Say Anything Blog

Rob, Senator Frist’s comments were badly distorted.  Here is his response at the VOLPAC blog:

http://www.volpac.org/index.cfm?FuseAction=Blogs.View&Blog_id=483

I’m currently overseas visiting our troops in Afghanistan, but I wanted to take a moment to address an Associated Press story titled, “Frist: Taliban Should Be in Afghan Gov’t.” The story badly distorts my remarks and takes them out of context.

First of all, let me make something clear: The Taliban is a murderous band of terrorists who’ve oppressed the people of Afghanistan with their hateful ideology long enough. America’s overthrow of the Taliban and support for responsible, democratic governance in Afghanistan is a great accomplishment that should not and will not be reversed.

Having discussed the situation with commanders on the ground, I believe that we cannot stabilize Afghanistan purely through military means. Our counter-insurgency strategy must win hearts and minds and persuade moderate Islamists potentially sympathetic to the Taliban to accept the legitimacy of the Afghan national government and democratic political processes.

National reconciliation is a necessary and an urgent priority … but America will never negotiate with terrorists or support their entry into Afghanistan’s government.

It looks like this AP story is just more of that liberal bias that lefties assure us doesn’t exist.

rob, I’m not sure I quite understand your line of thought.  Aren’t you warm to the idea of the Iraqi government doing the same thing we their domestic terrorist?

I personally heard Newt say that the military can’t win in Iraq, that it must be won politically and that war is far from being won.

I personally heard Newt say that the military can’t win in Iraq, that it must be won politically and that war is far from being won.

Which is why I think we’re in a bad predicament; it must be won by Iraqis who have proven themselve inept.

rob, I’m not sure I quite understand your line of thought.  Aren’t you warm to the idea of the Iraqi government doing the same thing we their domestic terrorist?

I’m open to the idea of the insurgency being brought into the government, not the terrorists.

There’s a difference.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

I personally heard Newt say that the military can’t win in Iraq, that it must be won politically and that war is far from being won.

Yes, I resign my commenterhood.

g’nite all.

Have a good time calling people creative names like stupid, idiot, and moron.

FreeRepublicans.com on September 19, 2006 at 03:31

Duh, let’s see our stated objective is to set Iraq up as a Democracy so that they run their own affairs.  Duh, would that mean that ultimately Iraq political success is the key for us getting out.  Duh.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

umm, and what does the insurgency does? doesn’t it try to achieve its goal by aiming to kill and terrorize the groups they oppose?

I’m open to the idea of the insurgency being brought into the government, not the terrorists.

umm, and what does the insurgency does? doesn’t it try to achieve its goal by aiming to kill and terrorize the groups they oppose?

rob, what are the difference betwen the Iraqi insurgents and the Taliban that make you have such divergent opinions of the two?

Interesting quoting yourself in successive posts.  I don’t think I’ve seen that before.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

umm, I don’t know how that happened, lol.

rob, what are the difference betwen the Iraqi insurgents and the Taliban that make you have such divergent opinions of the two?

The Iraqi insurgency is fighting against our occupation.  They’re attacking our troops, and they’re mostly local Iraqis.  The terrorists are foreign fighters in Iraq to undermine the Iraqi government.

They’re two different groups, and they haven’t exactly been getting along with one another.  IN the past I have said that I would support an amnesty deal with the insurgents who only attacked military targets.  That’s how peace is made.

But I do not support negotiating with terrorists or making them part of the government.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Taliban=terrorists and Iraqi insurgents=freedom fighters?

No, jackass.

There’s a difference between an insurgent and a terrorist.  The insurgents are fighting because they don’t like the U.S. occupation.  The terrorists are fighting because they want want to undermine the government.

There is a difference, whether you have the mental capacity to grasp it or not.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

thank you for your very enlighting responce.

I personally believe the Iraqi insurgents to be much worst at terrorizing both our military and innocent civilians than the Taliban.  But I’m just a jackass.

Does anyone else think this whole ‘fighting wars to win the hearts and mind of the slightly less radical Islamic fascists in order to establish democracy within the ME’ is not the purpose of war?

We are fighting first and foremost for US freedom, rights, and protection.  Trying to surgically remove the visible manifestations of Islamic fascism will leave the ideology very much alive even if all the terrorists are killed.  We will very likely face Islamic fascists at some point in the future.  All who are visibly spotted by this fascism should be extracted.

What this post is suggesting is even worse.  Some Republicans are considering allowing Islamic fascism to be absorbed into the Afghan democracy?  It sounds like some think democracy will anesthetize the terrorists.  When it wears off we’ll be facing Islamic fascism within democratically elected government or likely governments.  Now we’re talking WWIII. 

Democracy is not the cure for Islamic fascism, war is.

But I’m just a jackass.

Yes, you are.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

p.s. Al-Qaeda in Iraq is generally considered an insurgent group, most of its rank is made up of Iraqis fighting the ‘occupation’.

Here is a rather nice documentary, ..

The Insurgency

..it can be watched online.

I think you’re confusing the insurgency with what the media calls the insurgency.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Aren’t the insurgents currently fighting along side the terrorists?  Are they not sympathetic to the terrorists? 

Moderate Islamists sympathetic to the Taliban at the expense of US soldiers lives, their own liberty and the liberty of their fellow citizens, need to be eliminated not negotiated with.  How can these ever be trusted to defend and secure the liberty of their people?

I think you’re defining both the Iraqi insurgency and the Taliban in Afghanistan too narrowly.

I personally hold the Taliban to be less of a threat to domestic civilians, foreign civilians and our troops than the insurgency in Iraq is.

rob, what your definiton of the Iraqi insurgency, what’s you definition of the Talibans in Afghanistan?

From an earlier post:

It is important to differentiate between “terrorists” and “insurgents” in Iraq. Put simplisticly, terrorists are those who use atrocities to wage their war and/or are fighting against the formation of a democratic government in Iraq. Insurgents are typically just fighting because we Americans are in their country and they see us as occupiers. If the Iraqi government can get the latter to lay down their arms and engage in the democratic process in exchange for amnesty and the promised departure of American troops I think they have to go for it.

This is how peace is made. This is the way out of Iraq.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Rob, the AP story quotes Senator Martinez not Senator Frist as saying that negotiations are not “out of the question.”

Senator Frist is certainly not saying that we haven’t been using political means in Afghanistan.  He was simply emphasizing the importance of these political means after his meetings with commanders on the ground.

And finally, Senator Frist is in fact trying to clear up some wildly misleading reporting.  It wouldn’t be the first time for the AP, would it?

The problem here is the mixing of nomenclature. Lets begin with the Taliban. Taliban is not a single, monolithic structure, it is a conglomerate of militant, fundamentalist clerics, each with their own merry band of cutthroats and theifs, all of whom are seeking the greatest advantage for themselves. They live among the established Tribes, not in command of them, but at their sufferage. When they ran Afghanistan it was not as a “government” in any manner westerners would recognize. They attained power by assasinating the top leaders of the Muhajadeen and Provisional government and placed themselves and their trusted leutenants in the primary positions, then ran it in the manner of the original caliphate structure from the early years of Islam. Who everyone is speaking of bringing into the Afghani Government are the Tribal Leaders, who are not accepted by the Talibani Banditos as part of their clique. The tribal leaders, given the opportunity, will cut the throats of the Talibani clerics and frogmarch their bands of cutthroat theifs off to the executioner’s block. The problem with this is we are not imbuing the tribes with confidence that the Talibani clerics, and said bands of cutthroat theifs, will not regain control. To further muddy this puddle, every one, from the Dept of State to the EU and UN, and the Arab League keep scrambling all these disperate groups together as if they are just one giant Baby Huye, bumbling around crying because no one will play pattycake with him. Well, it ain’t so! You need a scorecard to keep track of all the playas between the Red Sea and the Ganges, and American politicians and media just ain’t getting the job done. Hope that clears that all up for y’all!

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

I see, according to that above an insurgent in Iraq cannot be a terrorist too.  I hold otherwise. Many insurgents in Iraq also go after the heads Iraqis they view to be too simpathetic to the “occupiers.” The insurgency also are responsible for many of the bombing against Shiites.  The insurgents are mostly Sunnis and many work in tandem with foreign groups, including al-Qaeda.  A great number are former members of Saddam’s party, particularly professinal militery type people of his army, who weren’t to nice to Shiites than and aren’t so now.  In fact, they despice having lost power to them.

Once again, I hold them as a group to be worst than the Taliban.

I hope you watch the following documentary.

If the Iraqi government can get the latter to lay down their arms and engage in the democratic process in exchange for amnesty and the promised departure of American troops I think they have to go for it.

This is how peace is made. This is the way out of Iraq.

Rob,

You are probably right given there is little political will to wipe out Isalmic fascists on a scale that would drastically marginalize those who escape.  I wish this was the case.  However, I still think the peace won will be temporary and we are only putting off the inevitable.

I see, according to that above an insurgent in Iraq cannot be a terrorist too.  I hold otherwise.

No, according to you an insurgent cannot be anything other than a terrorist.

It is my contention that there are some insurgents who are not terrorists, and if they can be convinced to lay down their arms in Iraq and engage in the political process it will be all the better.

That has been my point all along.

Mr. Smith: My mistake.  I’ll edit the post.

Long day today.  Can’t seem to get my brain to work right.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

not all, but probably most. They generally don’t restrain themself to attacking US Troops, they also attack the Iraqi police army, as well as innocent Iraqi civilians.  I also hold the Shiite groups and militias like the Badr Brigade and the Mahdi Army to be terrorist groups. The insurgent ins Iraq are arguably worst than even Hezbullah in Lebanon.

..the main problem in Anbar Province seems to be the insurgent group al-Qaeda in Iraq.

Another option is we tell the Iraqi’s and Afghani’s you have 6 months to step up or we’re not playing nice anymore.  We let them know we are in the ME to secure and protect America; that Americans have tolerated the threat of terrorism for about 15 years; that we will not live like the Israeli’s; that our tolerance has afforded them a monumental opportunity for freedom; that we have been restrained in our efforts long enough; and that they have had long enough to decide to act decisively.

or what?

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

rob, this Chapter of the documentary in particular shows how foreign al-Qaeda members and the Iraqi insurgents (mainly Sunnis disenfranchised after the fall of Saddams’s regime) work in tangem

Those poor sunni’s, what to do after they can’t lord over the Shiites?

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

..link with video

or what? [/quote

No more mr. nice guy.  Exactly how that plays out is up to the military. IMOP mosques, cemetaries, measured civilian causualties, mountain tribes, etc. will no longer restrain our efforts to kill terrorists.  That our priority will be to fight this war to win American objectives whether or not democracy in the ME is acheived.

I don’t know why it doesn’t seem to have come out well.

It’s Chapter two of this link

It might just be that the best weapon we have in the war on terrorism is our economic engine.  For Afghanistan, we have to see what they have to offer, and build an economy around that.  We have to cut off the opium market, and give them something else to grow, and maybe cut down on how many farmers there are, from a market perspective.  When they can be economically self-sustaining, they may be too busy working and being upwardly mobile to waste their time doing terrorism.  Idle hands are the devil’s workshop, you know.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

HG:  while I would agree with you I doubt the dems and rino’s in Congress would allow that.

They seem to have picked up their idea of torture from Monty Python:

Ximinez: Confess! Confess! Confess!
Biggles: It doesn’t seem to be hurting her, lord.
Ximinez: Have you got all the stuffing up one end?
Biggles: Yes, lord.
Ximinez [angrily hurling away the cushions]: Hm! She is made of harder stuff! Cardinal Fang! Fetch...THE COMFY CHAIR!

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

If that doesn’t work you can watch the skit here.

Edit by likwidshoe: Embedding YouTube videos doesn’t work on this site. It messes up the formatting.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

We have to cut off the opium market, and give them something else to grow, and maybe cut down on how many farmers there are, from a market perspective.

R108,

We can’t even win our own war on drugs.

When they can be economically self-sustaining, they may be too busy working and being upwardly mobile to waste their time doing terrorism.  Idle hands are the devil’s workshop, you know.

This hate is centuries old.  Economic development will likely only fund their evil schemes.  Islamic fascism isn’t going anywhere unless we send it there.

Thanks Lik.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

Nice defeatism.  Let’s give up then.  Cut and run from Afghanistan.  It’s impossible, I see now; nothing will possibly work.  Oh well!  It’s easier that way, I see now.  We can just hunker down until it all blows over.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

while I would agree with you I doubt the dems and rino’s in Congress would allow that.

It definately would not be politically possible but it may be that it is necessary despite the politcal cost.  That’s leadership.

Rob-
All of us are thrown off balancce by the First-Martinez-AP stories, comments.  Clarifcations seem to only muddy the water.

Does it bother anyone to learn that 8,000 US troops will now be fighting under a UN flag and UN commander in Afghanistan??? What the Hades is going on over there?  Are cutting and running?  Why is all this commentary not coming from our Commander=in-Chief.  Who the heck is in charge???

Nice defeatism.

R108,

We will win and secure our liberties.  But, our security and liberty should not be predicated upon democracy in the ME—at least not much longer.  We have afforded Iraq and Afghanistan an opportunity to seize freedom which has lasted for almost 3 years in Iraq and longer in Afghanistan.  Like America, if they will not accept the responsibility of freedom they don’t deserve it.  This is not defeatism; it’s victory for America and a future deterrent for terrorism.

It might just be that the best weapon we have in the war on terrorism is our economic engine.  For Afghanistan, we have to see what they have to offer, and build an economy around that.  We have to cut off the opium market, and give them something else to grow, and maybe cut down on how many farmers there are, from a market perspective.  When they can be economically self-sustaining, they may be too busy working and being upwardly mobile to waste their time doing terrorism.  Idle hands are the devil’s workshop, you know.

rob, I whole heartly agree with you. In fact, I said the same thing more comprehensily some time ago in another post.  I think we missed the opportunity at getting the oil rich Arabs goverments (Saudi Arabia, Dubai/UAE Qater etc.) to pay for it as redemption for 9/11 to. i.e. We would set-up the program to build the economy and deplomatically demanded that the wealthy Arabs finance the comprehensive program, set by us, and runned by what I like to call a Five Star General to denote its importance and and magniture of the job.(someone like Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson). 

.. a similar program for Palestine too.

Give every Afghan family a big screen TV, premium service Satelliite, two sheep and two goats a month , generators, heat AC and a small pick up truck.
They’d love us and it would be a bargain.

Give every Afghan family a big screen TV, premium service Satelliite, two sheep and two goats a month , generators, heat AC and a small pick up truck.
They’d love us and it would be a bargain.

that’s not really teaching them how to fish, which is what we really have to do.

Make sure every Afghan family has the opportunity to earn that stuff, and then you might have something.  As we have discovered in our inner cities, when you get things without working for them, disaster follows.  Just check out the results of the so-called “War on Poverty”.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

The longer we fight with kid gloves, the longer it will take to eliminate terrorists and the more terrorism will influence generations. 

There has to be a combination of personal responsibility, determined effective government, & economic development. 

While we can and are working for these things, a decisive, forceful, military option will achieve American objectives and force the hands of the Iraqi’s and Afghani’s IMO.

Give every Afghan family a big screen TV, premium service Satelliite, two sheep and two goats a month , generators, heat AC and a small pick up truck.
They’d love us and it would be a bargain.

Woof, this type of strategy has also secured votes for democrats—but you knew that already.

HG: Ultimately, Afghanistan must have a functioning economy in order to secure long term peace.  Find out what they have to offer(probably cheap labor and real estate), and capitalize them by buying what they have.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

HG: Ultimately, Afghanistan must have a functioning economy in order to secure long term peace.  Find out what they have to offer(probably cheap labor and real estate), and capitalize them by buying what they have.

as well as what we have to offer. e.g. turn Afghanistan into another India.  Lets build the educational system in a systematic way never seen before (to be done under the supervision of my “five Star General” e.g. Henry Paulson.

rob, you asked me the following in this thread:

rob:

I’m curious. Afghanistan has almost no natural resources, no industrial base to speak of, and a largely uneducated population. Their economic development, if the totalitarians can be kept at bay for a generation or two, will come as a result of benefiting from other nations outsourcing to them. When they can accumulate enough capital by selling what they have - cheap land and cheap labor(low overhead), they may be able to take their place among modern nations

Here’s how I responded:

rob, by doing something of the sorts the European Union has done for countries like Spain and Ireland.

Stuff like this take a novel plan and great thinking.

I would said we should taken advantage of the urgency created by 9/11 to convince/intimidate our oil rich muslim friend to to match our funds we should’ve convinced/intimidated our European friends with the urgency of 9/11 to get behind funding our plan or else they would probably also be target, we should created an organization of foundations and endowment with their fund and expertise to get behind us. 

This ultra serious under taking would have been directly exuctated by the US government (a special agency perhaps) not UN or any other international org., though their insight and expertise would have been actively welcomed.

our intimidation to our oil rich muslims friend, (Saudi Arabia, UAE/Dubai): no one more than you is perhaps more responsible for this attacks on our soil, (using diplomatic language,of course) here is our plan for Afghanistan and since you have been to some extent responsible for this attack we want you to redeem yourself by funding X amount (a substantial amount) of our vision, which we will execute.

The plan would have been executed by what I have come to refer to as a appointed “six star general” (denoting the urgency and importance), the current secretary of the Treasury would have been a good choice as the first general of what I denoted our “World War Three: ideological fight against ideological radicalism (or something to that extent).

We would create extremely preferable access to our market to Afghanistan, (sort of as the European Union meant to Ireland and Spain, or what we did/currently do with Puerto Rico)

we would created an Afghanistan economy, somewhat as we did with Puerto Rico, operation Boot Strap etc.

we would created a modern educational system, to some extent what India has done ..Israel too. to compete with the madrassas

I would do a similar thing with Palestine

aNON: India has a resource of educated people that Afghanistan generally lacks. They will probably have to start at the bottom of the ladder, like post WWII Japan.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

aNON: India has a resource of educated people that Afghanistan generally lacks. They will probably have to start at the bottom of the ladder, like post WWII Japan.

But it can be done and be way more cost effectively than us having to keep a sizeble portion of our military there for an indeffinate amount of time.

..could be done by a fraction of the money we’ve already spent in Iraq, the thing is the right American with great credential must be chosen to manage the whole endeavor, hence my “five star general” like Henry Paulson requirement.

aNON: Two flaws in your plan: One, any partnership with rich oil sheiks would be subject to nationalization at some point, and Two, don’t use the EU as any model for anything.  They’re goin’ down!

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

Give em a bunch of junk and the Afghans will be Americans.
They’ll stay home at night and use the truck to work.

..and it can be more sustainable than what we currently are doing. It will also deflate all the claims of the insurgents etc.  As it has vis a vis North and South Korea.

.gotta go, ..be back tomorrow.

Give em a bunch of junk and the Afghans will be Americans.

You first, Woof. Give them your “junk”.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

I send them money every quarter.

If I went to visit they’d kill me.

Less bombs more sheep could work.

Fewer bombs, more terrorists, right now.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

I didn’t think we should be negotiating with the Taliban but if Bill Frist is confident that they can’t be beaten militarily then I clearly have some thinking to do.

"The national budget must be balanced. The public debt must be reduced; the arrogance of the authorities must be moderated and controlled. Payments to foreign governments must be reduced if the nation doesn’t want to go bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance.”
Cicero, 55 BC

He clarified it later, but no matter.  You will take the meaning that fits your belief system.  I thought you were in favor of negotiation.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

MikeA: Frist’s very words, quoted earlier in this thread, emphases mine:

First of all, let me make something clear: The Taliban is a murderous band of terrorists who’ve oppressed the people of Afghanistan with their hateful ideology long enough. America’s overthrow of the Taliban and support for responsible, democratic governance in Afghanistan is a great accomplishment that should not and will not be reversed.

Having discussed the situation with commanders on the ground, I believe that we cannot stabilize Afghanistan purely through military means.

That isn’t the same as saying the Taliban can’t be defeated militarily now, is it?
What he really said is that we need to do other things in addition to the military option.  I don’t know that I agree with him on what those things should be, but he definitely wasn’t accepting defeat, as some would twist his words to say.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

r108...given how bad the Taliban is why on earth would we want to see them included in the Afghan government if they can be beaten militarily? I did read Frist’s clarification and the original IHT article and he’s balancing out his initial remarks rather than denying or retracting them. All I’m saying is that Frist’s comments, both the ones he made originally and his subsequent ones that you’ve quoted, are more data points to consider.

"The national budget must be balanced. The public debt must be reduced; the arrogance of the authorities must be moderated and controlled. Payments to foreign governments must be reduced if the nation doesn’t want to go bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance.”
Cicero, 55 BC

MikeA: It’s so tough these days to get any kind of a true statement in the MSM regarding anything a Republican has to say about any war stuff, that I really don’t know what Frist is really talking about.  I will have to check into it farther, but negotiating with any terrorists doesn’t make any sense in general, IMO.

If life doesn’t begin at conception, why do they call it birth control?

Mike, we are not going to include Talibanis in the Afghani government, the negotiations being advocated are with the Tribal Leaders. These are not considered part of Taliban by Talibani leaders. Talibani leaders consider them as subjects, peons whose whole exsitance is to support Talibani clerics. Tribal Leaders are not confident that the Coalition will not pullout and leave them at the mercy of the Taliban and their gangs of cutthroats and thieves(yes, I misspelled this word several times last night). So, they are stuck in the middle, waiting to see who, ultimately, will be left standing. Get it now? We want the Tribal Leaders to become active in their own government. Talibanis want Tribal Leaders to grovel in the dirt and be their slaves. Is that simple enough for you to understand?

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

What everyone seems to ignore is the fact that it’s not our Government to dictate to.  If Karzai wants to negotiate with the Taliban that’s his business.

...Ms. Rice, the national security adviser at the time, said it was “incomprehensible” to suggest she had ignored dire terrorist threats two months before the Sept. 11 attacks....

....A review of White House records has determined that George J. Tenet, then the director of central intelligence, did brief Condoleezza Rice and other top officials on July 10, 2001, about the looming threat from Al Qaeda, a State Department spokesman said Monday.

No one could have imagined her memory could be so selective.

“If a conservative is still a republican after the last 13 years, he is blind to the fact that his party of choice has failed him utterly.” – Realitybasedbob

I find it hilarious that the lefties pretend they worry about what we knew before 9/11.

After all after 9/11 they are doing their best to keep us from fighting terrorism.

For example all the crap we have to go through at the airport.  But you can’t profile.  And you certainly can’t even talk to more than two men from the middle east.

That’s today after we all should be aware of the terrorist threat.

What’s going to happen to US industry when the global warming extremists like John McCain double the price of electricity?  I would think all these factories will close and set up in countries where they aren’t scared of technology.

2H9...that would certainly make more sense. Where did you read this?

"The national budget must be balanced. The public debt must be reduced; the arrogance of the authorities must be moderated and controlled. Payments to foreign governments must be reduced if the nation doesn’t want to go bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance.”
Cicero, 55 BC

In all the news articles about the Afghani government. They have never said word one about talks with Talibani clerics. That has all come from leftist politicians, in EU, UN, and US. I believe several of your prominent leftards regularly say the same things. Canadian military officers and diplomats clearly state that Talibanis will not be included. The representatives of the Afghani government clearly state the same. Leftarded morons in all of the Western governments continue to say we will include The Taliban in negotiations. There is no The Taliban. Does not exist. Talibanis are drug-running,kiddnapping,raping,murdering,fake religious leader scumbags. Period. Why is something so eloquently simple so F***ing difficult for peole to understand?!?!?!

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

Why is something so eloquently simple so F***ing difficult for peole to understand?!?!?!

It’s because we’re all a bunch of stupid twats...I thought you got that memo.

There is no The Taliban. Does not exist.

Of course there’s a Taliban...now I know you’re not getting the memos. The Taliban started as a loose group of religious students who had banded together to fight the Soviets.

"The national budget must be balanced. The public debt must be reduced; the arrogance of the authorities must be moderated and controlled. Payments to foreign governments must be reduced if the nation doesn’t want to go bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance.”
Cicero, 55 BC

No, that is the Muhadajeen. Talibani thugs did not appear until after the war was over.

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

Not that this is a big deal or anything but I beg to differ. This is from my earlier link:

The Taliban are one of the mujahideen ("holy warriors” or “freedom fighters") groups that formed during the war against the Soviet occupation of Afghanistan (1979-89). After the withdrawal of Soviet forces, the Soviet-backed government lost ground to the mujahideen. In 1992, Kabul was captured and an alliance of mujahideen set up a new government with Burhanuddin Rabbani as interim president. However, the various factions were unable to cooperate and fell to fighting each other. Afghanistan was reduced to a collection of territories held by competing warlords.

Groups of taliban ("religious students") were loosely organized on a regional basis during the occupation and civil war. Although they represented a potentially huge force, they didn’t emerge as a united entity until the taliban of Kandahar made their move in 1994. In late 1994, a group of well-trained taliban were chosen by Pakistan to protect a convoy trying to open a trade route from Pakistan to Central Asia. They proved an able force, fighting off rival mujahideen and warlords. The taliban then went on to take the city of Kandahar, beginning a surprising advance that ended with their capture of Kabul in September 1996.

"The national budget must be balanced. The public debt must be reduced; the arrogance of the authorities must be moderated and controlled. Payments to foreign governments must be reduced if the nation doesn’t want to go bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance.”
Cicero, 55 BC

Here’s one that suggests that we may both be right...isn’t that nice?

The world first became aware of the Taleban in 1994 when they were appointed by Islamabad to protect a convoy trying to open up a trade route between Pakistan and Central Asia. The group - comprised of Afghans trained in religious schools in Pakistan along with former Islamic fighters or mujahedin - proved effective bodyguards, driving off other mujahedin groups who attacked and looted the convoy.

They went on to take the nearby city of Kandahar, beginning a remarkable advance which led to their capture of the capital, Kabul, in September 1996.

"The national budget must be balanced. The public debt must be reduced; the arrogance of the authorities must be moderated and controlled. Payments to foreign governments must be reduced if the nation doesn’t want to go bankrupt. People must again learn to work, instead of living on public assistance.”
Cicero, 55 BC