            Emotional IQ??? Is that what they’re teaching cops in those shoot/no-shoot simulators?? LOL!!!

          • SusanBeehler

            obviously your EIQ is fairly low, because you don’t get it. LOL!!!

          • 308T

            Susan, you’re a dufus & I really mean that. I’d be impressed if you could chew gum & walk at the same time.

          • camsaure

            So where the would you be sening them for their socialist/liberal indoctrination?

          • SusanBeehler

            So

          • dakotacyr

            So because she disagrees with you, she is stupid and emotional. Well, change is acoming. People even members of the NRA have had enough. The accumulation of the mass shootings over the past 6 months culminating with Newtown will bring sensible gun safety laws to this country and if not change will come in 2014.

          • 308T

            Good luck with that 2nd Amendment hating fantasy. NRA members have had enough of liberal liars & you’re a fine example of one.

          • RCND

            No, she is just emotional. Not stupid. But you don’t make major policy decisions, especially those with major constitutional ramifications, based on emotion.

            If you get your “sensible” change, what is your plan to confiscate? Good luck with that

          • 308T

            Again, my wife is a teacher in a middle school, she & most of her fellow teachers think the shooter lock down protocol is a joke. If teachers had ANY way to defend their classrooms other than praying & luck these school assaults could be minimized big time. Hell, teachers can’t even have pepper spray in their classroom because of liberal “zero tolerate” policy bullish!t. The only thing public school “zero tolerance” tolerates is easy killing grounds for mentally unstable liberals with guns.

          • SusanBeehler

            Again? I would like to know what her suggestions are? I would be for a taser in a classroom

          • Onslaught1066
          • SusanBeehler

            Oh well

          • dakotacyr

            Ah, yes the teachers would have to carry their own guns to school. and would the school district or state pay for the liability insurance or would you just pass a law that said if a student got shot by a teacher, then they couldn’t be sued. You’re too damn cheap to even pay for the guns for the teachers you want to arm. Now not only do they have to bring their own school supplies to school, now they will have to bring their own guns. Insanity!

          • 308T

            They don’t have to bring their own supplies to school dipsh!t, how do I know? My wife is a teacher.

          • Dave

            That’s a great school districts, then, and an anomaly, my wife spends hundreds out of pocket each year to bring in her own supplies.

          • SusanBeehler

            Really Rob I think you may need to talk to more people, I am not sure where you would get the idea a majority of moms and many dads would like guns in a classroom. What training does a CCW have to have as it relates to a classroom setting and who would pay for a CCW teacher to feel secure they would react in a manner you would want the children they teach exposed to? If a school board allows this someone would be paying to ensure the policy is implemented safely, my guess this would be the taxpayer. Policies are not FREE!

          • 308T

            Not sure she spends a lot of time thinking, period.

      • Jimbo

        Hey dumb-ass – I posted a correction immediately stating she was elected and I’d made mistake – for whatever reason – it ended up at the bottom of this post. Check the posting times. I’m not surprised by your response, as i’ve seen your ignorant posts far too often. Arm the staff. It’s not that tough.

        • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

          You may need to fix the order comments are appearing. You can set it with the drop-box at the top of the thread.

          You corrected yourself immediately, Spud’s comment came after.

        • spud

          Should not have gone off that way but by time I saw your correction my post was already posted. You need a clue what you are talking about has no chance of becoming law. You are better off looking at security guard or policeman route. Obama has total control going on national front. Hillary big favorite next election. Only one ignorant is your view on reality. You should give this some time to play out. This issue deals to me more about mental health and how we deal with that. We have all seen the advertisements on cable channels glorifying video games with major violence. 1st amendment issue then the gun’s 2nd amendment. The 30 round clips are a guaranteed goner most likely 5 round clips. Should not have called you a DA but you went off all authority expert like on the “elected” official when right now truth be told your side is running for the exits. Listen to Rob he has been on losing side of major issues this year. Keep listening to Fox so you know who is winning. Oh sorry they got the landslide wrong. Arm the staff is not going to happen. Look at the polls of course your side doesn’t know how to read them correctly.

    • two_amber_lamps

      Even better since the dolt (Baesler) elucidates the ND Dept of Edu. SOP… “NOTHING TO SEE HERE! MOVE ALONG!”

      Thank you for announcing to the world that ND schools are “places of education, not armed stockades.” and by default free-fire zones for brain-addled miscreants with an agenda…. stupid ideologue.

      • camsaure

        Surprise surprise, looks like we have another RINO on our hands in North Dakota.

        • two_amber_lamps

          SAY IT AIN’T SO CAM!!!! SAY IT AIN’T SO…..

        • SusanBeehler

          How do you define RINO?

          • camsaure

            Do you not have a a mirror? or do you also expect the taxpayers to supply you one of those?

          • SusanBeehler

            Excuse me I have never claimed to have a R behind my name

          • Onslaught1066

            Oh don’t be so modest, you are a perfect example of a Retard.

          • SusanBeehler

            Onslaught you are showing your domestic violence tendencies, a degrading person. You apparently believe you have the right to call people names to control the conversation, I am on to you and it doesn’t work with me. Go beat on yourself.

          • Onslaught1066

            Neither does dieting, I take it.

          • camsaure

            You are degrading your own self, everytime you post.

          • Lianne

            I think I understand your frustration with Susan, but using the term ‘retard’ in a demeaning fashion shows lack of respect and dignity for those who were born with limited mental abilities through no fault of their own. There are plenty of other terms to describe the libs.

          • Onslaught1066

            Yes I know, but i like it.

            So, (shrug)

          • Lianne

            We knew that with your first post!

          • Lianne

            How do you define RINO?

          • SusanBeehler

            A animal usually found in Africa

          • Onslaught1066

            I would define it as an animal usually found in Africa.

            You must be gubmint skool edumacated.

          • SusanBeehler

            Golly! Better learned than the marvelous world of comics, partianson party, video game world, shooting range carnival you been indoctrinated with.

          • Onslaught1066

            Non Sequitur.

          • Lianne

            Good one!!!!

          • camsaure

            and those animals usually closley resemble liberal dem women

          • SusanBeehler

            No male rinos?

          • camsaure

            Well the male liberals resemble the North end of southbound RINOs, there fixed it for ya.

          • Onslaught1066

            Good one!!!!

          • Lianne

            funny, that would be rhino!

          • slackwarerobert

            republicans who claim to by conservative and keep voting to spend money we don’t have.

      • SusanBeehler

        If I wanted my children to be educated like in Israel as your picture depicts than I would live in Israel.

        • two_amber_lamps

          Fine, take your chances… however when/if God forbid something happens to your children at school, don’t gnash your teeth and howl at the sky, point the finger of blame back at yourself because sheep such as you live in a perpetual state of denial but then curse fate when tragedy befalls you. Individual responsibility… if you’re unwilling to assume the roll, DO NOT complain when someone else is willing to assume the mantle.

          • SusanBeehler

            I am not denying anything, I just don’t agree with the solution of more guns. Think about your idea, you are in denial of what a teacher goes through in a day. Where is “she” going to put the rifle the picture shows when she helps a child wash their hands, maybe she could get a rolling handle on it to carry it with the laptop or her lunch bag. her purse and her phone. Maybe they have a backpack style for the school picnic. How much do those guns weigh? What about if she is pregnant, alot of teachers teach pregnant, where is she going to pack her heat? Get Real! you are in denial of what a teacher actually does. Responsibility is being responsible.

          • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

            I am not denying anything, I just don’t agree with the solution of more guns.

            Yeah, but we know less guns doesn’t work. Gun control laws only ensure that the only people who have guns are the criminals who don’t follow gun control laws.

          • SusanBeehler

            Have we tried enough gun control? Have we tried everything we can? You and many of the posters are denying the difficulty the job of a teacher can be without having to worry about carrying a gun. Will you be assured a gun wouldn’t be left lying in the reach of child, just like car keys?
            Suggestions I could think of is: Schools could build more secure doors, gates in zones in schools. Neighborhood watches for suspicious characters, cars. Secure parking lots. With guns, outlaw or restrict high powered rifles and guns who can easily get off numerous rounds of ammo. Don’t let “drunks”, “domestic violent offenders” get guns, suicidal people get guns.

          • RCND

            You talk out of both sides of your mouth. Most of your suggestions require spending more money, yet you are opposed to doing the same thing to put armed security in the schools.

          • SusanBeehler

            What is the most expensive line item in a school budget? It is the salaries, salaries are paid based on training, armed security will cost more to maintain than a better door or other security features in a building.

          • 308T

            How’d that “better door” work out in Newtown? Oh that’s right it didn’t stop jack shit! You’re so damned ignorant it’s painful reading your posts.

          • RCND

            And doors can be breached. Every physical security measure has a weak point. You need a level of adaptable security too that can react to the threat if they overcome those physical security measures. Adaptable = a human… a “good guy”… who can fight back

          • dakotacyr

            Yeah, we know what happens with spending more money, like the Senator from Tennessee who wants to required guns in school but doesn’t want to pay for them, he wants the teachers to bring their own guns and ammunition to school. yeah right!

          • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

            America has moved toward less gun control, and more gun carry, over the last couple of decades and violent crimes have gone down.

            What does that tell you?

          • SusanBeehler

            and we have one of the most awful school shootings, what does that tell you about your so called less gun control?

          • two_amber_lamps

            Uh, that the demented steal guns and hunt people in “gun-free” zones because people like you think signs will somehow magically protect them?

          • $8194357

            Conneticut has “stringent gun control laws”
            so what does that tell you?
            We have implimented tougher and tougher
            drunk driving laws and still the deaths caused
            under the influance have risen…

            James Madision one of the Constituion architecs
            stated it this way..

            A Constitutional Equal Rule of law government
            will only work for the people who have it “within them”
            to follow the law.

            Modern America fears not Gods Law
            so why would you think they would follow mans?

            DC is a corrupted pit of vipers..
            No good will come out of something so rotten…

          • RCND

            A shooting that was not prevented by some of the nations most tough gun laws. But that’s because bad people don’t follow the law

          • $8194357

            law·break·er /ˈlɔˌbreɪ kər/
            Show Spelled [law-brey-ker]

            noun
            a person who breaks or violates the law.

            Origin:
            before 1050; Middle English lawbreker;
            replacing Old English lahbreca.
            See law1 , breaker1

            Related forms
            law·break·ing, noun, adjective.

            Synonyms
            transgressor, criminal offender, perpetrator.

            End quote
            Some perp or government goon doing the bidding of those
            in soviet central planning DC above the rule of law transgresses
            my Constitutional civial rights and I may see them as a criminal offender and take matters into my own hands to exercise my
            God given rights to self protection, huh..

          • Lianne

            There is only one mass killing in the U.S. that is in the top worst 5 killings and as Horiffic and tragic and heart-wrenching as this was, it was not the worst. I understand that this issue was not at the top of your agenda. I understand an emtional response immediately after a shock such as this, but now, you have had a week, you are or soon to be head of the department of education; I would hope that facts are more important to you. As several have already suggested, it would behoove you to respond with facts and figures, not emotional touch feely reasons for your position on school safety.

          • SusanBeehler

            A just saying …..you have hit reply to me, why are you addressing me like I am a head of “what” department. Don’t like touchy feelly get robots teach your children or leave them in a room with the Internet so how they would turn out.

          • Bat One

            Susan, Your denial not withstanding, we HAVE tried gun control. Lots of it. As posted elsewhere yesterday, Connecticut, where the shootings happened, has some very stringent gun control laws on the books. They were rated the #4 state in the country by the folks at Brady. The shooter, Lanza, stole the weapon(s) he used, and despite the ringing endorsement of the Connecticut gun control structure by gun control advocates like you, he still managed to slaughter 7 adults and 20 children before taking his own life. Gun control didn’t work. Its time to try something else instead, and stop ignoring the Second Amendment.

          • SusanBeehler

            Alot of people do not call it stealing when you take something from a household member. Why did his mom need the bushmaster? Something could be done about allowing that kind of “toy” for your kid to borrow or as you say steal.

          • Lianne

            If my child took money from my purse without my permission, it is called stealing.

          • SusanBeehler

            Yes I would too. The gun thing we will never know if permission was granted, so to call it stealing is kind of misleading as far as the story goes, all we know it was the mother’s gun, whether he borrowed it or stole, who knows they are both dead. Again why did his mom need the bushmaster? As a society I believe we can find other forms of recreation that do not have the capability of taking 20 kindergartners’ life. As a society why have we diluted the Constitution to a form of recreation when our forefathers did not write the right to “bear arms” for your recreational enjoyment and entertainment. Those unwilling to discuss the control of the types of weapons which can annihilate in a few seconds/minutes have twisted and perverted the constitution for their own selfish reasons.

          • $8194357

            Permission was granted?
            He shot her four times in the face..
            Sheesh..

          • 308T

            You can’t have a reasonable conversation with an irrational fool like SB. I’m beginning to think she’s Mike Quinns love child.

          • $8194357

            Insert cause or group here….

            Funny how that indoctrinated
            libtard B/S works huh.
            Creates radicles in denile with
            religous like devotion to the ideology.

          • Bat One

            If the gun was “borrowed” – and there is no evidence whatsoever to suggest this – and this was done – obviously – under false pretenses with the intent to commit murder, then legally that constitutes theft. Consult a prosecutor if you don’t believe me.

          • Bat One

            Now, if you are done quibbling pointlessly, please offer a constitutionally acceptable solution that you can show would have protected the Sandy Hook children better than the state gun control regimen currently in place. I don’t think you can do it, but I’m willing to entertain any reasonable suggestion.

          • SusanBeehler

            And this is important to you, why?

          • Lianne

            Boy if that statement doesn’t reveal how libs feel about the Constitution, nothing does.

          • Bat One

            Surely you aren’t so addled as to suggest that Adam Lanza’s mother “loaned” him the gun with which he killed her. Look, if you don’t know what a Bushmaster is – and what it isn’t – you’re in no position to quibble with me over the precision with which I use the words I choose.

            When you can offer a suggestion that is constitutionally permissible, and can convince the rest of us that your suggestion would have worked to save the Sandy Hook children when the 4th rated gun control regimen in the country did not, please be sure to let someone know..

          • $8194357

            Susan..
            What gives you or any liberal the right to
            take my freedoms and liberties away?
            Constitutionaly protected I might add..

          • SusanBeehler

            Not good enough

          • sbark

            The Emotionally deficient in this arguement are forgetting this is simply another crisis too good to waste. Obama could care less about these kids. He is sitting in a private room debateing how best to take advantage of this moment in history—to create bigger time in history.

            People have to look at this in the big picture contest of Left wing history——-Left wing Govt take away weapons to make you weaker than he is, so he can do something to you that you wouldn’t let him do if you were

            but….you find that fact in the public education system

          • Lianne

            Your emotions are running rampant. This is NOT a perfect world.
            So answer your own question:
            How many guns are used in defense vs suicides?
            How many are used for protection vs ‘recreation’?

            btw, helmets are proving to be defenseless against concussions. Eliminate football?
            Conn. has some of the strictist gun laws in the nation. Adam was mentally ill, found the waiting period too long when he went to purchase a gun, went home, and stole his mother’s guns. Even if he had agreed to the waiting period, was there any documentation on file about his illness that would have prohibited the sale?
            And as long as you want to continue to throw out hypotheticals, what would have stopped him from building bombs planting around the school? No one would have even had a chance.
            You mentioned the Constitution. It is the set of laws upon which this country was built. It is unique to this country. I agree, working within the framework of the Constitution challenges the brain; but if we want those freedoms and liberties, we must learn to do just that.

          • SusanBeehler

            You wouldn’t want me to talk about football. Maybe he didn’t know how to make bombs, and maybe his mom’s gun was easier than waiting because she had taught him how to use and more than likely how to access it. I would be willing for a law to ban this type of gun/rifle and the ammo and a law to require better background check so his mental illness would have been revealed, the school system seem to know there was some kind of developmental or mental issue. I would also be willing to have the law challenged on whether it is constitutional to ban this and additional background check. Something has to be done, so what is your idea don’t let the children go to school without being armed or the teachers being armed or just let this type crime keep playing out in our schools?

          • Lianne

            You mentioned helmets—I leapt to football, I guess I could discuss the one case I saw where the motorcyclist suffocated when his helmet fille with dirt and sand as he skidded our of control. Is that better?
            I have opened the door for pulling the treatment of mentally ill out of the dark ages and yet you refuse to go there. This kid was intelligent, computer savy and mentally ill. It is easy learn how to build a bomb right here on the internet and he had lost the self control to stop his violent actions.

          • SusanBeehler

            I didn’t mention helmets you did

          • SusanBeehler

            Or stop abusing the second amendment for entertainment, recreational purposes

          • Lianne

            First, please define for me what you mean by “abusing the second amendment for entertainment, recreational purposes”. Then, explain what stopping that abuse will do?

          • tony_o2

            What do you consider recreational purposes? Target practice? If you are going to own a firearm, you better know how to use it. That means target practice. Just because you enjoy practicing, doesn’t mean that you are “abusing the 2nd amendment”.

            Should an army ever invade the U.S., will you be content with your neighbors only owning black-powder muskets and little pea-shooters? Or will you be glad that your neighbors own effective weapons and know how to use them?

          • SusanBeehler

            The last army to invade the US, no gun owner stopped them, we have our military for this. If you want to defend against an invasion, join the military. How many guns are used in defense compared to suicide may be a place to look? Are guns really being used for protection or are most used for recreation? Just like we have helmets for playing football there is no reason why we can’t come up with ways for keeping safe while having some guns. There is no reason other than the fun of firing something like a bushmaster for an average American to own one. The Constitution is being abused by using the intended purpose of defense for the majority of use recreation or in the Connecticut case; killing civilians, not intruders, children; not invaders, children. The gun owners, I know receive great enjoyment owning and shooting their guns, just like watching television, riding a bike and other types of recreation. Some just like guns like a knick knack, they like looking at them and owning them setting them on shelve and then showing others them. This is what the second amendment is protecting? My point is the availability to use some kind of gun would not be affected, but maybe you won’t be able to have the multiple rounds fire in rapid succession maybe we could tighten the background check process and you may have to wait for another weekend to play with your “toy”. But wouldn’t this be a tiny sacrifice if we could prevent the deaths of our children? These things have not been tried, dabbled with but gun owners want it all and are willing to sacrifice our children for their target shooting recreation activity and than distort this recreation activity as a “right”. When was a bushmaster used by the majority of the owners to protect from a enemy invasion in your neighborhood? This is abuse of our Constitution for gun owners personal enjoyment, the “fun” of it has clouded judgment of what are you really protecting? We can limit types of guns and ammo and do better background checks and still own guns, while still keeping the spirit of the second amendment in tack.
            Our children, our future country deserve it, just like our forefathers gave thought to the second amendment , so should our fathers of today!

          • tony_o2

            How can you be sure that our homeland will never be invaded by a major army and that our citizens will never have to take up arms to defend themselves? How can you be sure that our military would be able to protect every corner of our country at a moments notice, even though we have them scattered throughout the world? You can’t be sure. You don’t want to think about the unthinkable, so you just dismiss it as absurd.

            Well think about this. How many innocent people could die because they had no way to defend themselves? If a lone gunman can kill so many in such a short time, how many people do you think an army could kill before our military arrived?

            It’s tragic that these massacres happen. But that isn’t reason enough to disarm our people and pray that civilians will never need to protect themselves from an army.

          • SusanBeehler

            Who is ignoring the second amendment?

          • two_amber_lamps

            You speak of how difficult a teacher’s job is… the DIFFICULTY is the constraints we’ve placed upon teachers to keep discipline in the classrooms, the difficulty we’ve placed is the proscribed leftist indoctrination which teachers are forced to pass off as education (or are party to by acquiescence/active support).

            Can you be assured a lunch lady won’t leave a knife within reach of a student? How about a baseball bat? That’s certainly a deadly weapon. What about those old desks with the lift-top storage? I’m sure you remember getting clonked a time or two on the head by that contraption. Should they have been outlawed? The rope we used to climb in gym class? Surely you could die from that. Children die on buses being transported to and from school.

            Therefore we should get rid of mass transit and physical education.

            “Dont let “drunks”, “domestic violent offenders” get guns, suicidal people get guns.”

            Hello… McFly? The ATF background check already bars such individuals from purchasing/obtaining firearms. Ownership for said individuals is in itself a felony. Get with the program, it’s already been covered.

            But let’s face it, your agenda is to strip gun ownership from everyone isn’t it?

            Be honest… or at least be honest with yourself.

            Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety. –Benjamin Franklin

          • SusanBeehler

            Hello, it is not a felony to drive drunk, domestic violent offenders are often charged with a lesser crime than which would show up on the background check. Self policing of the applicant to have them be honest about certain things is not effective, such as the mental health question on the application. I want to have guns like the bushmaster banned nothing kidding about that.

          • two_amber_lamps

            Lol…. is “bushmaster” to be the new hate phrase for the leftist anti-gun fascists? Bushmaster is a manufacturer who makes various AR-15 models, nothing more. But thanks for the levity….

            Here’s a chart to help you brush up on your firearms identification…

            http://i259.photobucket.com/albums/hh288/krispos42/Unsorted/journalist_gun_ID_chart.jpg

          • SusanBeehler

            Can’t call it a gun, can’t call it an assault rifle, so I decided to call it what it was. Any gun which can be loaded in a few seconds by the average person and get off several rounds in a few seconds/minutes whatever needs to be banned, that is why in a previous blog I suggested the black powder musket being allowed because it is not very user friendly in our “got have now” society. Who cares what you want to call it, if it is very efficient at taking out many people in a short period of time, than I would be all for limiting/banning it. Pick which one are necessary for you to use to put food on the table for your family and get rid of the rest.

          • Bat One

            Sorry, Susan. But you aren’t going to get your wish. Words are important and those used in legal definitions all the more so. The Constitution says the right to “keep and bear arms… shall not be infringed.” And the Supreme Court has stated that that right is a “fundamental and individual right.” And neither the Constitution nor the court has said anything about a “food on the table” restriction. If you want to get rid of guns, you will ultimately have to get rid of Heller v. District of Columbia, McDonald v. Chicago, and the Second Amendment of the Bill of Rights. Good luck storming the castle!

          • $8194357

            The second Amendment was put in place because the
            Founders knew tyrany, evil and corrupt governance never rests.
            I will die with my gun in hand before some leftist nanny stater
            tells me they can ‘choose for me’ how to exercise my God given
            right to self defence.
            Its not about hunting or the shooting sports..
            Its about protecting life and property from bad folks
            with bad intentions wether they are regular crooks
            or work for the government crooks..

          • SusanBeehler

            Like your perverted twist on what is good? Oh ye of little faith, just think if you had a mustard seed worth. If it is for your protection what happened to your armor and why is so much force needed? A black powdered musket can protect, a knife can protect and how many triggers can you pull at one time. I think guns we have today are beyond protection more for the entertainment and overkill.

          • $8194357

            So you believe I have a perverted twist on what is good….
            So did all those facist statist mass murderers who slaughtered
            millions for their own ideologies who as well supported limiting civilian gun ownership or rights…

            I thought ya had your poop in a group on measure 2, but your on the same side as jihadist Caliphates,
            Hitler, Lenin, Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot,
            Castro..ect..ect..ect..on this subject Susan..
            Bad company your keeping, huh.

          • SusanBeehler

            I do think you have a distorted view on the world, you funnel incidents of evil to cloud the pictures of the free choice God allows to have. It comes across only as what you label good as what is “right”. Just because I believe we can and should limit the sale, the use of certain types of guns does NOT make me a fascist or a liberal and the other labels you throw at me. For me it reveals your weakness and your lack of faith.

          • $8194357

            Gods Wisdom or mans wisdom and understandings?
            The devil leads men thru deception and ideological lies.
            God tells us the Truth even tho we don’t want to Hear it.

            Heavenly Versus Demonic Wisdom
            Mans understandings or Gods?

            Is this your own conclusion Susan?
            Sounds alot like the girls on the View, The Talk, ect.ect.
            as well as Dr. Phil.

            There is Good and there is evil..

            Can salt water flow from a fresh water spring
            and not contaminate the fresh?

            James 3:11-13
            New King James Version (NKJV)

            11 Does a spring send forth fresh water and
            bitter from the same opening?

            12 Can a fig tree, my brethren, bear olives,
            or a grapevine bear figs?
            Thus no spring yields both salt water and fresh.

            13 Who is wise and understanding among you?
            Let him show by good conduct that his works
            are done in the meekness of wisdom.

            Daniel 2:13-15
            New King James Version (NKJV)

            13 So the decree went out,
            and they began killing the wise men;
            and they sought Daniel and his companions, to kill them.

            God Reveals Nebuchadnezzar’s Dream

            14 Then with counsel and wisdom Daniel answered Arioch,
            the captain of the king’s guard,
            who had gone out to kill the wise men of Babylon;

            15 he answered and said to Arioch the king’s captain,
            “Why is the decree from the king so urgent?”
            Then Arioch made the decision known to Daniel.

            Daniel 5:13-15

            New King James Version (NKJV)
            The Writing on the Wall Explained

            13 Then Daniel was brought in before the king.
            The king spoke, and said to Daniel,
            “Are you that Daniel who is one of the captives from Judah,
            whom my father the king brought from Judah?

            14 I have heard of you, that the Spirit of God is in you,
            and that light and understanding and excellent wisdom
            are found in you.

            15 Now the wise men, the astrologers,
            have been brought in before me,
            that they should read this writing and make known
            to me its interpretation, but they could not give the
            interpretation of the thing.

            Luke 11:48-50
            New King James Version (NKJV)

            48 In fact, you bear witness that you approve the
            deeds of your fathers; for they indeed killed them,
            and you build their tombs.

            49 Therefore the wisdom of God also said,
            ‘I will send them prophets and apostles, and some of
            them they will kill and persecute,’

            50 that the blood of all the prophets which was shed from
            the foundation of the world may be required of this generation,

            Job 12:11-13
            New King James Version (NKJV)

            11 Does not the ear test words
            And the mouth taste its food?

            12 Wisdom is with aged men,
            And with length of days, understanding.

            13 “With Him are wisdom and strength,
            He has counsel and understanding.

            Proverbs 1

            New King James Version (NKJV)
            The Beginning of Knowledge

            1 The proverbs of Solomon the son of David, king of Israel:

            2 To know wisdom and instruction,
            To perceive the words of understanding,
            3 To receive the instruction of wisdom,
            Justice, judgment, and equity;
            4 To give prudence to the simple,
            To the young man knowledge and discretion—
            5 A wise man will hear and increase learning,
            And a man of understanding will attain wise counsel,
            6 To understand a proverb and an enigma,
            The words of the wise and their riddles.

            7 The fear of the Lord is the beginning of knowledge,
            But fools despise wisdom and instruction.

            Shun Evil Counsel

            8 My son, hear the instruction of your father,
            And do not forsake the law of your mother;
            9 For they will be a graceful ornament on your head,
            And chains about your neck.

            10 My son, if sinners entice you,
            Do not consent.

            11 If they say, “Come with us,
            Let us lie in wait to shed blood;
            Let us lurk secretly for the innocent without cause;
            12 Let us swallow them alive like Sheol,
            And whole, like those who go down to the Pit;
            13 We shall find all kinds of precious possessions,
            We shall fill our houses with spoil;

            14 Cast in your lot among us,
            Let us all have one purse”—

            15 My son, do not walk in the way with them,
            Keep your foot from their path;

            16 For their feet run to evil,
            And they make haste to shed blood.

            17 Surely, in vain the net is spread
            In the sight of any bird;
            18 But they lie in wait for their own blood,
            They lurk secretly for their own lives.
            19 So are the ways of everyone who is greedy for gain;
            It takes away the life of its owners.

            The Call of Wisdom

            20 Wisdom calls aloud outside;
            She raises her voice in the open squares.
            21 She cries out in the chief concourses,
            At the openings of the gates in the city
            She speaks her words:

            22 “How long, you simple ones, will you love simplicity?
            For scorners delight in their scorning,
            And fools hate knowledge.
            23 Turn at my rebuke;
            Surely I will pour out my spirit on you;
            I will make my words known to you.

            24 Because I have called and you refused,
            I have stretched out my hand and no one regarded,
            25 Because you disdained all my counsel,
            And would have none of my rebuke,
            26 I also will laugh at your calamity;
            I will mock when your terror comes,

            27 When your terror comes like a storm,
            And your destruction comes like a whirlwind,
            When distress and anguish come upon you.

            28 “Then they will call on me, but I will not answer;
            They will seek me diligently, but they will not find me.

            29 Because they hated knowledge
            And did not choose the fear of the Lord,
            30 They would have none of my counsel
            And despised my every rebuke.

            31 Therefore
            they shall eat the fruit of their own way,
            And be filled to the full with their own fancies.

            32 For the turning away of the simple will slay them,
            And the complacency of fools will destroy them;

            33 But whoever listens to me will dwell safely,
            And will be secure, without fear of evil.”

          • SusanBeehler

            Even Satan can quote the bible , stop defending killing with the bible.

          • $8194357

            So you didn’t understand it huh.
            “Just Scripture” about Godly Wisdom

            vs decieved ideological mans understanding..
            No where in any of it did I defend killing with the Bible..
            That must be your own projection.

            2 Peter 2:17-19
            New King James Version (NKJV)

            17 These are wells without water, clouds] carried by a tempest, for whom is reserved the blackness of darkness forever.

            Deceptions of False Teachers

            18 For when they speak great swelling words of emptiness, they allure through the lusts of the flesh, through lewdness, the ones who have actually escaped[c] from those who live in error.

            19 While they promise them liberty, they themselves are slaves of corruption; for by whom a person is overcome, by him also he is brought into bondage.

            1 John 2:17-19
            New King James Version (NKJV)

            17 And the world is passing away,
            and the lust of it;
            but he who does the will of God abides forever.

            Deceptions of the Last Hour

            18 Little children, it is the last hour;
            and as you have heard that the[ Antichrist is coming,
            even now many antichrists have come,
            by which we know that it is the last hour.

            19 They went out from us, but they were not of us;
            for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us;
            but they went out that they might be made manifest,
            that none of them were of us.

            John 14:16-18
            New King James Version (NKJV)

            16 And I will pray the Father,
            and He will give you another Helper,
            that He may abide with you forever—

            17 the Spirit of truth, whom the world cannot receive,
            because it neither sees Him nor knows Him;
            but you know Him, for He dwells with you and will be in you.

            18 I will not leave you orphans; I will come to you.

            John 16:12-14
            New King James Version (NKJV)

            12 “I still have many things to say to you,
            but you cannot bear them now.

            13 However,
            when He, the Spirit of truth, has come,
            He will guide you into all truth;
            for He will not speak on His own authority,
            but whatever He hears He will speak;
            and He will tell you things to come.

            14 He will glorify Me,
            for He will take of what is Mine
            and declare it to you.

            1 Corinthians 2:3-5
            New King James Version (NKJV)

            3 I was with you in weakness, in fear, and in much trembling.

            4 And my speech and my preaching were not with persuasive
            words of human wisdom, but in demonstration
            of the Spirit and of power,

            5 that your faith should not be in the wisdom of men
            but in the power of God.

            Mans wisdom and understanding are but foolishness to God….

            1 Corinthians 1:18
            [ Christ the Power and Wisdom of God ]

            For the message of the cross is foolishness
            to those who are perishing,
            but to us who are being saved it is the power of God.

            1 Corinthians 1:21
            For since, in the wisdom of God,
            the world through wisdom did not know God,
            it pleased God through the foolishness of the
            message preached to save those who believe.

            1 Corinthians 2:14
            But the natural man does not receive
            the things of the Spirit of God,
            for they are foolishness to him;
            nor can he know them,
            because they are spiritually discerned.

            Who’s your daddy?

          • SusanBeehler

            So you think you are the only one, a chosen one blessed with the gift of discernment,Who is your Father?

          • $8194357

            Alot of a$$umptions being made on your part Susan.

          • Onslaught1066

            Plus she has father issues, he probably told her she was a lousy lay.

          • $8194357

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LojqhHnmyvc
            Wake up little Suzy..Its time to go Home…
            Jesus is coming and the world is in trouble deep…
            Wake up little Suzy…WAKE UP…

          • $8194357

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9k9cLBy0nGs
            Susan..
            The days are full of deception and evil…
            satan ideologies/globalist facist agendas are in
            high gear and gaining speed fast…

            Be Ye as innocent as sheep amongst wolves
            and careful of who’s advice and counsel you take to heart…

            Lenin..Stalin..Hitler… Mao…Pol Pot… Castro…Chavez…
            Gun banners every last one…
            and the whole dang Democratic party has been trying to disarm Amercans for a very long time…

            Barry as well has a “total nuclear disarmament agenda with America going “first” to show the rest of the world,
            who hates us we are peaceful…

            We have a wolf in charge of the hen house, Hear?

          • $8194357

            Guns are not the problem. People are the problem —
            including people who are determined to push gun-control laws,
            either in ignorance of the facts or in defiance of the facts.

            There is innocent ignorance and there is invincible, dogmatic, and
            self-righteous ignorance. Every tragic mass shooting seems to bring out
            examples of both among gun-control advocates.
            Thomas Sowell

            http://www.black-and-right.com

            Alinsky would sure be proud of what Barry has
            done with todays “New Left” and Americas so called media.

          • SusanBeehler

            People who believe guns are not part of the problem are part of the problem with school shootings. A school shooting would not happen without a gun and the ammo in it. Jesus would have never died for our sins if their would have been guns, because someone with the knee jerk reaction would have shot up the “tyranny” of the Rome government.

          • $8194357

            You are wrong and history proves you wrong..
            when good people are dis armed…
            Bad people start killing alot of folks.

          • SusanBeehler

            Ok, you are right, there is only black and white, good and bad. Only bad people kill people this is why some of the posters; yourself included want their guns so they can kill people to defend their home, land, their TV’s their whatever, they need to kill to defend. Yes you are right only bad people KILL.

          • $8194357

            And sheople are led to the slaughter willingly.

          • SusanBeehler

            Unless they are Jesus’ parents than they flee to the barn.

          • $8194357

            God gives His own Wisdom and understanding; Bread to eat
            that the world knows little or nothing about..
            Beware who you get your counsel from, no…
            You are sitting in the ideological realm (counsel) of
            Leninist, Stalinest, Hitler facist wanna bees and regurgitating
            what they have “fed America” for decades..
            But you say it is me who has weakness and lack of faith…
            go figure Susan..

            Isaiah 58:7-14
            New King James Version (NKJV)

            7 Is it not to share your bread with the hungry,
            And that you bring to your house the poor who are cast out;
            When you see the naked, that you cover him,
            And not hide yourself from your own flesh?
            8 Then your light shall break forth like the morning,
            Your healing shall spring forth speedily,
            And your righteousness shall go before you;
            The glory of the Lord shall be your rear guard.
            9 Then you shall call, and the Lord will answer;
            You shall cry, and He will say, ‘Here I am.’

            “If you take away the yoke from your midst,
            The pointing of the finger, and speaking wickedness,
            10 If you extend your soul to the hungry
            And satisfy the afflicted soul,
            Then your light shall dawn in the darkness,
            And your darkness shall be as the noonday.
            11 The Lord will guide you continually,
            And satisfy your soul in drought,
            And strengthen your bones;
            You shall be like a watered garden,
            And like a spring of water, whose waters do not fail.
            12 Those from among you
            Shall build the old waste places;
            You shall raise up the foundations of many generations;
            And you shall be called the Repairer of the Breach,
            The Restorer of Streets to Dwell In.

            13 “If you turn away your foot from the Sabbath,
            From doing your pleasure on My holy day,
            And call the Sabbath a delight,
            The holy day of the Lord honorable,
            And shall honor Him, not doing your own ways,
            Nor finding your own pleasure,
            Nor speaking your own words,
            14 Then you shall delight yourself in the Lord;
            And I will cause you to ride on the high hills of the earth,
            And feed you with the heritage of Jacob your father.
            The mouth of the Lord has spoken.”

          • Neiman

            The problem it seems is your willingness to limit guns through various means and not remain faithful to the Bill of Rights. Amend it properly by constitutional means or leave it alone. Allow government to abridge those rights by regulation is a sure path to State tyranny over the people.

            Regulations have the force of law and our government is forbidden to pass any laws infringing on our rights.

          • SusanBeehler

            My faith is not based on the bill of rights nor with a gun. Forbidden?! How has that bill of rights kept the Forbidden for women, the disabled, the unborn, the children?

          • Neiman

            I did not make it a matter of faith, but liberty and that includes all the Bill of Rights.

          • $8194357

            Wake up little Suzy WAKE UP…

            http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDFvYA90oNc

          • $8194357
          • SusanBeehler

            Despite what you are trying to share, no one knows the day or the hour and no gun will stop the Almighty.

          • Bat One

            Excellent! She criticized someone snidely for not knowing “headcount”, yet in a discussion about guns and gun control it turns out she doesn’t know a Bushmaster from a Beretta or a Bersa from a bazooka.

          • two_amber_lamps

            She just loves/hates the term “Bushmaster” because it starts with Bush.

          • SusanBeehler

            Ha Ha Ha, what would you like me to call you……. a “pussy”?

          • SusanBeehler

            Ha! Ha! you said Bush, I guess I can’t call you the picture you are “cat” .

          • Onslaught1066

            And ends with Master.

            [IMG]http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd146/WagnersinPeru/BushmasterSnake.jpg[/IMG]

          • $8194357

            I like my Beretta..
            I have a DPMS AR10 I’m found of as well..
            Hope Susan and Whoopie
            won’t take em away from me…

          • SusanBeehler

            So, Like I said if it can been be loaded and shot faster than a black powder musket, maybe it is time to further limit and control who gets one.

          • 308T

            LMAO! That’s a good one;)

          • two_amber_lamps

            Have we tried enough alcohol control? How’d that prohibition work out? You’re just another form of teetotaler… an authoritarian by any other name….

          • SusanBeehler

            So, And your point?

          • two_amber_lamps
          • $8194357

            But Whoopie and Susan say they know whats best for the collective and we have no rights to do things they have declared to be nonsense..

          • 308T

            More secure doors & gates? you mean like a stockade? That which you & Kirsten have been bitching about. Hypocrite much?

          • SusanBeehler

            Can’t have a dissicussion without name calling much? Besides a gun in the classroom what are your great ideas

          • 308T

            I guess not if you consider “hypocrite” name calling, even though it’s entirely appropriate to call you that. Your great ideas have been proven failures, mine haven’t been tried yet.

          • SusanBeehler

            Now you want to debate what is considered name calling? Really, you do not know what name calling is? Ask your school teacher wife if she would consider “bitching”, “dufus”, “ignorant fool”, “hypocrite” name calling, maybe she could teach you. My guess is you do not listen nor have your comprehended any of my ideas. My ideas of banning bushmasters and guns like it, banning large magazine clips, better background checks or the extreme one of only allowing black powder muskets and my comprise to guns in the classrooms ,allowing tasers in the classrooms have not been tried and cannot be proven failures because they have not been tried. Seriously what were your ideas besides guns in the classroom?

          • Lianne

            I would entertain the ideas of every adult in the schools being trained in the use of tasers. However, they are not effective through vests, the bullet-proof kind, not sure about the effectiveness of injecting the thigh. Would they penetrate leather chaps? Would we outlaw leather chaps? Why don’t you reserach that and get back to us. And also bring to the table ideas about how to bring mental illness treatment out of the dark ages.

          • SusanBeehler

            So your answer, is lets just keep things the way they are? Why don’t you do some research?

          • Lianne

            Many of us here have brought forth ideas, it is that you refuse to even entertain any of them and only push for banning the bushmaster. Not really a good exchange of ideas on your part.

          • SusanBeehler

            The ideas… no gun can ever be banned,…. the constitution should never be touched,…armed guards,… armed teachers and more guns. I entertained them and thought they were not very good ideas. Someone hinted at tasers, I could go along with, someone illustrated “layers” of protection, I could go along with, keeping guns out of the mentally ills hands, I would go along with just the means has to be defined. Did I miss any other “ideas”?

          • 308T

            Columbine murders happened in 1999, right in the middle of the last ban on guns like the Bushmaster & 30 round magazines, that worked out great! It’s not a clip,know the difference, you live up the the word ignorant by calling a magazine a clip. Background checks didn’t stop VA tech,Tuscon,Clackamas or Newtown. Because the murderers didn’t have a criminal record or documented mental history so they passed a background check(VA tech,Tuscon) or they stole the guns(Oregon,Connecticut). Good luck with your little taser against ANY kind of firearm, muskets included. As for the “name calling”, like I said it isn’t name calling if it fits. Many say “liar” is name calling but if someone is lying that’s what I call them, a spade is a spade. Let teachers arm themselves if they wish with proper training & armed guards by all entrances that are easily breached. If we can dole out a billion dollars to pay for illegal aliens to shack up here we can damn sure kick them out & use that billion to hire security for our schools. Tough times call for tough & common sense solutions. I’m done continuously proving you wrong & correcting you so have a merry Christmas & happy new year.

          • SusanBeehler

            Merry Christmas!

          • sbark

            They mayb could’ve done those things if Obama had not cut 200 million of funding specifically for school security …..he took the money and diverted to Educ Unions.

          • camsaure

            that would eliminate most liberals

          • dakotacyr

            We do what Australia has done. When was the last time they had a mass murder? anyone???

          • $8194357

            Home invasion and robbery went up drasticly after
            the gun bans were installed.
            If your not safe in your home your not safe anywhere.
            I love my country…
            It is tyranical government I fear….

          • awfulorv

            Now that you ask, they had a mass murder in Port Arthur in 1996. A fellow killed 35 and wounded 23 others. I think that qualifies, does it not?

          • http://proof-proofpositive.blogspot.com/ Proof

            “It is a common fantasy that gun bans make society safer. In 2002– five years after enacting its gun ban –the Australian Bureau of
            Criminology acknowledged there is no correlation between gun control and the use of firearms in violent crime. In fact, the percent of murders
            committed with a firearm was the highest it had ever been in 2006″

            http://www.ncpa.org/sub/dpd/index.php?Article_ID=17847

          • Hal637

            That would violate the Bill of Rights, but that doesn’t bother Statists like you.

          • two_amber_lamps

            “I am not denying anything”

            Then what are you suggesting as an alternative? Reduce the number of guns? Keep guns off campus? Better lock-down plans?

            The ostrich approach has been tried, it has failed.

            Does every teacher/staff member have to carry? Don’t be silly. Should a teacher who conscientiously objects to such? No. Pregnancy? Thank you for the lesson in argumentum absurdum.
            Do I need to know what a teacher goes through every day? What will they go through when perhaps they have to ruminate over the thought that if they’d been properly equipped at the time of the incident they could have DONE SOMETHING rather than watch those children mowed down senselessly before them.

            You’d deny the right of consenting staff members to carry and take responsibility for the children they’ve been charged with… that’s absurdity.

          • RCND

            Cops get pregnant and manage to carry without any more difficulty than a normal pregnancy gives to any other aspect of their life.

          • SusanBeehler

            How many compared to the teacher population? Get REAL!

          • RCND

            What does the number matter?

            You need reality. You really need to go take a deep breath, get your emotions under control, think about this logically, and rejoin the discussion then

          • two_amber_lamps

            Lil Ms. Suzy? Not gonna happen…

          • SusanBeehler

            You define reality without knowing what a head count is, I suppose you do not count the ammo you use either.

          • Lianne

            Getting a little snarky, and you may want to rethink what professional picture you want to create.

          • SusanBeehler

            And what professional picture would you like to see?

          • Lianne

            I guess I certainly think that ‘snarky’ is not setting an example for the teachers and students that you lead. I would expect dignity, decorum, and a discussion based in fact. Something that is most lacking in your posts.

          • SusanBeehler

            What is snarky? What profession other tha mother, gramma, small business owner do you think I am in?

          • Lianne

            Oh, so you do know who you are and you do have at least a couple of facts. I was really beginning to wonder if you thought you really were in control of the education system.

          • SusanBeehler

            Oh so you think this blog is some kind of club, only those for all guns and a head of department, excuse me for the intrusion I will go back to baking cookies!!!!!! NOT!!!

          • RCND

            when did you ask me what a headcount is? You are so wound up in emotion right now you don’t even know who you said what to

          • Lianne

            So, we have no male teachers or principals or custodian, or coaches
            in our schools? I sense a bit of sex discrimination. Also, there are many woman who hunt who are comfortable with a gun.

          • SusanBeehler

            Hunting and teaching in a classroom are two different activities

          • Lianne

            Actually, It depends upon what one is teaching.

          • $8194357

            I learned alot about politics sitting in a tree
            stand studying the animals.
            Hiding or camaflaging ones self until it is
            considered safe to “come out”.

          • Lianne

            :-)

          • $8194357

            ;-)

          • sbark

            so is getting an education–as in public education…………….and receiving actual knowledge in an educational setting.

            There are alot of low information voters as evidenced by our last election………and these are products of our Educ system: top to bottom

            beginning to think we have to go full circle——-the safest place for kids to receive actual knowledge might be back at homeschool level. It would break the pacification and propaganda cycle the left has been building for decades……

          • SusanBeehler

            Did I say that? Do the count, just guessing but I bet you may find a majority are women.

          • Lianne

            A majority of whom are women. And,btw, just guessing has no facts, only your ideas swimming around in your head, unchallenged.

          • SusanBeehler

            So

          • Lianne

            so, reality, facts, truth bear no meaning to the libs. Only form the mouth of libs if you are a patient fisherman or in my case, fisherwoman.

          • SusanBeehler

            Facts were more important than ideas when the constitution was written? Those silly guys, they thought black people were not people

          • camsaure

            By the way, that was democrats who were and are against blacks being citizens.

          • dakotacyr

            Israel has strict gun laws. Some guy on SAB posts a pic of someone carrying a gun and thinks everyone in Israel is armed. That is not true. If we really want to be Israel, then let’s institute all of Israel gun safety laws not just cherry pick those that support more and unlimited arms.

          • two_amber_lamps

            Lol… EVERYONE carries a gun in Israel?

            Bwhahahahhahahaaaaa….. OMG Rob, where do you come up with these maroons??? WHoooohahahahahahaa!

            All jokes aside, you and Ms. Suzy should go on tour… though you’re gonna have to work on expanding your act. The argumentum absurdum is only good the first time or two you use it before it gets stale.

          • SusanBeehler

            HA! Ha! you are a joker! and you can see everyone in Israel? OMG there are other people in North Dakota with opinions who are not the two amber lamps. HA! HA!

          • two_amber_lamps

            Dakotacyr said:

            “Some guy on SAB posts a pic of someone carrying a gun and thinks everyone in Israel is armed”

            Their quote… not mine.

            Yes Comrade, there certainly are two sides to every debate… some more totalitarian than others…. Your last name isn’t by chance Trotsky?

          • $8194357

            Just shut up and do as your told comrade citizen..
            They have their ways you know…
            The sheople will defend the tyranist ideology
            to the death because of the do gooder liberal cause
            it is cloaked in is near and dear to their decieved hearts.

          • Lianne

            I am beginning to wonder if someone other than the new head of our Dept of Ed is posting here. These posts are lacking in the dignity and decorum one would expect from her.

          • 308T

            I’m inclined to agree.

          • SusanBeehler

            I haven’t seen the dept of Ed posting, here what are you talking about? Who are you talking about?

          • $8194357

            In Israel,
            Every citizen of legal age is required to serve when called up..
            Comes with facist states and many enemies wanting to kill you..
            Kinda like Barry and his CPUSA cohorts in DC..

          • 308T

            My wife has been a teacher for almost 20 years in Bismarck, she has no problem with teachers having CCW rights & neither do the majority of other teachers at her school.

          • SusanBeehler

            And what do parents think? Your wife knows every Bismarck teacher opinion, she must of not talked to Kirsten. Kirsten has worked in Bismarck schools 22 years. Or are your ears made with selective hearing, “guns and more guns only answer”

          • 308T

            I said AT HER SCHOOL not every school in Bismarck. try and keep up.

          • SusanBeehler

            Yes, and I said what do the parents think? Parents outnumber teachers. So she took a poll at her school and they have no problem with bringing guns to school as long as they have the CCW permit.

  • RCND

    She does not even support school resource officers, who are cops, to be allowed to carry their weapons. Naive. Very naive

  • Guest

    Anyone who thinks that arming teachers is a solution to ending school shootings has played way too many video games. Law enforcement officials who train extensively to deal with this situation would have a difficult time acting in this situation, yet now we’re going to expect school teachers to deal with it.
    I also find it interesting that the party that doesn’t want to spend any money on education whatsoever and thinks that expanding class sizes isn’t a problem, wants to have a gun in every classroom. That’ll work out real great, 40 second graders, 1 teacher, and a firearm.

    • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

      Law enforcement officials who train extensively to deal with this situation would have a difficult time acting in this situation

      In Newtown, CT, the cops took 20 minutes to respond to a shooting that was over in minutes.

      You have no idea what you’re talking about.

      • Guest

        Rob, once again you’re displaying your idiocy for everyone to see. The U.S. military trains extensively in situations l like this where they are returning fire at an attacker. It’s an extremely high stress situation, which affects accuracy and decision making. Currently, they average between 50K-75K rounds fired per hit. Now some of that is cover fire in combat, but still they’ll be first to tell you that accuracy is severely compromised when returning fire on an attacker. I know you have this Rambo fantasy where your fatass would save us all in the event of an attack but you’re far more likely to misfire and harm innocent others than you are to be of any use in this situation.

        • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

          What you’re ignoring is the impact on the shooter of facing armed citizens rather than an unarmed mob.

          That can save lives.

          • SusanBeehler

            If he has a bigger gun than yours and is better trained, plus the adrenaline of being on a mission, the element of surprise, you are fooling yourself if you think one teacher with a gun and 20 little lives to protect stands a change against someone bent on taking lives while committing suicide, he doesn’t care, the teacher does. Guns are a false sense of security for those threatened. Children at this age of 5 and 6 have difficult time discerning the reality of a gun versus a gun on a cartoon or video game, children do not believe they could die, and the teacher is going to be distracted by gun battle rather than gather the children to escape. Obviously most gun totters on this blog have not worked with large groups of children especially young children. They are called innocent for a reason, because they do not even understand what is real, for goodness sake they believe Santa is real. Get a clue and start talking real solutions not more violence, because more carrying guns will not mean less violence, it is just more carrying guns, and for these shooters; what would they care they are going in knowing they will die, they don’t CARE!!!!!

          • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

            If he has a bigger gun than yours and is better trained, plus the adrenaline of being on a mission, the element of surprise, you are fooling yourself if you think one teacher with a gun and 20 little lives to protect stands a change against someone bent on taking lives while committing suicide

            Maybe, Susan, but the armed teacher would stand a better chance than the unarmed teacher, don’t you think?

          • yy4u2

            Sounds like Ms Wheeler is writing from some hospital getting her knee repaired or skin grafted on to her shins from the obvious knee jerk reaction she is having. So worst case scenario, the shooter takes out one teacher and twenty students and best case, one shooter dead, is not an option for her. She gets to choose, yet the teacher shouldn’t be allowed to if they want to carry and the parent shouldn’t be able to choose a school that allows this. These people are laughable.

        • NDConservative2011

          Hey Guest – Once again you show your command of a debate by name calling and personal attacks. I could end with a “YOU DUMB ASS”, but I will refrain as one would not gain much by lowering themselves to your level.

        • JW-American

          So you are saying that the scumbag coward shooter in Newtown CT sprayed 800K to a million rounds to hit 26 people? I don’t think so. How bad of a shot do you have to be to be a teacher hiding behind her desk pointing at the door 8 feet away? keep pulling the trigger till something stops either him or your magazine well emptying.

          So ND is some island that is isolated from Crimes like this? How ’bout our own Newtown ND where that shred od debris killed Grandma and the 3 babies from up North? Or the school outside of MSP 2 years ago McCory? that had issues, or the reservation school shooting White Earth was it? We have dirtbags that live all around us, some are just one Meth hit away from zombie status. May we all be vigilant and prepared.

          • SusanBeehler

            Domestic Violence

      • mikemc1970

        You have no idea what you’re talking about.

        Having no clue is not a deterrent to espousing ones ideas for the typical liberal. Feelings are always much more important than facts and logic.

  • reggy

    ND has the lowest violent crime rate in the country; I think her stance of avoiding a bunch of panic-driven policy and spending decisions is prudent.

    • RCND

      I don’t think Newtown was real high on the violent crime list either

    • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

      I don’t necessarily disagree. I don’t think we need a knee-jerk response.

      That being said, I doubt Newtwon, CT had a very high crime rate. I doubt that school in Nebraska (which Baesler references) had a high crime rate. I’m guessing all the parents in those places believed, as most of us do here, that it couldn’t happen where they’re at.

      But then it happens.

      I think, at the very least, we ought to end gun free zones. Let CCW carriers, up to and including school employees, carry their weapons.

    • badlands4

      No we don’t. Maine has the least violent crime. We are at number six(source; 24/7wall street; April 2012). North Dakota’s score worsened by 50% between 1991 and 2010. If anything has changed North Dakota’s ranking since April of this year, I would appreciate your source so I can correct my information. Thank you.

      Read more: America’s Most (and Least) Peaceful States – 24/7 Wall St. http://247wallst.com/2012/04/26/americas-most-and-least-peaceful-states/#ixzz2FQYX71jt

      • badlands4

        I actually need to correct myself. It looks like I misread North Dakota’s stats. If I am reading this correctly, we are the sixth most peaceful state, but we are actually number 8(least) in violent crimes excluding murder and 6th least in murders. Regardless, we are not the safest in either category.

      • reggy

        My source was the governor’s office (page 15): http://www.nd.gov/fiscal/docs/budget/execbudgetsummary2013-15.pdf

        Maybe that wasn’t the most trustworthy source of information. I just worry that we’re going to create the next TSA in response to the shooting, which would be mindbogglingly stupid and completely miss the point.

  • mikemc1970

    I have no problem with armed teachers. I’m not saying all teachers, but just a few, in each school, that have undergone the CLEET certifications that LEO undergo as well as a psych evaluation, should be allowed to carry a firearm.

    • RCND

      We have armed pilots and had no issues. We can definitely arm teachers who are willing to carry and go through the training. If we can’t trust them to carry, they should not be teaching our kids anyways

      • SusanBeehler

        Knowing how to carry a gun, does not equal being a qualified teacher. It may be the answer for some areas, but not everyone will want to carry guns in this career field. The discussion has to move beyond teachers carrying guns. The discussion can start with limiting or outlawing high powered rifles and guns which can be reloaded quickly by the average person; not allowing people arrested for several DUI’s (because they have a drinking problem) from owning guns; not allowing people convicted of assault or domestic violence owning any gun; these are all places to start. I don’t want our schools to be a place where a gun battle could happen.

        • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

          It may be the answer for some areas, but not everyone will want to carry guns in this career field.

          Nobody is asking that all teachers be required to carry guns. Only that teachers who want to carry guns, who qualified for their CCW, be allowed to carry guns.

          What’s really putting the bulls eye on these schools is making them “gun free zones.”

        • RCND

          Schools are already a place where bad things can happen because of an armed intruder. I would rather the good guys have a chance to win than be fish in a barrel. People convicted of domestic violence already can’t possess firearms; its called the Lautenburg Amendment. The other issues of who has their rights to keep and bear arms restricted based on criminal records can be discussed. Outlawing weapons has already been proven not to work either. Even if it happens, what is you plan to confiscate them all? Good luck with that

  • The Fighting Czech

    I think the gun free zone should be eliminated. Teachers/ staff should be encouraged to get gun training… even if they dont intend to carry. The ones that do want to carry, should be encouraged. then the signs at the front door. should read, Gun possession is allowed on premises. Teachers and staff members are encouraged to “carry”. all armed visitors must identify themselves at the front office as such and show current conceal carry permit.

    Lots of training is nice, but sometimes you have to work with what your dealt with at the time.
    It would be nice to have a fire truck parked on my street when my house catches on fire, but odds are if my house does catch fire, (for the first 10 minutes anyway) its gonna be me, a 5 lb fire extinguisher, and the fire. not ideal situation to be in, but you deal with it with what you have….

    • JW-USA

      I think the gun free zone should be eliminated. Teachers/ staff should be encouraged to get gun training… even if they dont intend to carry. The ones that do want to carry, should be encouraged. then the signs at the front door. should read, Gun possession is allowed on premises. Teachers and staff members are encouraged to “carry”” Nothing could be more clearer.. I am saddened that Kirsten for whom I voted for, feels differently.

      • SusanBeehler

        I don’t. What is the age you could own a gun? 18? If so we could have alot of students during their senior year bringing a gun to school. Maybe we should up the age to 30 before you could own a gun, and require more classes, more waiting periods, more restrictions to own a gun, possess a gun.

        • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

          If I remember right, you can’t buy ammo until you’re 18, but you can own/possess a gun at 16.

          • SusanBeehler

            And steal your mom’s to shoot up a school or be slackwarerobert kid and have dad buy you one.

        • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

          Maybe we should up the age to 30 before you could own a gun, and require more classes, more waiting periods, more restrictions to own a gun, possess a gun.

          Maybe we should wait until 30 before people get the right to free speech too, Susan.

          That would make about as much sense.

        • slackwarerobert

          I got my first one at 6, my son at 8 (lefties are a pain, had to buy it) We brought guns to school all the time, no one ever was shot, just let the principle know we had it that day on the way in. High, brought my 12 gauge today. Brought my new 308 going to try it out at the range at lunch. Why do you fear someone being able to defend themselves? You are not going to shoot up the place when everyone else can shoot back.

  • cylde

    You do not need armed defense until you do, many teachers are veterans that could and would defend the children if they were allowed. You do not need to have military experience to be a responsible and capable gun handler.

  • Mike Peterson

    Every school in the country probably has a lock-down plan. Hiding in the bathroom might save one or two lives, but that doesn’t stop a massacre.

    • RCND

      All a lock down plan does is centralize sheep into pens for slaughter.

      • SusanBeehler

        So you rather have one gun and let the sheep scatter; really? We are not talking about sheep they were CHILDREN. When you reduce the value of a live of a human it is alot easier to make policy which only protects “sheep” and than do you really care?

        • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

          So you’d rather have the children all sitting in one place, sitting ducks and without anyone armed to protect them?

          Again, I think you need to spend some more time thinking about this Susan.

          • SusanBeehler

            Really you think this is what transpires in a situation when it unfolds. How many children have you worked with?

        • Thresherman

          I find the idea of the need to have an armed response in a school to be repulsive, but at the same time we need to face some facts. Thanks to Bill Clinton, our schools are a government mandated slaughter pen whenever some deranged individual decides to end his personal torment by going on a killing spree. The evidence of why such people choose to attack our children is on display right now on every news channel and show. In their warped minds, they are not butchering our children, they are vindicating themselves with the whole world watching. The government and the media created this nightmare and they only way it is going to end is when the incentive to the killers is taken away.
          The uncomfortable fact for many to accept, is that the only way to stop a murderous madman armed with a weapon, any weapon, is when other people with weapons stop him. There is a word for those who bring bare hands to a knife fight, that word is deceased.
          No one objected to putting armed marshals on flights to prevent terrorist highjackers, who preyed on another group of unarmed people, so until the govenment and the media decide to admit they have made mistakes, highly unlikely, we need to apply the same sense to our schools to protect our children from the fallout of the acts of a stupid government and a greedy media.

          • SusanBeehler

            The majority of flights are not a majority of children

          • slackwarerobert

            I don’t remember an age limit on the right to life. Why do you only want adults to not be slaughtered? But I don’t want hot headed thugs like I watched on TV in wisconsin and michigan carrying guns either, just let those who already carry continue to carry. The only way your child wil be caught in a cross fire is if they are within range of the police who always spray and prey. We are held responsible for our rounds, and they only go where we put them.

        • RCND

          reference to sheep and sheepdogs… go read the post

          http://sayanythingblog.com/entry/sheepdogs/

    • two_amber_lamps

      Amen. At best it buys time… a few minutes, when an armed response from outside might be 10+ minutes away.

      Too much can happen in 10 minutes…. for the sake of this argument it’s an eternity.

    • SusanBeehler

      Hiding can help in limiting casualties and the more we can control the loss of life from this the better, the more difficult we make it for sickos to get their hands on high powered killing machines the better. A gun in school would not necessarily prevent any more casualties it could also cause “friendly” fire in a gun battle.

      • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

        That’s what we all want to do. Control the loss of life.

        Which is why we think having gun-free zones where our children gather, unprotected, as targets for lunatics is a bad idea.

        • SusanBeehler

          Who is the we? There are plenty of targets for lunatics.

          • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

            And yet, again and again, they choose the gun free zones around college campuses and schools.

            Like mouths to a flame.

          • SusanBeehler

            And malls, and parking lots and fast food restaurants, and movie theaters and post offices and military bases, all places which are NOT necessarily gun free zones. How are those concealed weapon warriors working in those places, again and again the citizen packing heat fail to protect in those areas, why would it work in a school?

          • John Wayne-American

            The fella that drew on the Scumbag in Washington State mall last week did his job.. what say you? You truley are hopeless.

          • SusanBeehler

            I guess I am not up on what happened in a Washington State mall, I did see what prevented alot more killings in a mall in Oregon was the shooters magazine jammed and the bullets stopped coming out, proving my point that if you don’t have the ammo you can’t shoot the gun!

          • slackwarerobert

            No, a citizen ignored the gun free zone sign and drew down on him. The gun still worked because he shot himself with it. If the gun jammed that is a sign of poor maintenance, or improper usage.
            A pistol in close quarters has the advantage over a rifle. You can’t just whip a rifle out of your pocket and surprise people with it. You can be seen from a distance and take appropriate action.

          • slackwarerobert

            Where do you live? Post office, military bases, those are all gun free zones in the US. 90% of malls also, fast food used to be in texas till they had enough of the killings in them. Now not an issue. parking lots still are in most places, FL finally passed a law to allow it. disney is still a killing zone though.

      • RCND

        I would rather my child take the chance of being caught in friendly fire than in a kill zone where no one who wants to protect him can. Unlike you I do know some things about the topic of dealing with an armed threat

        • SusanBeehler

          I rather have my child not caught by any bullet, the only way that would happen is no guns.

          • RCND

            Logic is a lost cause for you isnt it?

          • slackwarerobert

            I would rather have my child allowed to carry in school and he can decide if he wants to be shot or not. We never had problems when we carried our guns to school when I went. You obviously need education about fire arms because they are not to be feared unless you are intent on evil deeds.

  • borborygmi

    She is okay with the status quo. I am not. Armed guards has my support. It is the reality we have created.

    • SusanBeehler

      It is a reality which should and could be changed.
      Who is going to pay for these armed guards, the guns, the classes? Property taxes, give me a break, this conservative blog is talking about expanding government services by wanting another requirement of teachers and education rather than trying to control the people who do the crime by limiting their access to guns.

      • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

        Uh, no. This conservative blog isnt’ talking about that at all.

        This conservative blog is talking about taking the target off the backs of these school kids by ending the charade that is the “gun free zone.”

        They remain “gun free zones” until some lunatic or criminal shows up with a gun.

        Allowing teachers with CCW’s to carry their guns wouldn’t cost the taxpayers anything.

        • ellinas1

          You want to impose additional duties to the teachers without compensation?
          What about liability? Who pays for the time when an innocent is accidentally shot and his parents/relatives sue?

          • RCND

            No one ever said they would be forced to do it. That was never said. The voluntary option was all that was suggested. As to your lawsuit concerns, you are assuming circumstances will automatically happen to trigger one. The law can be written to add language like the clause in the Castle Doctrine Law forbidding such suits. No matter what, fearing the lawyers is not a good reason to not provide a lifesaving option

          • ellinas1

            And I never meant to say that it would be forced upon the teachers. Sorry it came out that way.

            Having said that good, luck changing the liability laws and good luck finding volunteers for this.

          • RCND

            The option should at least be available

        • dakotacyr

          Right only because you would expect the teachers to bring their own guns and ammo to school.

  • sbark

    When the locals loose control, and a Gov, or a state Super gets the blame for an incident, then is when schools are locked down with a vid. entrance camera to get “buzzed in” happens, or teachers at least carry with the kids outside during recess/exercise periods.

    No up and coming politician with bigger aspirations wants “an incidnet” on his record–thus steps will be taken.

    What is ironic is that Obama cancelled some 200 million in funding for school security systems over the past couple of years——–my guess he didnt save the money, the money just got diverted to proping up the teachers unions and thus money laundered back to the DNC in time for elections last Nov.

    Obama’s bloody hands keep getting bigger: fast and Furious, Bengahzi, School Security……

    good thing he cares about the working class

  • Teacher option

    I have no problem with teachers who want to be trained and carry concealed weapons. If it is an option, no one will know who or if anyone, or everyone, is armed which is a deterent. Now people know school buildings are gun-free zones. I doubt schools would become armed stockades! I carry, but do not boast. If people knew how many citizens are armed at their local Walmart or grocery store, I think they would be shocked.

    • SusanBeehler

      Property taxes going to pick up the tab?

      • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

        Allowing teachers who are qualified to concealed carry to bring their personal fire arms to school wouldn’t cost the taxpayers anything, Susan.

        • ellinas1

          Yes it will. The cost of the weapon, it’s maintenance, the ammunition, training and all other associated costs will be passed on to the taxpayer.

          • RCND

            If these are real costs, I’ll gladly pay them

          • ellinas1

            Fine with me.
            I was merely pointing that the no cost option is a fallacious fallacy.

          • JW -American

            The principle from MN on WDAY News last night carried his sidearm for 15 years, didn’t cost the district a dime…

        • Neiman

          Where is the term “qualified” in the 2nd Amendment?

      • camsaure

        All of a sudden a liberal is worried about taxes????

        • Dave

          All of a sudden conservatives are not.

  • 308T

    “She wants schools to remain “places of education, not armed stockades.” Tell me again how GREAT that’s been working out? If I’d have wanted a head in the clouds,out of touch with reality, liberal Superintendent I’d have voted for Potter.

    • SusanBeehler

      It has worked here in North Dakota. Her head is not in the clouds your head is stuck in your belt. You want your children taught in an armed stockades then teach them in your home, your stockade.

      • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

        I’m sure the folks in Newtown thought their school security policies were working too. Until they didn’t.

        • dakotacyr

          But you send on another thread that you feel perfectly safe going to the minot movie theater, a gun free zone. hm…..

          • slackwarerobert

            DC is a gun free zone, but I still carried. And no one was ever injured either. SS goons came very close to catching me with an illegal checkpoint, 2 min earlier and I would have been trapped.

      • 308T

        It worked in Newtown,CT until last Friday, wake up to the real world SusanBeehler! People like you have a dangerous lack of common sense.

    • slackwarerobert

      So how do the kids learn gun safety if they can’t even see a gun? We had shooting ranges under the gym. We shot guns in school. We used our guns, and the schools guns. We learned to load ammo as well. A very good education.

  • Hannitized, Proofs obsession

    Armed guards are part of it, so is more gun control. Sorry. It’s going to happen.

    • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

      No, gun control isn’t going to happen.

      • Neiman

        It depends on how you define the term, doesn’t it?

        Some increased regulations will be enacted in an emotional overreaction to Sandy Hook. I call any regulation gun control and unconstitutional.

  • Snarkie

    She’s right. Port just wants to spend more wasteful public money on school security.

    • Onslaught1066

      If only your wife had had a gun, and you didn’t drug her into a coma, and you didn’t smother her in her sleep… How much money did you save not wasting it on your wife?

    • http://sayanythingblog.com Rob

      Actually, Port wants to a) end gun free zones and b) allow teachers/school employees who are CCW holders to bring their weapons to school.

      Cost to the taxpayers? Zero.

  • whowon

    She does have a FB page…comment there?

  • spud

    I do not know of what kind of gun control measure could pass. Possibly going to a 30 round clip to 5 round. The idea of arming teachers you all should see the reality of that happening is zero. Having an armed guard or policeman is fine by me as long as school patron’s are footing it. Heck with some of drug issues we are doing it now in some of North Dakota schools. Not sure if that is a local paid issue or some kind of government grant. I think it is local but not sure at all. More news coming out everyday which tells me unless you were a marksman or damm lucky you had no chance against an armored intruder hell bent on killing. Scary everyone is pushing bills to eliminate this or that and we have no plan which will not intrude on constitutional rights that anyone is ready to agree on. Metal detectors bulletproof glass armed teachers sounds nothing like any schools any of us ever visioned for our children and family members children.

  • Lianne

    This is a very HOT topic right now with emotions getting in the way of logic. In ND, we have many many teachers who are avid hunters and are quite comfortable around guns. I believe that Ms. Beehler is quite uncomfortable around guns. Allowing guns by qualified staff does not mean that everyone would be carrying. There would be training required, steps that would need to be followed, but the bigger issue is that NO one need know which school has someone trained and which school does not. It throws off the attacker. For instance, the killer in Colorado chose that particular theater because it posted that it was a gun free zone and therefore, he knew no one would be armed.
    I do not own a gun nor have I ever shot a gun. I hadn’t even held a gun until about two years ago, but I believe the evidence proves that where there are guns, there is increased safety.
    I haven’t heard of any mass killings in inner city schools. Maybe there has been some, but I think we would have heard about it. I wonder if there are none, because we all know that kids are ‘packing’.
    Another solution would be to dismantle all schools, go to home schooling via internet, city blocks or whatever. That would remove the ‘mass’ from a centralized area and get the government out of schools to a great degree.

  • Flamejob5

    The way i read this is that Amy believes that offensive, non-law-abiding criminals yielding guns are acceptable in our schools but upstanding, law-abiding citizens carrying guns as a line of defense in our schools is clearly out of the question.

    Sounds like a terrific environment for a safe “place of education.” (sarc)

  • Neiman

    How much of you liberty are you willing to sacrifice for safety. The Bible says that when the world generally is crying out for peace and safety – suddenly, unexpectedly destruction will come upon the whole earth.

    You all are mostly crying for safety and willing to surrender to the State to achieve it.

  • Waski_the_Squirrel

    I haven’t made up my mind about guns in school. (I am a teacher and I am comfortable with guns, but I also know my colleagues.) However, the human element fails in many of the “common sense” solutions. For example, my school locks exterior doors and classroom doors all day. You can only enter the building through the office.

    The trouble is there are teachers (or even students) who will prop outside doors open. There have been cases when someone pounds on an outside door and a teacher or student lets them in without even knowing who they are. There are teachers who do not lock their classroom doors. I lock mine, but I share a storage room with a teacher who does not and actually will leave his door wide open when he is out of the room.

    When you study how most of these shooters work, you see that they go for targets of opportunity: classrooms that are open, locations where kids are in the open (cafeteria, library), and hallways. They will pass by locked classrooms. There are exceptions. Someone with a specific grudge or target will go after their target despite difficulty.

    There is no knee-jerk solution to this problem.

  • SusanBeehler

    So, Rob, did you have anything to do with closing the schools in Minot today?

  • JW -American

    Reading though this long thread, I see a theme… Adding armed guards (read more public employees) good, Giving teachers, janitors, and principles their Constitutionally protected right to keep and BEAR arms =bad..

    The defenseless cannot, by definition, defend against any armed intruder, whereas the prepared, trained and armed Social Studies teacher, may some day, be the Hero to hundreds of grateful parents.

    • SusanBeehler

      A social studies teacher in my book is already my hero by devoting their life/career to teaching our youth, no shooting or guns required to be a hero.

      • Lianne

        Sitting/standing in a classroom as a teacher, as important as teaching is, does not elevate to the same level as one who puts their life on the line to save another.

        • SusanBeehler

          So this is what you want a teacher that is trained also as a law enforcer/soldier? Not everyone is looking to be the hero you speak of and not everyone would apply for the job of teacher if it meant this was in their job description to have to die for others, sorry many people do not want to be sacrificed for the name of “hero”. Asking a teacher to carry a gun is like asking them to be willing to die in the line of duty every day. Can you imagine, if a teacher had a gun and didn’t win the battle, what would you “gunners” be saying about that teacher than? I think asking a teacher to carry a gun, is a huge request and one more thing added to the list they already have to do, it is not the place to start, getting rid of the access to the high powered rifles/ammo which are carrying out the job is the place to begin.

          • Lianne

            I nearly called you and idiot, but I stopped myself. You called teacher heros for the sacke of being a teacher. I refuted that statement. I guess I needed to be more clear in my statement and say teachers sitting a classroom are not putting their lives on the line to protect others as our police, firemen, military or the saves another person. Does that help?

          • SusanBeehler

            Must of got you shook up, you are typing faster than you can spell. Police, firemen and the military sign up for putting their lives on the line, it is part of their job description. Teachers jobs are to teach our children reading, writing, spelling or whatever they sign up for. The “Hero” you describe is not part of their job description, I think this expectation is unrealistic, maybe in your world, but I live in North Dakota.

          • Neiman

            A hero is one that knowingly places themselves in the line of fire to save the lives of other human beings. A teacher is a most valuable member of our society, albeit partisan teachers are not. They need and most deserve decent pay and working conditions and reasonable protection for themselves and their students, but unless they are in the line of fire and knowingly are risking their lives, they are not by definition heroes. Neither were most people on 9/11, what they mostly were, are murder victims, or would you say every murder victim by definition is a hero?

            Even firefighters and police officers, while doing their jobs, willing assuming the risks, are not heroes, not unless they are in a place of imminent danger and in an effort to defend innocent life place their own at risk.

            For God’s sake, everyone is not a hero. I served in Vietnam, but I was no hero. I served as a police officer, several times at risk of losing my own life to help others, but still no hero. I ran a rescue service, often risking my life to save others, still no hero. I worked in emergency medicine, playing a key role in saving many lives, still no hero. Get it yet? We must have some reasonable definition to call someone a hero, everyone cannot just by virtue of being alive be a hero; it is reserved for those people having a knowledge they will probably die in their efforts, but are still willing to take the risks involved, to save other human beings.

          • tony_o2

            You don’t have to ask teachers to carry guns. You allow teachers to carry guns if they are willing to sacrifice their own lives for the protection of the children.

            I think asking a teacher to carry a gun, is a huge request and one more thing added to the list they already have to
            do

            What if it was a teacher asking to be armed? Is it a “huge request” upon them to allow them to do something that they are willing to do? Should it also be a strict policy, under penalty of law, that a teacher cannot confront an attacker because other teachers are not as courageous?

            Not all teachers should have guns. Some of them may not be safe with a gun. But that’s not to say that all teachers are like that. Not all teachers are incapable of safely handling a firearm.

            I had a few teachers in high-school who were veterans. Are you saying that allowing them to carry a gun in school would be a huge request on them and that something that comes naturally to them would be “one more thing added to the list they already have
            to do”?

          • SusanBeehler

            Yes I am saying allowing them to carry a gun is a huge request. Confrontation is not always the best choice. If a teacher is asking to be armed maybe they are in the wrong career. Veterans which may be suffering from PTSD, it may be a even undesirable request. You think killing someone comes naturally?

      • Bat One

        Depends on what she is – and isn’t – teaching. If its more leftwing, Kum-Ba-Ya, for the good of the collective B.S., then she is anything but a hero in my view.

        • SusanBeehler

          No respect

          • Bat One

            I favor individuals over group identity. Period. As for respect, titles aren’t nearly as important as how you do what you do. Test scores over the past couple decades show that there are plenty of teachers who aren’t worth minimum wage, much less what they are actually paid.

          • SusanBeehler

            Aren’t you puffed up? Bash the career choice people had who give up their lives in this Ct situation. Demean the group “teachers” because you favor heros/individuals in your mind? How you do what you do? What is it you do?

      • camsaure

        sort of like the starving artist becoming famous after their death??

  • Bat One

    Susan, Its pretty clear from all your comments over the past week that you are opposed to firearms. And for you, that is fine. A person who doesn’t “like” guns, is afraid of guns, and abhors confrontation and violence, has no business owning a gun. Period. No person who is untrained and/or unwilling to use a gun should have one. But when you try to impose your own trepidation of firearms on the rest of us, you are intruding on our Second Amendment rights – rights which the Court has ruled are fundamental and individual. Those of us on/in the Right believe that an armed society is a polite society, to quote Heinlein. And reality has proven that to be so. If my kids were still in school, I would want them someplace where I knew someone on the premises was armed, trained, and willing to defend them.

    As for my home, the guns I keep at home are really a last resort… a constitutionally protected indulgence. My first line of defense is a large, well trained dog with a strong distaste for strangers.

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