I attack you because:…

Because you are a weird little groupie stalker who has nothing else in life. You even plagiarize one of my old signatures for your screen name. It’s hard to take anyone seriously who does that kind of crap.
You might someday grow up and have the courage to state your own beliefs and principles, along with what you’ve learned in life(if anything); until then, you’re just sniping at people who have the courage of their convictions.
Keep explaining yourself; maybe someone will actually read your drivel.

Robert is a hypocritical bully who doesn’t even know how to make a logical argument.

I proved that when I publicly humiliated him with my challenge.

That’s not socialism, fool. That’s called federalism.

I’m puzzled by your comment as well…perhaps you could clarify?

Mike,

Certainly! Your reasoned civility is always welcome.

As I see it, the definition and “original intent” of a federalist system was that government actions should be taken by the lowest level of authority possible, rather than the highest available. If the people of Alaska decide to allow the extraction of their state’s energy resources, and charge the oil companies a fee/tax for the privilege of doing so, they should be free to make and implement that decision without the autocratic interference of the federal government. Likewise, if they decide that all Alaskans should share equally in the revenue generated, I don’t see how that is of any concern to New Jersey-Americans or Washington bureaucrats.

Calling it “socialism” is both puerile and petty. The wealth created by the labors of one group of Alaskans, plumbers, for example, is not being appropriated to be given to those who are unproductive and have created no wealth.

In a sense, its analogous to the rights acknowledged by our Declaration of Independence and our Constitution to have been “endowed” to us all by “our Creator.” Those rights were endowed to all, just as the energy resources in question were “endowed” to all Alaskans.

Incidentally, calling it a “windfall profit tax” as some on the “progressive” Left are pleased to do, is more rhetorical nonsense. Only an ignorant hack would try to label a fee/tax on a raw material a “windfall profit tax.” It has nothing to do with windfalls or profits.

Here’s some light reading for the evening:

The Asheville (N.C.) Citizen Times reports, “A dead bear was found dumped this morning on the Western Carolina University campus, draped with a pair of Obama campaign signs, university police said.”

Maintenance workers at 7:45 a.m. found a 75-pound bear cub dumped at the roundabout at the entrance to campus, said Tom Johnson, chief of university police. “It looked like it had been shot in the head as best we can tell. A couple of Obama campaign signs had been stapled together and stuck over its head,” Johnson said.

http://www.editorandpublisher.com/eandp/news/article_display.jsp?vnu_content_id=1003875872

(CNN) — A North Carolina congressman locked in a tight re-election race admitted Tuesday to recently telling a crowd of John McCain supporters that “liberals hate real Americans,” the latest in a string of comments from Republicans that appear to question Democrats’ patriotism.

Rep. Robin Hayes, a five-term Republican who has been heavily targeted by Democrats this election cycle, first denied making the remarks, but conceded Monday afternoon that he was accurately quoted.

http://politicalticker.blogs.cnn.com/2008/10/21/congressman-admits-saying-liberals-hate-real-americans/

Well, woof, considering that the national media’s attention on Sarah Palin involves one thing and one thing only – the search for a “gotcha moment”, is it really any surprise that she might have trouble answering some of the 50 thousand questions they have for her.

The real question is, do you honestly think Obama would do any better if subjected to the same media interrogation ? We know how Biden would do, he would just make some shit up! More than likely, Obama would become offended and declare that the media were only questioning him so hard because he’s black.

See ? Creating a media caricature is easy.

To hammer it home: Communism is a socioeconomic structure that promotes the establishment of an egalitarian, classless society based on common ownership of the means of production and property in general.

Now what is Alaska’s “permanent dividend fund” other than the “common ownership” of property?

It is intellectually dishonest to split hairs on this one, guys. Just admit what it is.

robert108 – likwid: You missed it; this is a fee for the use of a resource

No, thanks for assuming otherwise, but I believe that I explained just that up above. It is a “fee” for property that everybody owns, i.e.: pretty much the whole idea of communism.

Thanks for playing.

verbiage? that seems to imply she can speak in sentences. not much content? in the words? in between the ears? in the huffy, emotional, cultural vitriol? all of the above?

We could probably replace she with he and you would have plugs or NOBAMA.

Sparkie,

Please show me where I have labeled a similar action by Californians “socialism.” I don’t believe I have tried to hold you to account for the hateful inanities spewed by others. Only your own.

Those are awful stories!

Obama is a Racist and a Socialist.

Wow, you went from condemning them to adding fuel to the fire in less than 3 sentences. Well done.

likwid: Alaska has had this policy for a very long time, through different governors. My telling the truth that this isn’t anything resembling communism, as you wrongly assert, is not dependent upon who is currently the governor of Alaska.
Wrong again.

likwid: You missed it; this is a fee for the use of a resource; the oil companies have a choice, in that they can drill elsewhere, if the cost/benefit doesn’t work out. Some other State can choose to not charge the fee, thus attracting the business. Since the oil companies choose to pay the fee, it is just another business transaction.
Socialism involves forced confiscation, for social engineering purposes, and doesn’t involve choice.

The State of Alaska is extracting dollars from the energy companies and distributing those dollars to its citizens…spreading the wealth as it were.

Wrong! Bat has already given you the real explanation, but you ignore it, choosing instead to try to spin it to serve your own agenda. Here it is again:

This is a fee for the use of the resources that belong to the people of Alaska. Unlike Obama’s Marxist redistribution plan, the oil companies get something for what they pay. In Obama’s Marxist redistribution plan, those who have their earnings confiscated receive nothing in return, and are told that it’s their obligation to give up their earnings.
Big difference.

Alaska’s plan simply says: “Here’s what it costs to extract our oil.” If it’s not worth it to the oil companies, they can choose to drill elsewhere. With Obama’s Marxist redistribution plan, there is no choice.
Again, big difference.

I get the sense that if the Democrat candidate hailed from Alaska, you would be against this redistribution of wealth.

Wrong. I hold no such position; you’re just making that up.

And unlike you, I don’t pretend to know all of the truth all of the time so I do value the opinions of others.

Unlike you, Mike, I don’t attribute statments to people who haven’t made them. I never said I “know all of the truth all of the time”; you just made that up. I know the truth about this particular issue. You are attempting a smear by an improper generalization. Shame on you!

Bat One – Calling it “socialism” is both puerile and petty. The wealth created by the labors of one group of Alaskans, plumbers, for example, is not being appropriated to be given to those who are unproductive and have created no wealth.

The “permanent dividend fund” is redistribution given to those who did not earn the wealth. The idea that “the people of Alaska” own the oil resources and therefore deserve the fruits of someone else’s labor is is pretty damn socialistic any which way you cut it.

Those rights were endowed to all, just as the energy resources in question were “endowed” to all Alaskans.

Sounds like a justification that could easily be given by the communists.

Take a step back and look at it.

knobert,
again you show your lack of objectivity in your approach to virtually everything you address. You are a partisan hack. You bend whatever you discuss to fit your particular warped idology, and you do it with no finesse or understading of what your inconsistent blather makes you look like. You are a fool. You are a buffoon.
You remind me of Limbaugh or Olberman, but without the humor or entertainment value. Even these partisan hacks make more intellegent arguments than you do, and that is saying alot. They both have some intellectual constistency, while you just pick whatever you “FEEL” and make your lame facts fit your “FEELINGS”. Logic is relative to what you “feel” about something. You are a dipshit in a hat and you are your own worst enemy.
People who feel instead of think usually make the wrong decisions. Used to be the exclusive practice of liberals. Do you like taking on the worst traits of the liberals so you will “FEEL” better? You must really like conservative talk radio. They do this all the time as well, but most of them are much better at it than you are. At least they are making $$ and being productive. You simply have nothing else to sustain you.
Dipshit

Unlike Obama’s Marxist redistribution plan, the oil companies get something for what they pay.

They get to keep their jobs. It is a tax to work.

In Obama’s Marxist redistribution plan, those who have their earnings confiscated receive nothing in return, and are told that it’s their obligation to give up their earnings.

They get to keep their jobs. It is a tax to work.

Same thing.

One can split hairs with Alaska’s “permanent dividend fund”, but in the end it is a socialistic redistribution of wealth from the producers to the unproductive.

knobert,
Thanks for the advice, but you have no ground to advise anyone on anything. I dont take advice from dipshits like you.
Poor scared little knobert.

robert108 – Wrong. I hold no such position; you’re just making that up.

I am making nothing up. I said that I get the sense.

Words mean things. You too willy-nilly accuse people of making shit up, and quite frankly – it is fucking insulting. I don’t know if you do it on purpose because you’re a partisan or if you really have this much difficulty with the language, but it happens all of the time.

likwid: Alaska has had this policy for a very long time, through different governors.

Irrelevant. A spade is a spade.

My telling the truth that this isn’t anything resembling communism…

Call it what you want. Here’s what McCain had to say today:

After all, before government can redistribute wealth, it has to confiscate wealth from those who earned it. And whatever the right word is for that way of thinking, the redistribution of wealth is the last thing America needs right now. In these tough economic times, we don’t need government “spreading the wealth”…

Dance around the truth that Alaska’s “permanent dividend fund” is redistribution and call it a “fee” instead of a tax, much like any Democrat would do when incurring new taxes. It doesn’t make a difference, robert108. A spade is a spade.

Frankly, for so many conservatives to rail against socialist redistribution out of one side of their mouths while defending Alaska’s “permanent dividend fund” out of the other is rank hypocrisy. A little consistency would be nice.

I’m not sure whether your characterisation would fly with some of your conservative colleagues.

Mike,

I couldn’t care less. I am selective about whose opinions I value, and partisan affiliation is not a consideration.

Next, can we agree to dispense with the hyperbolic “windfall profit tax” label? The fee/tax has nothing to do with either windfalls or profits… okay?

Yes, the state of Alaska is charging a fee/tax on behalf of those whose energy resources are being extracted, much like a lumber company would be charged a fee for the trees removed from a landowner’s property.

The difference between this and socialism is that in this instance the fruits of one man’s labors are not being involuntarily taken to support others or to equalize the lives of all.

As for the federal government, I don’t know the specifics, but I’m sure they’re collecting more than their “fair share” on every barrel of oil and very cubic foot of gas. Oddly enough, if you look at the original Constitution, before the 16th Amendment, this sort of fee/tax is actually one of the few sources of revenue specified to the federal government.

As I understand it, money from Alaska drilling goes into a separate trust fund that is them distributed annually to all Alaskans. Kinda like the way Social Security or the Highway Trust fund used to work before a Democrat President and a Democrat Congress “unified” the federal budget process replacing surplus trust fund moneys with Treasury IOUs, in effect stealing their grandchildren’s future retirement.

Instead of being so obsessed with me

You deserve everything you get from me. I attack you because:
A) You are the big bully on the block, and I like to attack bullies.
B) You are NOT a good example of conservative values or ethics. You are emotional and lame, and at some point in your pathetic life you absorbed all the worst traits of liberal and began to practice then in the name of conservativism. As a pragmatic conservative who values intellectual reason, I think you give conservatives a bad name. IMO you and your ilk are the problem with the GOP and why they will be smashed on 11-4. Anti-intellectual conservative is an oxymoron, but somehow they(you and your ilk) have taken over the party all the same. This must be stopped, or the dems will have free reign for a long time to come. You hurt the conservative cause by being an obtuse hypocrite, and by doing it in the name of all conservatives.
C) You are easy to defeat because you are a hypocrite. Even when a hypocrite is right about something, they are not taken seriously because they cant be trusted. You are no exception.
D) You entertain me in the afternoons when things get quiet around here. As a man who stays busy and has little time for public service(sarcasm), I can get both entertainment value and perform a public service by attacking you when you leave yourself open, and you leave yourself open to attack almost constantly.
E) Someone has to do it. Why not me?

See knobert, you call it obsession because you have nothing else to defend yourself with. I call it defending the party and the principals of pragmatic fiscal and personal responsibility conservatism. You just happen to be the big blathering idiot defending stupidity and spewing nonsense while the party withers on the vine. Too bad for you. If you dont like it you can always leave and find another place to bully and blather away day after day almost 25,000 times.
By the way, posting in numbers like you post (almost 25,000 times) makes calling me or anyone else “obsessive” irrelevant, as your the most obsessed nitwit on the SAB block. Hypocrites have no credibility.

A little consistency would be nice.

You keep missing it. This is a condition of doing business in oil in Alaska. It is federalism, pure and simple. No one is forcing oil companies to do business in Alaska; they are there of their own free will. None of that is present in either socialism or communism, which don’t allow such choices.
You’re just wrong on this one, likwid.

Mike, you just don’t get it blah blah blah. You said [insert something you never said] and I proved you wrong. And you don’t like that. Tough. Learn to deal with it. Blah blah blah.
-written in the style of robert108

Dont forget these other knobert classics:
Lying Leftie!
Moron!
Wrong Again!!
More marxist bullshit!!
I’m not a dipshit!
I had a business during the Carter administration, so I know everything!
Martha, get me my Geritol!
and of course “oop’s I crapped my pants”

You could at least be grateful for your screen name;

Please refer to reason A

A) You are the big bully on the block, and I like to attack bullies.

I am sure I would have just used my own name if it werent for you, so yes, THANKS VERY MUCH KNOBERT! You are inspiring!
By the way, why did you change it after I created this screen name? Cant stand the heat? Scared of a little opposition? That would be typical of a person like you knobert. Bullies dont like people who are not scared.
What about you? Dont you think “knobert” is kinda fun? Gives you that “Im a dickhead, but Im also a silly cartoon” sorta image doesnt it? Hope you like it, cuz it aint goin away anytime soon.

groupie: Notice how I never address you? I only reply to your juvenile ravings when it pleases me. You, on the other hand, address the bulk of your comments to me. You are obsessed. You might want to seek professional help with your problem.

ta-pocketa-pocketa-pocketa-pocketa-pocketa

Robert is a hypocritical bully who doesn’t even know how to make a logical argument. Nor does he have any relevant life experience to support half of his arguments.

I suspect knobert was a low level powerless paperpusher of some kind before he was relegated to obscurity in his retirement. If he were anything other than a peon way back when he was productive, he would have learned some interpersonal skills. I bet his boss hates his guts and was thrilled to be done with him when he retired. His obvious lack of understanding how the real world works, his constant defense of the most basic stupidity, his uncouth approach to everything, and his self destructive methods in dealing with adversity and opposing opinions is very telling. He is a fraud and he has no credibility.

Im just sayin.

Tagging in for likwidshoe…

In your opinion, is distributing the proceeds of royalty payments to the citizenry a legitimate function of government? Also,if the natural resources belong to the people of Alaska then is it an obligation of the government to set a royalty rate that is in the best interest of the owners of the resources?

I agree with lik that the federal character of America’s organisation really has nothing to do with Alaska’s practise of issuing dividend cheques other than the obvious fact that Alaska is entitled to do so. I agree with you that the people of Alaska own the resources and thus are entitled to share in the rewards available.

she put a windfall
profits tax on oil companies and
sends every Alaskan a check.

Think she’s a crypto-socialist?

WOOF,

That’s not socialism, fool. That’s called federalism. I know its inconvenient for leftwing autocrats like you, but that’s one of the reasons we have states in the first place.

…but it happens all of the time.

Another unfounded generalization from you.

Irrelevant. A spade is a spade.

Wrong again; it was a specific reply to a specific false accusation you made:

But since it is Palin who is from Alaska, and since Palin is the GOP’s rising star, and since Palin has been saying, “now is not the time to experiment with socialism”, you’re going to split hairs trying to explain away the fact that she endorses a socialistic policy.

I refuted your accusation against me, and you also try to win your faulty argument by assuming that Alaska’s business deal with the oil companies is “socialism”.

Before you go off on another rant, you asserted that my saying Alaska’s program was not socialism(which it clearly isn’t), I was just saying that because I support Sarah. When I stated the truth that this business deal with the oil companies has been in force for a long time, you falsely claimed it was “irrelevant”. It’s a direct refutation of your false accusation against me, so it is quite relevant to your false accusation.

I have been pretty grouchy lately so maybe I will get him tomorrow. I think this election has brought out the worst in everyone.

I had said, “‘drilling elsewhere’ isn’t an option because the oil isn’t elsewhere.” Meaning that the oil underneath the land of Alaska can’t be gained by drilling elsewhere.

Keep on spinning.

robert108 – Your assertion that Alaska is the only place in the US where oil can be found is obviously in error.

I never asserted such an erroneous statement.

I had said, “‘drilling elsewhere’ isn’t an option because the oil isn’t elsewhere.” Meaning that the oil underneath the land of Alaska can’t be gained by drilling elsewhere. Now, I’m sure that some of that oil can be gained by a diagonal drilling in from Russia or Canada (which says nothing of the legality of such a practice), but all in all the way to tap the oil underneath the land of Alaska is to drill in Alaska.

Unlike you, Mike, I don’t attribute statments to people who haven’t made them.

Are you kidding? Look at the example above.

When I stated the truth that this business deal with the oil companies has been in force for a long time, you falsely claimed it was “irrelevant”.

Whether or not the “permanent dividend fund” has been in place for five years or 100 years means nothing as to what it is. It doesn’t matter who put in the policy or how long it has been in force. It doesn’t change what it is.

You keep missing it. This is a condition of doing business in oil in Alaska.

Oh no, I get the point. Redistribution is one of the conditions of drilling in Alaska. Just as in socialist countries, the tax on the wealth creation is a business cost.

It is federalism, pure and simple.

Federalism has nothing to do with this subject. Federalism is nothing more than recognizing the sovereign rights of a state to do as they wish as far as those conditions do not violate certain trade rules in the U.S. Constitution.

Alaska has the right to impose the “permanent dividend fund” on the oil companies. Nobody is arguing otherwise. The discussion thus far has been centered on the “permanent dividend fund” itself.

No one is forcing oil companies to do business in Alaska; they are there of their own free will. None of that is present in either socialism or communism, which don’t allow such choices.

It is the same “choice”. Pay up or don’t work.

You’re just wrong on this one, likwid.

So you say. With all of the “you missed it”, “you ignored it”, and unfounded assertions, any point you are trying to make is lost in the rhetoric.

In the end, the “permanent dividend fund” is a redistribution of wealth from the producers to the unproductive under the guise that the Alaskans have common ownership of the land (at least, the small parts of the state that aren’t owned by the feds). It is classic socialism with all of the same justifications.

Now I will go back to ignoring you, robert108. I don’t believe you to be honest, at all. It gets tiring correcting the false assertions made in my name and while the humorous claims of not attributing statements to people who haven’t made them were once ironically funny to read, I’ve more than got my fill in.

Have a good day.

Mike, you just don’t get it blah blah blah. You said [insert something you never said] and I proved you wrong. And you don’t like that. Tough. Learn to deal with it. Blah blah blah.

-written in the style of robert108

Still fact-free. You could at least be grateful for your screen name; without me, you might have not been able to think of one.

Robert is a hypocritical bully who doesn’t even know how to make a logical argument. Nor does he have any relevant life experience to support half of his arguments.

Wrong! Bat has already given you the real explanation, but you ignore it, choosing instead to try to spin it to serve your own agenda.

I didn’t ignore it at all. I greatly respect Bat’s viewpoint but it is at odds with the position advanced by many at SA. I’m surprised that you agree with him quite frankly although maybe it serves your agenda in this case.

nope, she went from 50% thinking she is a poor potential pres to 55% in a week. that’s not ‘more popular’. did you know?

Sparkie, True. But it is because the poll you cite has nothing to do with popularity or approval. Try a different poll.

an attractive, earnest, confident candidate. Who Is Clearly Out Of Her League.

heh.

Cut the verbiage and there’s not much content there

verbiage? that seems to imply she can speak in sentences. not much content? in the words? in between the ears? in the huffy, emotional, cultural vitriol? all of the above?

she will go down in history as chapter 10 of the GOP’s schizoid meltdown. representing the evangelical types that reagan began courting. now, the neocons are added. a threesome. they always end in heartache. the death of the ‘old guard’. full stop.

Batone
Why is it when Alaska acts like socialists, then that’s federalism, but if California does it, then its socialist?

I like Sarah, she put a windfall
profits tax on oil companies and
sends every Alaskan a check.

Think she’s a crypto-socialist?

National Review’s K Parker:

Palin’s recent interviews with Charles Gibson, Sean Hannity, and now Katie Couric have all revealed an attractive, earnest, confident candidate. Who Is Clearly Out Of Her League.

No one hates saying that more than I do. Like so many women, I’ve been pulling for Palin, wishing her the best, hoping she will perform brilliantly. I’ve also noticed that I watch her interviews with the held breath of an anxious parent, my finger poised over the mute button in case it gets too painful. Unfortunately, it often does. My cringe reflex is exhausted.

Palin filibusters. She repeats words, filling space with deadwood. Cut the verbiage and there’s not much content there

In October 2007 Palin rolled out a tax increase plan on oil companies operating in Alaska, including a windfall profits tax. Palin’s plan, called the “Alaska’s Clear and Equitable Share” (ACES) plan, was approved by the state Legislature and includes:

* Raising the state’s current net profits tax on North Slope oil from a 22.5% to 25.0% base.

* A “progressive” windfall profits tax: When oil prices rise above about $50 a barrel, the tax rate increases by 0.2% for each additional dollar a barrel.

* A 10% tax floor on North Slope oil, to kick in if prices go below about $40 a barrel. [4]

http://www.mccainfactcheck.com/facts/11/palin_windfall_profits_tax_344511.shtml

Alaska’s Clear and Equitable Share” (ACEThat’s sweet Alinsky.

I like Sarah, she put a windfall
profits tax on oil companies and
sends every Alaskan a check.

The permanent dividend fund is no windfall profits tax, and was put in place before Sarah was born.