Say Anything Blog

No to all of the question answered. Your daugther has good taste to boo them.

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Yes, in a strange twist of logic and a denial of reality, they are selling the same old ‘workers paradise’ lie that in a workers state, with a redistribution of wealth everyone is free to pursue happiness. It is a sociailist utopia, a dream that results in the enslavement of everyone except the ruling class. I think they actually believe what they are selling is freedom, they are deceived!

No matter the age or state of health, for a military man it is always glorious to tilt at windmills, rescue a fair Dulcinea and be a gallant knight in armor in a glorious cause.

Yes, in a strange twist of logic and a denial of reality, they are selling the same old ‘workers paradise’ lie that in a workers state, with a redistribution of wealth everyone is free to pursue happiness. It is a sociailist utopia, a dream that results in the enslavement of everyone except the ruling class. I think they actually believe what they are selling is freedom, they are deceived!

Neiman you’re right

Check out:
Goon’s North Dakota Red Neck
Goon’s World

I think they actually believe what they are selling is freedom, they are deceived!

Well whether or not they think they’re advancing freedom is different from whether or not they actually are advancing freedom.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

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Under Obama, religion and speech will be more suppressed than they are now.  However, the peoplo will still be free to do all the perverse things (abortion, any form of sex, etc.).

You don’t have to be a moron to be a liberal Democrat but it sure helps.

docdave. I bet you $200.00 nothing of what you say will happen. Are you game?

ellinas I wouldn’t take that bet, Obama is being financed by secular progessive.

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Goon’s North Dakota Red Neck
Goon’s World

Well.. I despise Obama and most of the democratic party platform.  Saying that there are some social issues some dems are for that do/would make people more free in my eyes. 

1.  Pro-Choice on abortion.  By giving people the option of having an abortion if they choose, that makes them more free.  Obviously this is a democratic party platform stance. 

2.  Medical Marijuana Laws.  Giving people the choice to “puff the chiva” if they choose to help medical ailments.  Some dems are behind this, don’t know if it’s made it into the platform.

3.  Gay Marraige.  Giving homosexual couples the choice to marry if they choose.  I would say lifting the ban on that in most states would make those folks more free.  I mean really, how does it affect anyone else if two gay people want to get married. 

Those are few off the top of my head.  On Social issues I think some of their stances would make certain people more free.  On most fiscal issues their stances would not.

The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter
-Winston Churchill

1.  Pro-Choice on abortion.  By giving people the option of having an abortion if they choose, that makes them more free.  Obviously this is a democratic party platform stance

Got to have them abortions on demand. Yikes!

2.  Medical Marijuana Laws.  Giving people the choice to “puff the chiva” if they choose to help medical ailments.  Some dems are behind this, don’t know if it’s made it into the platform

Dude where is my Bong

Check out:
Goon’s North Dakota Red Neck
Goon’s World

Pro-Choice on abortion.  By giving people the option of having an abortion if they choose, that makes them more free.

Free to murder an innocent human being in the womb is not liberty, is it moral decay and it violates the rights of the child.

Medical Marijuana Laws.

Ah, the freedom to be stoned! Is that what our Founding Fathers meant by liberty?

Gay Marraige.

Free to pervert the institution of marriage and free to shove your penis in the shit shoot of another man - really a quite lovely aspiration. Freedom to undermine the family, the basic building block of a stable a free society. Another freedom I doubt our Founding Fathers would have envisioned.

No matter the age or state of health, for a military man it is always glorious to tilt at windmills, rescue a fair Dulcinea and be a gallant knight in armor in a glorious cause.

restoring habeas corpus.

Free to murder an innocent human being in the womb is not liberty, is it moral decay and it violates the rights of the child.

That is pretty much what the debate comes down to.  If you feel people should be free to terminate a early pregnancy if they choose.  That argument aside, the government allows you that choice, which makes you more free.  Which is a democratic and Obama position. 

Ah, the freedom to be stoned! Is that what our Founding Fathers meant by liberty?

Is getting drunk? What is the difference between the two? Really? It’s a law in place that makes people less free. It restricts their choices in life. 

Free to pervert the institution of marriage and free to shove your penis in the shit shoot of another man - really a quite lovely aspiration. Freedom to undermine the family, the basic building block of a stable a free society. Another freedom I doubt our Founding Fathers would have envisioned.

So… basically you agree the points I’ve made increase freedom and choice, but you don’t agree with those freedoms, so therefore you say “if the founding fathers didn’t want it, then it’s bad”

hmmm....maybe I should stop feeding the trolls

The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter
-Winston Churchill

1.  Pro-Choice on abortion.  By giving people the option of having an abortion if they choose, that makes them more free.  Obviously this is a democratic party platform stance.

I don’t think murdering your offspring is anyone’s idea of “freedom.”

2.  Medical Marijuana Laws.  Giving people the choice to “puff the chiva” if they choose to help medical ailments.  Some dems are behind this, don’t know if it’s made it into the platform.

Legalizing marijuana is not part of the Democrat party platform so while there may be isolated support there isn’t broad support, and I don’t think we can count this as something Obama supports until he unequivocally comes out in favor of it.

3.  Gay Marraige.  Giving homosexual couples the choice to marry if they choose.  I would say lifting the ban on that in most states would make those folks more free.  I mean really, how does it affect anyone else if two gay people want to get married.

On gay marriage I can agree.  That would make people one free.

But still, that’s just one issue.  You make broad references to his support for certain social programs.  I think we need to be more specific.

Certainly I don’t think believing that one class of American should live on the backs of another class is anyone’s idea of advancing freedom.

restoring habeas corpus.

Habeas corpus was never lost.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

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Because I don’t think anyone is going to be able to come up with one.

On gay marriage I can agree.  That would make people one free.

Well, I have to run so I won’t counter your last post, but what I will say is.. I found one.. thhhhuubbbbb!.

The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter
-Winston Churchill

That is pretty much what the debate comes down to.  If you feel people should be free to terminate a early pregnancy if they choose.  That argument aside, the government allows you that choice, which makes you more free.

The government could also make us more free by making it legal for me to come to your house and steal your potato chips, but again I don’t think that advances the ideals of liberty.

You cannot advance freedom at the expense of another.  Sure the mom is free to choose to murder her offspring, but the kid doesn’t get a choice.  And certainly Barack Obama and his ilk don’t support giving the father a choice.

So you’re making a pretty lame argument here.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Well, I have to run so I won’t counter your last post, but what I will say is.. I found one.. thhhhuubbbbb!.

Yeah.  One.

The exception that proves the rule.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

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ok, I got a few more minutes here.

Yeah.  One.

The exception that proves the rule.

Well you said one!

On the whole I’ll agree that Dems are usually a hinderance to the advancement of freedom.  I just hate absolutes and had to find at least one exception to the rule. 

You cannot advance freedom at the expense of another.

Agreed

Sure the mom is free to choose to murder her offspring, but the kid doesn’t get a choice.  And certainly Barack Obama and his ilk don’t support giving the father a choice.

So you’re making a pretty lame argument here.

This devolves into the whole tired debate on when the baby is actually alive and such.  Personally if it’s in the first month or two I don’t think it’s murder.  That debate will rage on forever.

Have to agree to disagree.

The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter
-Winston Churchill

I just hate absolutes and had to find at least one exception to the rule.

Good show. Nice to find a critical thinker.

“Behind Communism, Fascism, behind all occupations and invasions lurks a more basic, pervasive evil… a parade of people marching by with raised fists and shouting identical syllables in unision.” - Milan Kundera

This devolves into the whole tired debate on when the baby is actually alive and such.  Personally if it’s in the first month or two I don’t think it’s murder.  That debate will rage on forever.

Have to agree to disagree.

For my part, I’d suggest that life is a continuum of development that begins at conception and proceeds through the years until death.  Trying to define a point within that continuum as the time at which life begins, which suggests that all the growth and development which takes place before it is not life, is absurd.

It’s so arbitrary that you might as well say “Life begins when the baby can crawl.” Or “life begins when the child reaches puberty.”

It seems to me that in matters as important as the abortion issue we should be precise.  Believing that life dosen’t begin until after “the first month or two” makes no sense to me.

But I guess since you don’t want to discuss it we’ll agree to disagree.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Well you said one!

Heh.  I did.  And I actually hadn’t thought of the gay marriage issue.

On that issue Democrats do support expanding freedom.

But I’m not seeing anything else.  And I’m genuinely asking here.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Rob! I am ashamed of you. Allowing your daughter to throw candy at Obamoids. Shocking. Couldn’t you find her a couple of bags of candied apples?

Una Salus Victus Nullam Sperare Salutem

But I’m not seeing anything else.  And I’m genuinely asking here.

Democrats are about freedom on ALL the social issues. However, their reticence on fiscal freedoms undermine all of their social beliefs (money knows no creed, sex, or race). So their ideology is like a snake eating its own tail.

For my part, I’d suggest that life is a continuum of development that begins at conception and proceeds through the years until death.  Trying to define a point within that continuum as the time at which life begins, which suggests that all the growth and development which takes place before it is not life, is absurd.

You’re absolutely right. But then, for me abortion was never a debate about whether or not fetus = life. It’s really a debate about how to define “human” and whether all life should be held in absolute reverence. Obviously I don’t believe in absolutes, especially when it comes to this debate.

“Behind Communism, Fascism, behind all occupations and invasions lurks a more basic, pervasive evil… a parade of people marching by with raised fists and shouting identical syllables in unision.” - Milan Kundera

It seems to me that in matters as important as the abortion issue we should be precise.  Believing that life dosen’t begin until after “the first month or two” makes no sense to me.

But I guess since you don’t want to discuss it we’ll agree to disagree.

I was at work at the time and had about 30 second to type out a response.  This post was just too juicy to pass up

What I meant by “the first month of two” is I think it’s ok for a woman to have an abortion during the first trimester.  After that she needs to let the pregnancy run it’s course and give it up for adoption if her and the father don’t want the child.  Those late term abortions are just wrong and should be illegal. 

That being said, I’ve found getting into a drawn out debate about abortion is usually fruitless in the end.  People rarely change their position or give any ground on the issue, it’s too emotional for most.

Who knows.. my wife is due with our first in 5 days.. maybe I’ll change my opinion shortly there after.

The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter
-Winston Churchill