CORRECTED For What It’s Worth: The Best Aerial Picture Of The DC Tea Party I’ve Seen Yet
Update: As was noted in the comments, the picture below in the original post is of the wrong rally. This ground-level picture of the rally clearly shows that it didn’t take place on the mall nearly as extensively as the image I mistakenly posted does.
Even based on that image, however, I feel the National Park Service’s graph holds up. I don’t think the 1,000,000 figure for the tea party is at all inappropriate.
Maybe this will finally put some of the speculation about the size of the DC tea party into perspective (click for a larger view):
Couple that with this graphic used to measure Obama’s inauguration numbers published by the USA Today and the National Park Service:
That graphic estimates crowd size going almost back to the Washington Monument as being about 1,000,000. The tea party crowd didn’t go up as close to the capitol as the Obama inauguration crowd did, but the tea party crowd also went all the way back to and around the Washington Monument.
I don’t think a crowd size of 1,000,000 is an unreasonable estimate. Tags: Asshats, Domestic Issues, Politics
Dino:
And only then by people like yourself who can’t do math. Must suck to be in that state, eh? Puts you on the level of simple apes.
I’m not sure what an accurate number is, but it’s at least 200k. You can fit that many on Pennsylvania Avenue from 1600 Pennsylvania Avenue to Capital Hill.
Rob, are you kidding me? You ran with this picture, really?
Perhaps you can point out to the the Indian Museum in the picture. Oh what you can’t, you’re right it’s not there.
You posted a picture from the Promise keepers march in 1997.
so perhaps instead of posting your talking points and pictures for the day, you should make sure that what you post is actually true.
Had you even checked, you would have known that the teabaggers had march on the street and not on the mall.
You should be embarassed to post this ruse and lie to people.
It said cloudy and windy. We all know that the sun never peaks through the clouds and photographer would never wait until that happened.
It looks like even less now.
The larger inauguration crowd had people packed in closer. We know how uncomfortable that makes you teabaggers since it’s all about YOU getting YOURS and keeping OTHERS from sharing in it. That’s why you always want to live on big patches of land with lots of guns and fences.
We’re used to living in closer quarters since we don’t see other people as threats to our space or our stuff.
Drool spill on aisle 4. Subject goes by the name of “Dino”.
Come back when you’re an adult, little girl.
Oh, and Rob, didn’t the sunny day in this picture give you any clue? Yesterday it was chilly and windy and cloudy in DC.
Geesh!
Bob:
I get roughly 100k sq ft for the crowd inside of the circle (0.09 mile radius, 1/8th of the circle covered) and another 100k sq ft for the crowd on Constitution Ave.
At 2 sq-ft/person, that puts the crowd size at roughly 100k people that were visible. Police put total crowd size at 150k for the total crowd size, so this isn’t too far off.
Oh, and Rob, just so you can check the weather from yesterday, allow me:
http://www.weather.com/weather/pastweather/20001?from=36hr_topnav_undeclared
Dino:
OK.
Dino, you don’t have a clue.
I think I said I had a clue, or two.
Need one?
and this
Question for general audience: Can Dino do math? Or is his “best” feature, spitting adolescent invective.
The National Park Service refutes all you lying lefties: It’s a record crowd for DC:
http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/entry/national_park_service_says_9_12_turnout_a_record/
Rob:
It took about 3 hours for the crowd to make it onto the mall. That would put it somewhere around 1PM EDT by my best estimates. You would need to find a picture take around that time to get an accurate count, ideally from a more vertical angle.
Wow, it wasn’t sunny there yesterday. And most of the pictures I’ve seen of the teabaggers has them whining in the streets, not on the Mall.
Good catch, djer!
Rob, that picture is definitely not from the 9/12 march.
Djer manages to make an ass out of himself but also gets two basic facts correct:
1) it was cloudy
2) the art museum is missing.
Here’s a “real” shot:
Here is the Google Earth shot with 3-d buildings enabled:
The circled building is missing in your shot.
(Update on preview: The blog entry has changed to reflect this error… leaving the figures in for sake of reference).
Greg in Alabama, the proof is in the picture. Maybe you can point out the Museum of the American Indian in the photo that Rob claims shows how big the crowd. It should be there in all its glory.
do you see it, please circle it and let me know. Oh wait, you can’t find, really? That’s because the picture Rob posted is from 1997 when the Museum wasn’t even built yet.
It should have been in this photo that Rob claims was taken yesterday and it’s not there. There’s your proof no Museum of the Native American.
Oh and it was cloudy all day yesterday. Greg. check any of the photos from any source yesterday and there was no sun shining in any of them.
This is a whopper lie!
djer:
Area is where it matters, and I think you can probably fit more like 10x as many people on the mall, due to the larger area and the closer packing for when they are no longer moving.
I still think the number is over 200k, but the data are too subjective to pin the number down very well.
this is what scares me… these guys are never even close. look at what they said barry had. i bet he had less than 1M at his hello address.. you know, the one that look him less than 3 sentences to make his first mistake as president.
Facts? How does this strike you then?
http://www.encyclopedia.com/doc/1A1-D95QUFSG0.html
Kind of an inconvient fact there “truth”blogger.
Why don’t you post some proof that he’s wrong? Oh yeah, that would require work. Carry on then!
Rob, maybe you should go to your source and ask them where they got it? All you have to do is find the Museum of the Native American on the picture you posted. If you can’t, then you have a problem.
You are the one who posted crap trying to prove what a big crowd you had there yesterday. I have already acknowledged that there was large crowd of about 100,000.
But you were bound and determined to prove that it was a million and posted what some other rube sent you and you ran with it.
All you had to do was ask a few questions, like, gee, why are all those people on the Mall when the teabaggers were in the street? Gee why is it sunny in the picture when all the other photos I saw from yesterday it was cloudy? Yeah where is the Museum of the Native American?
I proved my point with your own picture, you do your work by going back and checking with your source where you got the info in the first place!
The brainless spambots have arrived. For people that don’t care about us they sure spend a lot of time here.
djer: The National Park Service proves you a liar.
I think he’s right. There is supposed to be a building on the upper right (across from the building shaped like a triangle on the left). That’s the new American Indian Museum and it’s not in this picture. It looks more like the pavilion that was there before they put the museum up.
I stand corrected.
Meh, I said “the art museum is missing”. I meant Indian museum of course.
Only by about 900,000.
The first part of your sentence was accurate. The second, conjecture.
I think it was more like 100,000 which is still a pretty good number of folks to come to a march.
The picture Rob just posted shows that the crowd goes just past the fountain on the Capitol grounds and just begins to spill onto the mall. That number would not be anywhere near 1M. If the crowd were on the street for a number of blocks, it still wouldn’t be 1M. The mall is nearly three times the size of Pennsylvania Ave or Constitution Ave.
Oh and Rob, given your level of dishonesty, I’ll keep doing my own research when you post something, since you don’t!
So if you hadn’t been bragging about the attendees numbering in the millions, you wouldn’t have had to post a hoax picture being perpetuated on other rightie websites.
I’m not sure why you people are so desperate to prove your numbers. We all know 48% didn’t vote for Obama. We saw the Palin/KKK rallies. We see your disgusting behavior now and saw it then. Hell, we saw it with Clinton.
There’s a significant portion of this country that will NEVER be ok with anyone other than a conservative as President. It’s always been that way. Change and progress scares the slow and non-intellectual. And like it or not, that’s most people. A good 40% of you would still be living in some modern feudal system if not for visionary liberals and (years ago) enlightened conservatives (nothing like what we know them as today- now they’re ignorant savages).
Add to the mix that he’s black and you have a potent combination of factors that whip the idiots (that’s you) into a froth. It’s all very disingenuous seeing as how the major damage done to this country was by conservatives. But wait, bush was a liberal, right? LOL
We get it. You hate Obama. You hated Bill Clinton. You would have hated Hillary Clinton. You hated Kennedy, Carter, LBJ, FDR and anyone who even remotely looked like a liberal. You’ll only accept reagans and bushes as your leader, despite the damage they’ve done you, your families, your wealth and your future generations.
However, that has never stopped you from enjoying the programs and resources provided you by liberal policies. I’ve caught so many of you right here taking from the collective society as you bitterly complain about it. That’s truly disgusting. Unforgivable. What it is is white trash behavior. Ignorance born of selfishness and greed that seemingly knows no bounds. Irrationality beyond the pale. Like teenagers who hate their parents as they live off of them.
You people truly are an amazing bunch. Abhorrent, but strangely compelling. Like cockroaches you can never get rid of but learn to work around.
Flag at half-staf is real……left from 9-11 recognition
http://michellemalkin.com/2009/09/12/yes-the-picture-is-real-nutroots/
but lets just use democrat math….ie 47 million uninsured…using that we can state there were 4 million in D.c.
…..but then of course, if state run media doenst cover it..it never happened.
What is a major diff. between DC teaparty and Obama inaugeration…..gabage left behind. Obama inaug. looked like a 3rd world country in the aftermath…green party
Come back when you grow a brain.
The Park service has the numbers at 1.2 million.
British press and many other outlets are reporting over 1 million also.
I was there and the crowd was incredible.
I was in front of the capital but it was made clear by 11:00 am that someone had gotten a permit to keep part of the mall from being filled up(obviously for photo op reason since no one showed up).
The only desperation here is from liberals who obviously don’t want anyone to believe their eyes looking at this crowd take over 3 1/2 hours to make it down Pennsylvania Ave,fill up the grounds all the way around the capital,and down past the needle under the trees and into the roads.
But hey, the “smart ones” that can’t handle the numbers that showed up are the same people that called replaying Van Jones video’s and interviews of his own words “lies” and “smears”.
This desperation smells of fear coming from liberals who have total control of government,are screwing it up royally,and don’t have Bush to blame it on.
What a joke.
Keep trying to spin but you can bet the democratic congressional leaders up for election are not sleeping well just because liberals want people to believe what they “say” and not what they can obviously see.
Just say, “I don’t have a fucking clue” and be done with it, eh?
Dude, you’re one of those who thinks it’s 1993 again. YOU HAD THE COUNTRY. The Congress for 12 YEARS and the Presidency for EIGHT. And how’d that turn out? Still watching your retirement funds languish? Housing value deflate? LOL.
Be our guest. Take it back. Whoever controls this country for the next 20 years is screwed. Taxes will have to go up. Debt must be repaid. You remember the national debt, right Baxter? it went up $5 TRILLION in bush’s first 6 years! IT DOUBLED!
No one is afraid of you stupid, teabagging, sore loser bitches. You’re the ones who should fear for the future you created for your dull progeny.
Those are the same people said that many showed up to see barry…. there were not that many then either. the park police are always wrong. what a good headline would be is this; ‘as many people show up to protest barry as welcomed him 9 months ago.’
Why are you so desperate to disprove them?
His best feature is spitting adolescent invective, ineffectivly. He admited in his own post about the numbers that their were at least 300,000 people. Now he’s trying to pretend like that doesn’t exist. He does say’s whatever he thinks is damaging at the moment. If it matches what he said earlier, great! If it doesn’t? What does he care, he’s trolling anyway.
For What It’s Worth: The Best Aerial Picture Of The 2005 Iraq war protest I’ve Seen Yet
Ignoring and denying the numbers of people who showed up to oppose the nightmare we elected is typical for the Liberal Dems. The bipartisan outpouring of people who have come out to oppose Obama care should be of concern for the Dem Party. BUT it is par for the course. They continue to ignore the corruption and crimes ACORN commits against the Tax Payers. WHY acknowledge the peaceful bipartisan crowds opposing healthcare reform? Their time is short so while they are there they will create as much Socialist havoc onto the American people they can! This is the Liberal, Socialist, Commie chance for a Big Govt power grab. They are going to cram it down our throats, like it or not!!!
We’re not denying there were alot of people protesting, ZsaZsa. But the rightes have been outright lying about the numbers, posting pictures that are purported to be the protest marchers and are not.
If you want to be credible, then you have to be credible. And what Rob and others did yesterday to justify their numbers just wasn’t credible. It was lying out and out.
Yes, there was a large crowd. Probably around 100,000, and that is nothing to sneeze at, for sure.
But to post outright lies and pictures purporting to be the rally hurts the cause you care about.
as i said…..
the park police have no clue.
Wow, you really believed in this photo? I pity the fool.
YOU LIE! That picture is from the Iraq War Protest! If the Republican agenda is so wonderful why do you always have to LIE about it’s popularity among the People? You can’t even get a REAL grassroots uprising without having it sponsored by Dick Armey and the corporate sociopaths who COUNT on your ignorance to further their anti-human, anti-worker, anti-American agenda. Fortunately for them, you never let them down.
To quote someone I’m sure you find a great American:
YOU LIE!
Say good bye to your credibility.
You threw it out there hoping it would stick and got called on it. Or….your research skills are very poor.
Take your pick.
Oh and did the teabaggers clean up after themselves since they hate givernement programs? I bet now.
Hey Robert108,
RE: your post 9/13 The National Park Service refutes all you lying lefties: It’s a record crowd for DC:
Your link is a dud – just like you….
And another thing take off the sunglasses while you are in doors… unless you have something to hide.
have a nice day (you, you …..liar!)
why has something so basic become such a subject for contention?
this blog (and many others) was a bit too quick to post an image without proper fact checking.
This does not necessarily mean this blog intended to mislead. This happens every now and again with traditional media where one or several news sources of “repute” and then it trickles down to other news sources and blogs that report it as fact.
Of course this doesn’t absolve this blog (or any blog) from all fault, but one thing that can be done is an assurance that more due diligence is done before posting things as fact.
Otherwise, everything posted here can be questioned.
Great work here buddy! Nothing like posting complete BS to give your site credit! I would like to know if the teabaggers cleaned up the park when they were finished. Funny how you use a national park to protest government funding for anything. That national park was paid for by people who are much more far sighted and open minded then your group of teabaggers. I also really liked the racist overtones of your group, just another feather in the cap of your credibility.
By the way, for everyone wondering what the aerial photo is… it’s a photo of the Promise Keepers Rally in Washington, from October 1997.
Y’all got punked.
You twits are complete aholes. Grow a brain for christs sake. Then grow some balls and stop lieing.
Sorry, teabaggers. We surround you!
YOU LIE!
the picture is a fake, similar to a fake Kenyan birth certificate, lol, when will you ever learn?
LOLOLOL
Morons are funny…..especially when they fall for their own lies.
LOLOLOL
LOL. Right-wing idiots. And desperate ones at that.
ROTFLMAO
Ha ha, dummies. Like others have said, didn’t the weather alone tip you off? Good grief.
Off by much more than a factor of 10. Oh my.
I am not sure if this was mentioned but Sept. 12th was also Black Family Reunion weekend, which is held every year on the National Mall. I wonder if Joe Wilson will yell out at his fellow teabaggers and scream “You Lie”
Remember when that phony National Guard letter came out about Bush just before the election? afterwards it was the exact same dialog between the left and right but the roles were reversed. Let’s not be hippocrites here.
For what it’s worth, the US Park Service does not venture to guess nor release demonstrating numbers. That is up to the DC police. And even that is an estimate….
LOL! Official estimates are between 60 and 70 thousand.
There were more people at the Ohio State football game than at this sorry teabagger protest. Pathetic.
No, this is much dumber than the Bush National Guard letter incident. There was at least a little effort put into that hoax. This isn’t even a hoax. It’s just dumb-dumbery.
Besides the Indian museum…
Look at the lawn between the water and the Capitol steps.
THERE ARE NO PEOPLE in that area like there was on Saturday!
Not one person on that BIG patch of grass!
There ya go, there’s the proof that the photo was NOT from Saturday.
“hippocrite?” ahh, so YOU were the one in charge of the protest signage.
Not to mention the Black Family Reunion attended by thousands and being held nearby. And curious tourists. Definitely not a million people there, though.
The Park Service said 60,000-70,000. Seems a lot more realistic than 1,000,000.
Of course you have never let facts get in the way.
The Obama crowd didn’t spread to the Washington Memorial, it sread to the LINCOLN MEMORIAL. I was there, right at the WWII memorial. The teabaggers didn’t even have the permit for the mall. Those are other folks. LULZ.
And 3 hours to walk from the White House to the Capital? Well, no shit. it was after all A PROTEST MARCH, with stops to watch speakers. It took me 4 hours to get from L’Enfant Plaza metro stop to the mall, after thinking i was going to die in the subway station itself. And that was desperately trying to get to where I was going.
And don’t be embarrased, 60k-70k is fine (for extreme views), why are you trying so hard to make it something it’s not??
Look, as far as the numbers go, ask yourself some common sense questions here: if a million people showed up in D.C. for a march, every hotel within a hundred miles would be booked solid. Public transportation would grind to a halt. Traffic would be completely backed up and residents of the city would be walking around cursing the influx of huge numbers of people that they normally don’t have to deal with. We know this, because when 2 million people, for instance, showed up for Obama’s inauguration, all these things happened. 2 million people showing up were NOTICEABLE. What happened with the teabag protest in D.C. didn’t apparently strike anyone in the city as being worse than what happens when there’s a home baseball game. A hundred thousand, tops, and that’s probably being generous. The reason the left, at least, is obsessing about this number (“Why is everybody obsessing about how many people were at this protest?”) is because it simply adds to the completely disingenuous nature of right-wing outrage in this country. 60-100,000 people show up in Washington, after six months of organization and Fox News offering as much free publicity as it possibly can without having the FCC step in to force it into the cartoon channel band, and instead of just having the organizers say, “Well, the weather was bad,” or–typically–”Well, you know, conservatives actually work for a living, unlike those welfare-sponging elitists living in their Boston brownstones,” we get instead the one organizer pretending that ABC news gave a number which was just wildly hallucinatory. And then, the boys down in the boiler room went to work and photoshopped some photos, or found some random footage in the photo morgue, and presto! there are 2 million people wandering around Washington.
I attended the Black Family Reunion held on 9/12 and 9/13 on the National Mall. They were on the Mall between 7th street to 14th street. How come I don’t see all the tents and stages from that event in your pictures?
Rob has already admitted that he made a mistake in posting the picture. It’s done now. Go after R108 for his continuous lying on this.
Keep lying and spinning, little a-hole shouter; the Sleeping Giant is waking up, and all your distraction will not change what is to come to you commies.
Does anyone find it somewhat ironic that this was held on the PUBLIC mall in DC built with PUBLIC funds? The National Park Service folks are also public employees who are under a government health plan…
I wonder why they didn’t march on their own paid for property with their own paid for service folks?
Brian: We paid for it, so we own it. You must be one of those commies who think we should serve the govt, when America was founded on the principle that the govt is to serve the people.
You really don’t know that?
Robert the Liar is having a difficult day, called out for spreading lies. He gets caught then starts name calling.
Robert the Liar has been smacked with the truth.
Robert the Liar lies, it’s all he has.
Come on now. You right wing propagandists are usually more careful than this.
Stay classy Goebbels!!!
BWAAAHAHAAHAAHAA
I have not followed this thread, but in my experience 108 does not need to lie, he deals in facts and rational debate!
Epic fail by the tea baggers. They can’t even get the pictures of their own rally right. Turn off Rush and Beck and use your brains.
Actually who really cares about your “protest?” The percent of whack jobs is so small, but I can smell the racism from here. You people sure have crawled out like roaches. Here in Sacramento the brain trusts who run the “protests” forgot to get permits and insurance. Armchair activism is also stupid activism.
Here is the coverage from C-span. It clearly shows the size of the crowd. The estimate from the Fire Department was from an unauthorized source. That was most likely the size estimate at 9:30 AM at Freedom Plaza, when the organizers were told they had to start the march 2 hours early because the square had reached full capacity already and thousands more were pouring in.
http://www.c-span.org/Watch/Media/2009/09/12/HP/A/23055/FreedomWorks+Rally+in+DC.aspx
Leave it to a bunch of knuckle-dragging teabaggers to fuck up a photo-op!
I really like how the photos from Saturday have been Photo-shopped from the PromiseKeepers rally in 1997 to make it look like more people were there. However, because the “official” photos of the crowd on Saturday are missing the National Museum of the American Indian on the Mall, we know that the organizers are trying to mask the small turnout.
Is anyone surprised that the organizers of this event would be dishonest? I’m not.
I heard there were eleventy billion people there. I have no idea what they were protesting (picks nose), but there were eleventy billion.
Should be simple enough to find the photographer who took that swell picture on Saturday.
Anyone… anyone…?
(crickets chirping)
God you people are effing stupid. No one care how many of you morons showed up. No one cares.
I was there on downtown DC and Capitol Hill on Saturday for some other purpose. It was cloudy. We hadn’t had any sunny days for several days including Saturday. To me driving in and out of DC on 9/12 was as inconvenient as when there is a fairly big festival in the Mall. I almost didn’t notice the protest until I approached Capitol Hill. I saw the Red line Metro stations in the area as crowded as in a mild weekday rush hour only.
The few streets closing around Penn Ave from 14st towards the east (and perhaps Constitution Ave too) were just temporary for 2 or 3 hours. Really big events require a full day closure or even closing them from the night before. Traffic in and out from the 14st Bridge was not really impacted nor was the 3rd St tunnel.
I’ve seen more people around and traffic disruptions for a 4th of July or even a Cherry Blossom festival in a good sunny weekend. Union Station did have too many people for a Saturday but there was a Colombian festival in the Main Hall going on there too.
See all the green empty areas beyond around 1/3 the distance between the Capitol and the Washington Monument? That should give you an idea: the crowd only filled one third of the same area they completely packed for others events like the Promise Keepeers thing in your picture below.
There is no way that anything closer to even 1 million people were in DC in the protests and all were back normal and clear by 4 pm when I left.
(Hey, where’s the American Indian Museum? Why would you have to bolster the turnout numbers if there was so many people there…hmmmm? The 2nd pic is from 1997!
Hopefully, the loyal members of this site will realize that THIS WHOLE THING WAS A FRAUD, promoted by K Street Lobyists and the health insurance industry!
The pic will show a (current) photo taken during President Obama’s innauguration. If you look closely at that last (uppermost) uniquely shaped, tan building in the right row of buildings, you’ll notice the Museum of American Indians (built in 2004!)
Why does the teabagger’s photo above have NO BUILDING there? You figure it out…Morons! You people just can’t help being duped, time and time again!
Oh man… even ABC news is squashing the right-wing lies now.
When the organizer of the tea party is lying to a crowd of 70,000 people about the size of that crowd of people…and the crowd is eating up and believing everything that is being said to them…you know things are really f*cked up.
ABC news has issued a statement saying that the organizer of the even is essentially lying through his teeth.
http://abcnews.go.com/Politics/protest-crowd-size-estimate-falsely-attributed-abc-news/story?id=8558055
It’s mind boggling how conservatives are so gullible. It’s like they crave the lies. That’s all they have.
Why do you still have the photo from 1997 up? Methinks you are still attempting to mislead people. In fact, one of the reasons I recently turned my back on the Republican party is the lack of moderates. Its been taken over by the far Right. The far Right is all about distorting the facts at best, outright lying at worst. Your blog is just another example.
Here is the truth:
Pete Piringer, public affairs officer for the D.C. Fire and Emergency Department, said the local government no longer provides official crowd estimates because they can become politicized. But the day of the rally, Piringer unofficially told one reporter that he thought between 60,000 and 75,000 people had shown up.
We asked Piringer whether there were enough protesters to fill the National Mall, as depicted in the photograph.
“It was an impressive crowd,” he said. But after marching down Pennsylvania Avenue to the Capitol, the crowd “only filled the Capitol grounds, maybe up to Third Street,” he said….
…Malkin, like some of her conservative cohorts, retracted the number she had attributed to ABC when the network chastised FreedomWorks president Matt Kibbe, whose organization arranged the event, for inaccurately telling the crowd that the news organization had reported the crowd at 1 million to 1.5 million people.
I have included the link to the article above for those who wish to know the truth.
What’s interesting is something that apparently noone pointed out.
The national park service does estimates of crowd sizes based on aerial photos.
Where are the national park services aerial photos from this event?
Because a picture from 1997 clearly and accurately tells you how many people were there at the teabagger party.
Even based on that image, however, I feel the National Park Service’s graph holds up. I don’t think the 1,000,000 figure for the tea party is at all inappropriate.
Science wins again!
Get a life, bagger.
Dino,
Good posts, but you won’t ever get through to these people. The crowd was between 50K-70K; a reasonable crowd for a protest. Also, most people don’t realize that there was another event going on The Mall that attracts a sizable crowd every year-Black Family Reunion, given by the National Council of Negro Women. My sister is the event planner for vendors for the event, and she informed me that there were that many or more people at their event, as there was at the protest. Many people may be getting the 200K figure from that, but over half of those people were not involved in the protest.
It is good to see democracy at work, by people showing up to voice their opinions. However, the vile and ignorant signs and statements being made by many of the attendees don’t give any credibility to whatever movement they’re attempting to progress. The protest was incoherent and without focus. Someone interested in finding out what their mission is would be hard pressed to figure out what the objective was to the march. Was it to protest the President and who he is? That’s short-sided in that it shows pettiness from people because they are just protesting the person and not the policies. It is disingenuous to protest spending now, if there wasn’t this much, and more, complaining when the country was throwing over $1 trillion down the drain on a manufactured war that should have never been fought.
Middle class people are always fighting against their economic interests, in the hope of being something or someone they will never be. The rich and affluent have always persuaded those that they want to control to fight their battles, and those, who do fight those battles, normally get absolutely nothing for their efforts, other than the opportunity to show their vitriol and to communicate their lack of intelligence and lack of ability to think for themselves.
Many blogs were duped, and continue to be duped, into thinking that there were over 10X the number of people at the rally. Accept the 50-70K figure and galvanize that group of people to achieve your objective, as short-sighted as it may be.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/throughtheveil/2291798365
Here is where the wingnuts got their photo.
Latr
wow, americans are dumb!!!!!!!!!!!!
why dont you take the image down, to avoid anymore confusion.
why dont you take the image down, to avoid anymore confusion.
The Robs of the world are hopeless. They are so ignorant (not stupid – just uneducated)to the point that, like lemmings, they follow the the Limbaughs, the Hannitys, and the Becks right over a cliff to their own destruction.
But “frankly, My Dear, I don’t give a damn” what happens to people as totally out of reality as Rob. That is a quote from an era that the Tea Baggers love. Probably Rob never read the book that the quote comes from. That era no longer exists -and that is why they are so furious.
Best comment EVER!
Holy Sockpuppet flooding Batman!
The Left are all in a tizzy that 9-12 may have been the largest assembly of PO’ed American citizens everrrrr.
I love to see the Commies all panicking.
BWAH HAH HAH HAH!!!
So let’s just let the left think what they want.
For the right….
Mall was not approved for the 9/12 protest – no permit issued so the crowds were on the streets.
Really doesn’t matter what the number in DC was – it was large and if you add in all the local rallies nationally filled with the evil angry mobs (that resulted in NO arrest)the number far exceeds the 1 million.
The only number that is important is the number of people that show up in November and vote to stop this out of control spending, enacting laws without reading them, and the take over of our freedoms by the federal government. Let the doubters think what them may… and we will celebrate after the election.
I am neither a Democrat nor a Republican. And don’t get me wrong, the left falsifies data sometimes as well. However, I have never seen such a pathetic attempt by an entire political party to mislead the American people more than the current sordid status of the GOP. Whether it’s a high-ranking Republican trumpeting “facts” or a teabagger trying to outscream a reporter, they all love turning a blind eye to the truth. This childish aggrandizement is just another example. It doesn’t take a lot of effort to find that these are outdated photos (which are still up in the original post, unsurprisingly). Just another example of why the Republican party has become nothing more than a cult, insulated from information that doesn’t come from their revered leaders at Fox News or ignorant pundits like Limbaugh and Beck.
“The Left are all in a tizzy that 9-12 may have been the largest assembly of PO’ed American citizens everrrrr.”
Utter fail. Why would anyone be in a “tizzy” over a crowd the size of a college football game protesting…what, exactly? On the contrary – instead of getting whipped into a mindless frenzy like the rest of your dying party over falsely inflated numbers, we calmly did our research, checked these things called “facts”, and lo and behold, exposed yet another heaping pile of Republican fail.
At least you folks can be proud in knowing that it was the largest homogeneous gathering of white people in a DC protest since the KKK support march in 1925.
Funny how irony works eh?
Don’t be another idiot conservative. We all know about your lies, don’t try to fool us, we Washingtonians are not stupid.
All this denial by the lefty loons means one thing. They are scared shitless because they know we are taking our country back.
Ignore the true size of the crowd at your own peril. Why this confusion over a trivial calculation?
As an electronics engineer, I must consider data that diminishes my interests. Only then can I get some closure. How about you? In GIS Science, we would never traffic in a food-throwing debate such as this. If bad data is presented, and later retracted, as done here, it is a sign of integrity.
For every piece of evidence offered, the following question should be asked:
- What’s in the picture/estimate?
- Who is in the picture/estimate?
- Where was the picture/estimate taken?
- When was the picture/estimate taken? (critical!)
- Why was the picture/estimate taken?
- How was the picture taken?
- Who took the picture/estimate?
All evidence must be time-stamped. An early glance, and a later glimpse while they are hurrying back home, will skew numbers down. Vendors for another event cannot see crowds in the next street. The photo with the fattest crowd is admittedly better, because THAT BETTER INDICATES THE TOTAL NUMBER IN ATTENDANCE.
Problem: About third-way towards the Washington Monument, the mall looks kind of empty. But a screen capture from the area of 14th and E St NW (sic) shows a street jammed up tight, for nearly a mile. This makes no sense, until Baxter Greene reports that someone (Perhaps the Black Family Reunion?) had a permit for a portion of the Mall, forcing attendees onto the streets.
Here’s my solution:
- Ticketed area filled: 240,000, Compare the Obama Inaugural chart with the correct tea party photo, 240,000 is minimum. 70,000 is absurd.
- The street off to the right filled: 58,667. Using the screen capture shot off of “14th and E St NW”, and estimating 1mile long. Constitution Ave takes a funny jog off Pennsylvania, so don’t be fooled. Google Earth for Constitution Ave NW (US1) and PA Ave. shows about 100feet wide streets, and allow for 9sq feet per person (one sq yard per person) and I get 100*5280/9 = 58,667 street people, more if they jam up.
Total minimum inferred from reasonably good sources is about 58,667 + 240,000 = 298,667.
My number is probably low, because there is much that we cannot see or know, and bigger crowds can show up in photos taken at other times. Example, we cannot tell what crowds may be on Constitution Ave vs. Pennsylvania Ave. Not to mention side streets. Add to my estimate as you wish: One more unseen street (behind the tree), then another street worth for side streets. Then the figure approaches half-million.
Much is made of the Black Family Reunion (BFR). Their WEB page at http://www.ncnw.org/events/reunion_history.htm states that *their* event draws more than 500,000 people annually. No one challenges that figure. Yet the Tea Party struggles to get 70,000 of recognition. Something is wrong with both estimates. As a lover of Black Culture, I was intrigued by their event, but their daytime events that Saturday had low-key stuff like health screenings and human interest pavilions. (This is probably some of the whitish structures near the Washington Monument, in the later-posted photo). The Black Family attendance was probably detonated at night time for their R&B concert. (Wish I was there!). Thus, BFR Numbers are not part of my estimate. They are off in the far distance and their big numbers came at night.
Names like “tea-bagger”, and “moron” self-label the correspondents as uninterested in factual inquiry. The patriot movement appears to be real, and is neither Republican nor Democrat. Republican politicians have ignored them, while certain conservative columnists have identified with them. It has surprised even me, the numbers who have opposed the war from the beginning, which makes neo-conservative columnists nervous.
The rally of the 1997 Promise Keepers meet is incorrect. The Washigton Monument is 90 degrees to the ground & thus must obey the rule of a right triangle trig solution with respect to its shadow. I found the photo from the newspaper on the say anything blog site & its much more clear as a .jpg file. I measured height of the monument & got 2″ from my computer screen ( It doesn’t matter what size screen you use because of the law of similar triangles the results will still be relative in measurements ). The shadow of it measured 2.5″. The right triangle solution for the angle from the base to the shadow’s end & back to the top of the monument is found using the formula:
tan A = a / b
A = to the angle we want resolved from the above description.
a = to the height of the Monument.
b = to the length of the shadow.
a / b = 2 / 2.5 = 0.8 arc tan comes to ~ 38.66 degrees.
Washington DC is at latitude 38 degrees 54 minutes = 38.883 degrees decimal.
38.883 – 38.66 = 0.217 degrees difference.
These values are equal when the sun crosses the ecliptic on Sept 22 ( The sun also crossed the ecliptic on the same day in 1997 ). This photo is with in a day of Solstice.
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The sun is at solstice ( Northern most latitude the sun goes in the northern hemisphere = 23.44 degrees decimal on June 21st , & the same value in the southern hemisphere on Dec 21st ) every 6 months.
2 x 23.44 = 46.88 degrees decimal / 6 mths = 7.74 degrees decimal per mth transit = 0.258 degrees decimal per day transit.
Note: This is the sun’s angle of change with respect to latitude. In astronomy this is called degrees Declination. Longtitude’s equivalent is called degrees of Right Ascension. At this point we don’t need the RA or Declination. Keeping it lat / long is good enough for the layman.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
The image shown in the Saint Petersburg times & cited by C. Richter was taken on either Sept 21st or Sept 23rd prior to the year 2004. This is contrary to both dates cited in the paper article. If it was shot the day of the 9/12 rally the angle would have been 36.283 degrees decimal. If it was shot on Oct 4th, 1997 the angle would have been 35.883. The smaller the angle the longer the monuments shadow. There are smaller structures in the image where the American Indian Museum is now & they go back as far as the 1997 rally. Either the photos are from another rally or they are doctored. I would like to know the blogs source of this as its a restricted airspace since 911 protected by automated defensive positions.
The image also has a walled in structure on the SE corner of Constitution Ave. NW & 15 St. NW, visible to the left of the Washinton Monument on the greens, that doesn’t exist now.
Also funding for the Park Service was yanked in 1996 & estimates are usually derived by the Police crowd control devision now.
Does anyone really think that there would be available a photograph that would PROVE more crowds for the inaugeration? If there was, it surely would not be released. We do know who controls the media, do we not?
Wake up people, or should I say “Sheeple”.
Correction to above, a photo proving moer for the tea party. If it exists, we will NEVER see it.
I have done my own study base on devised methodology and calculation which you can find here:
http://deathbymedia.wordpress.com/2009/09/22/912-washington-dc-tea-party-rally-crowd-estimation/
It’s backed by evidence (pictures and clips) and determining the boundaries of the protesters and calculation of final tally derived from the density of the crowd at each given block. My calculus puts the figures around 130k up to 160k.
Uf its the wrong picture ill retract but I think its accurate.
Can you give me a link djer? Maybe when you’re done being an ass?
It was definitely more than 100.
The Sparkie Arbuckle fan club met on the mall that day too, but only accounted for about 95% of the crowd. There was definitely at least 100 rightwing tea-baggers there.
I retract the last post as I finally found a similar angle on the building in question. I DO NOT believe everything thrown at me by the right, but when 90% of what the lefties say is a lie you tend to over react to accusations.
Sorry.
The photo above however lends creedence to the 1mil number anyway. Why the hell are we focusing on the NUMBER like this to please the Libs anyway? It was over 500k just from that shot. If everyone took up twice as much room as at the inauguration but the same total space on the mall and streets, then 500k is still ONE HELL OF A NUMBER when there is no event or speaker or concert happening and people had to pay their own way to get there.
This is a small representation of the totality of the whole on our side.
The frickin Museam is ON THIS PICTURE! Here is the Google Maps link to the museum http://tinyurl.com/kwoeo5 You can find it right at the end of the row of buildings on the right side of that photo above.
Any other stupid arguments? Its called Vantage Point! Just because it looks different from that view doesn’t mean it isn’t there morons.
As for the lighting, you can’t see the sky, how do you know the sun didn’t peek through, or that the lighting from that angle still looked like a sunny day?
Give up already.
Thanks carrick. A bunch of bloggers got taken in on this. As you’ve seen I corrected.
I wish there was a good aerial shot but I just can’t seem to find one.
Dude, that link goes to a map of New York.
And i do think the image I originally posted is wrong. I updated with a more accurate (though ground-level) picture.
Ah, here’s another shot of the tea party which shows that the picture above is inaccurate.
I’ll do the correction.
Though, judging from the way they filled up the side street i still don’t think the 1,000,000 figure is off by much.
Here’s an image that shows the tea party on the mall. I think they marched up a side street and then filled the mall.
I’m working on this right now.
Here’s a google maps picture (street view and satellite) of the American Indian museum.
Looking at that and looking at my picture, it looks like it’s there.
DJ’er, when you’re done being an asshole, can you give me a link somewhere to disprove this? I’m willing to correct the mistake, but given your level of dishonesty I’m certainly not just going to take your word for it.
You sir and your Fox news are nothing but liars and con artists
We shall see in November who the voters believe are the true political con artists and biggest liars. Never in my study of American political history have I seen a US President so out of touch with The People.
New Polls show that voters don't really know Obama's personal faith. The WH has responded strongly to that dynamic because they know how serious it is when The People are so unsure of who their president is and what he truly represents
It could be, and voters will decide, that we elected in 2008 the most anti-American president EVAH, and voters will want to fix that mistake by making Republicans the majority in Congress in Nov. 2010. My take is that scenario is very real.
The March for Women's Lives, which is what the picture that's been circulating really shows, had 1.15 million people attending. I know, I was an organizer and we handed out stickers to get as good a count as possible. In any case, the newspapers put us around 600-700k. They're estimating 96k for the Tea Party March. You guys have a long way to go before you even get close.