Dear Miles: (Or Microns, as the case may be) I’m trying to debate your points by taking them in order…starting with your very first point :

Cindy is probably scared that crazed, right wing, illiterate morons like most of you will steal the gravestone or hios (sic) remains, and I think it’s a fear that has some foundation.

So starting with your very first point, (which, unless Karl Rove is controlling your brain, you picked out yourself) let’s see if you are able to either make or understand a cogent, logical argument before we get to your regurgitated talking points on the Iraq war.

 Cindy is probably scared that…you will steal… his remains.  Now the original point of this thread is Casey Sheehan Doesn’t Have A Headstone . Your point is that if Casey had a headstone, the right-wing crazies would know where he was buried and dig up his body. Obviously, dare I say logically,  the "right-wing" must know where his body is buried, because they are commenting here on the lack of a proper headstone! (I believe there is a photo at the top of the page that depicts the scene.) Have you any evidence not gathered from under a tin-foil hat that supports this premise? Your original argument stated that this " fear… has some foundation."  Please elaborate: What foundation?

And again, on the theme Casey Sheehan Doesn’t Have A Headstone , whether Casey was killed in battle in Iraq or hit by a Humvee in Teaneck, New Jersey, isn’t he entitled to a little more respect from his own Mother than would be accorded to a John Doe in a potter’s field? Especially since his Mother has taken his sacrifice and parlayed it into her 15 minutes of fame in America? And THAT, (for those of you with short attention spans) is the discussion before us. I’ll let the other readers of this blog judge who is using some tactic to change the subject.

And as tempting as it would be to study the pathology of why you think a war voted on and authorized by both houses of Congress and the President is an "illegal" war, I am gainfully empolyed and have better things to do!

(As to my attacking "small irrelevant mistakes", you shouldn’t be so hard on yourself! I’m sure your parents did the very best they could!)

 

Dan,

 

The reason that George Soros is mentioned is because it was groups funded by him that in turn provided funding and management support and media guidance to the Cindy Sheehan road show last summer.  The media production facilities, the buses, the crosses and the protest signs, the tents, the food, right on down to the port-a-potties, all had to be paid for.  Certainly no one here is naïve enough to think that all that stuff just appeared magically all on its own.  The white production truck, for example, rents for $2600 per week, plus fuel, supplies, technician salaries and driver.  I know because I called and asked.  The buses were similarly priced.

 

The two biggest supporters of the Crawford camp-out were United for Peace and Justice (UFPJ), an umbrella group of leftist organizations founded by Castro admirer Leslie Cragan at the offices of People for the American Way, and MoveOn.org, the same group that announced little more than a year ago that they had “paid for” the Democratic Party and now “owned” it.  Both groups are supported by both Soros’ and Teresa Heinz Kerry’s TIDES Foundation.

Her media consultants, hired by the “True Majority” anti-war group, are a firm named Fenton Communications, whose clients include MoveOn.org, Air America, NAACP, and Common Cause, and the Santa Monica political consultancy of Zimmerman and Markham, whose chief causes are leftist anti-war zealotry and the repeal of all drug laws.

 

CV Rick,

????? 

Ah, reconstruction. Check out the credible New York Times for an article ion the US led debaucle:

http://www.nytimes.com/glogin?URI=http://gk.nytimes.com/mem/gatekeeper.html&OQ=_rQ3D1Q26URIQ3DhttpQ3AQ2FQ2Fwww.nytimes.comQ2F2004Q2F08Q2F09Q2FopinionQ2F09mon1.htmlQ26OQ51Q3D_rQ513D2Q5126orefQ513DsloginQ26OPQ3D6a282f25Q512FJctEJwlQ513BqhllPQ513CJQ513Czz!Jz2JzWJlQ517DQ517CQ5125Q517ClQ5125JzWnlQ5125(U8PnQ515D&OP=50ccb934Q2FigX9iwSQ24XQ3A!Q7DiYQ24zQ3Annw0ino_Q24XYQ24X!iWQ3AQ24XhXXnXomYQ24z

You’ll have to register. 

Halibutron couldn’t help but profit from the war, as they were the only company taken on. No other competition was allowed. As the US government caused the mess they are cleaning up, surely they should have made sure the money spent on reconstruction was spent where it should have been, not wasted, embezzeled and stolen. Have problems with the word ‘stolen’? In short, why should they make a profit?

Here’s a classic from you: "Halliburton has an expertise in getting men and material into difficult places on short notice. They’re good at what they do!" Yeah right. they were given the job of protecting Baghdad airport – they failed. They poisoned the water supply of American marines – they failed. See: http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/031606G.shtml They knew about this and covered it up.

Lets take a look at your list of reconstruction ‘efforts’:

Oooh, more cellphones! These same cellphones can be used to detonate IRD’s remotely - nice one USA! The same as leaving a huge stockpile of weapons unguarded when you invaded, had them all stolen, and now they’re used against you. 

Shame there’s no land telephone infrastructure. Who’s making money out of the cellphone contract? A US company, I bet. Remind me to check, I’d put money on it. Wow, debt has been forgiven? Shame the Iraqis are living in poverty and can’t benefit from this. I’m sure the US is though.

"The U.S. Army Corps of Engineers provides training on industrial equipment enabling Iraqis to operate and maintain equipment and power systems throughout the country.". no, it allows the US military to operate in this way. 80% of Baghdad only has power 25% of the day, no sanitation, no hospitals, no clean water supply. Oil fields are well protected though, go USA!

"Nearly 100 percent of Iraqi children have been vaccinated.". If that is true, that’s the only ray of sunlight in the whole sorry affair. It’s a shame that about 10,000 Iraqi children have been killed by direct military action by the US. Whew, thank god they were vaccinated!

Your figures on per capita income and businesses include FOREIGN businesses, not wholly domestic Iraqi concernes. Check your sources.

Nice job on the schools, Islam has a shocking record on education. I’d love to see the curriculum though.

It may have the internet cafe’s but no power to run them. Free press? I doubt that. The US military spread propoganda through the so called free press to make it look things are going well. They have admitted this. I hardly call this ‘free’. They do the same thing in the US. Check out: http://www.truthout.org/docs_2006/031606M.shtml. Shocking. There’s evidence to suggest that the US military have also shot and killed Iraqi journalist deliberately, and at the very least detained and tortured them.

"The country’s electrical output is near pre-war levels, and demand for electricity has doubled.". Check this out: http://www.truthout.org/docs_2005/122505G.shtml . It depends who you read, your source is unreliable, try using real figures. Is Truthout credible to you, or too truthful?

So I think you like to make fun of people’s spelling and diction just to cloud the truth, which is pretty small minded and sad really. You believe all you’re spoonfed because you can’t face the fact that your government is engaged in war crimes. Personally, I’m shocked. I lived in the US for years and it’s a great country with lovely people. Shame it’s come to this – I blame the Republicans and George Bush, I hope you can impeach him.

Out.

 

 

This headstone business is all a puzzlement to me. A lot of rumors are floating around and none of us really know what is in Cindy’s heart or mind. We haven’t read Casey’s will and we don’t have any legal standing. She’s right. This is no one’s business. B

But Cindy opened the door to public criticism by her actions, demands and inconsistencies. The bottom line is that she put herself into the public eye and once there people will ask questions. Seems that she expects others to have tough skins when she attacks them, but now when asked a tough question, she dodges and ducks. 

The big news story here is that Cindy was asked about the headstone and she had to defend her actions or inactions. My guess is that her handlers have prevented anyone from publicly asking a question like that. Kudos to Michell Malkin!

From listening to her response to Michelle Malkin’s questions and her response later, my guess is that this is not a priority or it would have been handled. The question seemed to really fluster her. It was obvious that she was not prepared to answer.

She’s a strange and very sad caricature. She has little, if any credibility. She’s become a buffoon. My guess is that most folks just look at her as odd. I do. Frankly, I am glad that I don’t live next door to her or share a work space.  

 

 

I’m not at all surprised.  It would take the intelligence of a prune to think that any of this Saint Cindy Roadshow had anything at all to do with Casey.

The Legion Brothers have been discussing this. Don’t be surprised if that soldier has a stone by Memorial Day. Wish I lived closer, I would do it myself. Screw that BITCH.

Dave: Nice straw men! First, it’s childhood communicable diseases, now it’s genocide in Dafur…If somebody cares about the hypocrisy of antiwar wingnuts, they can’t care about anything else at the same time???  Small world some people live in!

Perhaps the point is, given the extraordinary prominence given by the MSM to lightweights like Cindy (a media creation), celebs like Harry Bellafonte, & Babs Streisand with no expertise and a tin-foil hat perception of reality, maybe the media cannot be trusted not to distort the discussion of the important issues of our time…including genocide, communicable diseases etc.

Not to his mother, apparently.

This is really about the hypocrisy of Cindy Sheehan in using her son’s death to promote herself as an antiwar activist.

"The Right took her son…"   Yes! And then we "took" the Left’s dictionaries, so they could never make sense again!

It’s a real shame Casey does not have a headstone.

Cindy did not raise Casey – he grew up wiht his Dad and step-mom by his own choice. That Cindy ended up as his executor is fishy to say the least.

She obviously has no intention of honoring her son or the sacrifices he made for his country.

The American people had her figured out a long time ago – that’s why so few have any respect for her.

What a piece of shit Cindy is.

 

So, they avoided answering the question.  It’s Cindy who is the hater, btw.  Of course, it’s typical of lefties to accuse conservatives of what they do themselves.

hugh kennsukkit vomits, But hey far be it for "christians" to SHUT DOWN and block out reality and science based facts especially when they destroy all your fairy tales!

I’m agnostic. Where is your argument now?

You ASSume too much hugh.

Dave appears to be one of those tree hugging piece of shit hippies. Case closed. Fuck you Dave and the rest of your wanna-be activists. You wanna do something about the war? Get your ass up from your latte and go fight so the rest of our boys can come home. Oh yeah, and take a shower, you stink of patchouli.

Kyla,

You are correct.  However, the "family" must request it, and in this case, tragically, Momma Moonbat, as executrix of Casey’s estate, is considered legally "family."  

Hugh is obviously off his meds… I’d be willing to bet that a LOT of folks would make donations to the Get Hugh Some New Meds relief fund!

Remember! Incoherency strikes someone every twelve minutes!

davey gets it, he just likes playing circular wordgames. Michael W, you are correct,and she has said she will not make the request. A little fact that was stepped over during her bitch-in-the-ditch campaign last August. She was asked about this when they were doing the cardboard crosses with the names of war dead on them. Remember, the cosses that family members went and ripped down because their sons and daughters were not anti-war protestors.

Speaking up for those who can’t speak for themselves when it comes to life or death decisions is honorable and noble. Making a decision for an innocent person who can’t speak for themselves is self centered and irresponsible. Michael Shiavo had his wife executed because she was an inconveniance and that is what abortionists do too! Call it meddling or what ever you like. That is the liberal rant…The fact that there are still people who care enough about innocent lives being slaughtered makes me have faith in the human race! As far as Cindy Sheehan goes she disrespects her childs decision to fight for his country. She is hardly a grieving mother any longer. She is a shameless old hag who has not even taken the time to make sure her son has a tombstone. Hugh and his anti war anti republican BS is typical.

It is understandable to me. Cindy is not well. She really is a sick-o! BUT, Why didn’t the Father take care of that? Cindy Sheehan has been so busy with Hugo Chavez, Al Sharpton, and with all of her camping trips?

Cindy does have a monument…   

<a href="http://www.danegerus.com/weblog/Comments.asp?svComment=12854">
<b>to herself!</b></a>

She uses Casey’s death in Iraq to promote herself as a caring mother, asserting that she has some moral superiority, and doesn’t even honor him. 

I don’t know about Cindy setting herself up as a "caring mother" so much as she’s "set her self up" as an anti-war activist. From that view, she’s made a noble sacrifice: rather than spending money selfishly on a headstone, she’s instead decided to spend it in pursuit of peace. If I opposed the war, I’d be furious if our "leader" wasted precious finances for something so selfish as a headstone.

But, then again, Cindy Sheehan=BAD!, so I can understand your outrage.

hugh kennsukkit vomits, carrie my dear, don’t you understand that other people’s lives are REPUBLICAN’S business?

That’s funny.

the same crowd that made total fools of themselves and the state of florida during the terri schiavo fiasco…

Yes. Those fools who didn’t want a woman to die by order of a husband who stated his intentions and blew her money on himself and by a judge who was bought off. Those fools.

…are now dumping on a mom who’s son threw his life away for lies and war games for big business.

What was that son’s name? We’re talking about Casey here. You should stick to the story.

april 15th is coming DONT FORGET those "donations"! (mostly from the very same people who couldn’t wait for the return of jim bakker)

Do you really think this way? You have to be a joke, right?

hugh: Your disjointed and nonsensical thinking brands you as a borderline personality disorder sufferer.  Please get help.

Robert108, do you know for sure that Casey’s grave doesn’t have a headstone? 

She is the executor for her son’s affairs. The father is not going public, he is working to be made executor. Different states handle this in different ways, the usual method is a single person acts as the executor. A man I work with is going through a drawn out legal battle with his ex-wife over her failure to properly handle their oldest son’s estate. She took the insurance and burial policy money from his employer supplied insurance, never paid for the funeral, never had the headstone placed, took all the money he had in savings and checking accounts, sold his 2 vehicles and 4wheeler and never paid off any of his bills. His father began recieving collection notices on a car loan he cosigned on, the funeral director disscreetly asked when payment would be forthcoming. That is how all this came to light. No the court has to find where all the money went and K. has had to pay for the funeral and burial plot, so that they won’t disinter his son’s remains. A sad, though not uncommon, affair.

Dave … Hugh and the word virtue don’t really go together. To be virtuous don’t you have to be modest, honorable, moral, nobal, decent, ethical, and righteous???? He doesn’t really seem to have regard for anyone other than himself to me? I will try real hard to see Hugh in a different light. I really think there is good in everyone. I just haven’t been introduced to Hugh and his virtuous side yet??? His arrogant side keeps showing up! I agree self esteem is a virtue. BUT, I don’t think Hugh is displaying self esteem. I would call it arrogance. Silly me! What do I know? …

One more definition to add to your list: YOU = PSYCHO.

Zsa Zsa wrote: 

 Partisan politics is what continues to divide our country in a time where we should be united! Cindy Sheehan is a divider.

She’s also a "ditch bitch."

I meant "relating", not "reating".

Rick:  You wrote: "Robert, just saying that someone is wrong doesn’t make it so."  You consider that a refutation of what?  That statement applies to you as well.  Just because you say someone is wrong doesn’t make it so.  That isn’t any sort of reasoned debate.  Your assertion that I was using a Two Wrongs make a Right argument(not argumentation style), and since you didn’t read my original argument correctly, I pointed that out to you.  You chose to ignore that, or you just didn’t read it, which is your fault, not mine. 

I have had quite a few discussions with you on this blog, and your responses to me are generally off point.  You seem to respond to what you think I’m sayiong rather than what I am actually saying, so I assume you are hearing me through the distortion of prejudice.  I have stated many times that I am conservative, and you wrongly characterize that as being "right wing" which is probably the source of your prejudice and non-listening.  I do not support dictatorship, which is what right wingers stand for.  I support individual independence and a free people, free choices economic system.  That is a moderate position between two positions of central control.  The real right wing wants a strong leader making fundamental day to day decisions for the people, and the left wing wants the political class(party ideology) to make those decisions.  Maybe you think the academic intellectuals should make those decisions, I don’t know.

Casey still doesn’t have a headstone, and Cindy isn’t saying why. 

sorry LIKWID i thought AGNOSTIC meant "one who is NOT COMMITTED to believing in the existance or non-existance of god or gods"…….so apparently you have your own meaning for the word! Since surely an AGNOSTIC would never react or get pestered by any RELIGIOUS COMMENTS regardles of what cult or groupthink they were aimed at. As for calling you a "christian",once again an event that NEVER OCCURED. please go back and read the post and note the reference to the persons that were outside the hospice. i did notice that you skipped over the part about THE AUTOPSY,give ya credit at least your consistent. the coroner was "probably paid off "too,huh?

 

Uh oh,hold up! seems you might be right….i just looked up AGNOSTIC in the LIBERTY BAPTIST DICTIONARY and seems they too have a different meaning.(surprise surprise)

AGNOSTIC: christian or catholic who believes in bullshit and fairy tales when in the company of other dreamers. once out in the real world claims to be agnostic.

find that sign,,,,,,,,$1000 as soon as ya get it

THIS IS A LIE, HE HAS A GRAVESTONE…..SO SAD TO SEE THE RIGHT HAS TO TAKE HER SON, AND NOW HAS TO LIE TO MAKE HER LOOK LIKE THE BAD PERSON

How is it that, although Casey Sheehan’s parents were married at the time of his death (going through a divorce now), only his mother has the right to decide whether his grave gets a government issue (or other) tombstone?

2Hotel9, perhaps you can elucidate here?  I might like to hear more from Casey’s dad on this kind of thing, to be sure.

Robert, I’m going to carefully remind you what went on . . . even though you could read it yourself.

After my original comment in this thread you said:

It’s Cindy who is the hater, btw.  Of course, it’s typical of lefties to accuse conservatives of what they do themselves.

Here’s what I said:

Robert, are you saying that death threats and profanity aren’t a sign of hatred?

Here’s what you responded:

I think when Cindy takes responsibility for her death threats and profanity, we might be able to have a discussion.

You had the opportunity there to condemn the hatred and threats of violence against Cindy, but chose not to . . . in fact, you pinned the blame directly on her and in the process began a justification which is textbook, Two Wrongs Make a Right.  

I pointed it out and you’ve overspent my time trying to weasel out of it.  I’m done with this thread now.  When you have something new to say, please let me know. 

What is more ironic is that the US Government will provide a headstone FREE for her son just because he a vetern of the US Military.

My friend sent me this link and I took the time to read some well thought out comments, as well as some random liberal spewings.  While I myself am not in favor of this war or the decisions made by our good friend Cindy I must comment for the benefit of my fellow man.  You are throwing your emotions out there based on rumor, and that is the worst kind of criticism and judgement.  Any person with an IQ over 80 can tell you that a headstone will be gladly provided.  Failure to provide one and a continuing unmarked grave could result in someone trying to be buried there in the future.  A marker of remembrance is a necessity in cases like this, whether Cindy likes it or not.  Read a book people.  Maybe if you read about common sense you’ll get some.

Forever mocking you liberal douche-bags,

Haywood Jablowme

 

A headstone should be provided by the Gov’t, but this can take time. Most likely Casey pulled it under when he saw the way his mom has dissed him for doing what he thought was right and standing up for his own beliefs.

Miles: I knew that I could count on you! Your ego was just TOO great to resist a peek at whether your parting shot carried any weight. So, rather than chiding you for your lack of will, telling us goodbye forever and coming back (or was it a confusion as to the definition of terms…maybe you’re unclear on what “forever” means!) At any rate, you’re back. And as fate would have it, I am home with a touch of bronchitis, but even in my weakened state, I am able to parse the lamest of arguments (yours) and persevere.

So, you FINALLY get around to defending your first point! To wit, Cindy Sheehan didn’t erect a proper headstone for her son, for fear that “crazed, right-wingers” would steal his body, because once upon a time, some frat boys from a secret society at Yale supposedly stole the skull of Geronimo. That’s it??? That’s all you’ve got??? That’s “some foundation” for believing it????

Well, I hate to admit it, but that argument makes as much sense as any you’ve offered so far! This is, I suppose, the part where I give my Mea culpas, acknowledge your superior debating skills and retire from blogdom forever.

But, before I go, let me tell you of an acquaintance of mine from high school. He wanted to make a documentary film on the effects of the oil embargo on Iraqi children (perhaps a Michael Moore wannabe?). So, he ponied up his hard American currency and paid the dictator for access into Iraq. He was given a government “minder” to accompany him during the filming, so that every interview with doctors, nurse or men in the street would be overheard by a government thug who would report anyone who did not toe the party line.

The result was that he concluded that the “evil” George Bush was causing children to die for lack of food and medicine. Evil, stupid George Bush! During the liberation of Iraq, storehouses of food and medicine were found in the headquarters of the Iraqi Republican guards. (I added “Iraqi”, because if I hadn’t, you would have concluded that I was making one of your points for you!). So, during the UN “Oil for Food” debacle, Saddam skimmed millions for his palaces, stockpiled food and medicine for his army and deliberately let children starve and die for want of medicine to try to influence world public opinion to lift the embargo. So let me see…the “evil” George Bush gives food and medicine to kids, Saddam lets them suffer and die for political and financial gain. Free health care for children, access to medicine… yeah, I can see where you’d think Bush is “evil”!

You talk about the “thousands of innocent Iraqi civilians” killed. Would those be the ones Saddam gassed? Or the men, women and children found in mass graves with bullet holes in them? About the same time my acquaintance was in Iraq, the British press was reporting that the sons of Saddam were killing people by tossing them into industrial shredders , feet first, “so they would scream longer”. (You questioned if I read anything? Have you read anything other than the New York Times?) You talk about “rape” and “ torture” , as if what goes on in Iraq today is worse than under Saddam. Saddam and his sons were sociopaths .

Today, there are no government minders to report any anti-government rhetoric to someone who would have you tortured and killed. There is freedom from intimidation in Iraq. There is freedom of speech in Iraq. (Did you miss the part where the head of CNN confessed that they sugar coated everything they sent out of Iraq in order to maintain access to a friendly dictator?)

You scoff at the number of newspapers started and the number of cell phones (previously forbidden by Saddam). You sit at your keyboard, eating Cheetos, drinking Coke and take for freaking granted what has been denied to these people for decades and your argument is that “These same cellphones can be used to detonate IRD’s remotely…” Yes and airplanes can be flown into buildings…should we eliminate flying? Cell phones represent a level of freedom unknown under Saddam, unless you were his sons or his cronies. The same freedom you so cavalierly take for granted here is being given to the Iraqi people to use or misuse as they see fit.

You say, “Can anyone show me what has been built or improved? “ I give you a fraction of what has taken place and you dismiss it out of hand. Perhaps, if you would look beyond the mainstream media as your source of information, you would see that water projects, schools, electrical infrastructure are being rebuilt even as there is a faction that wants to destroy them as fast as they are built. Golly, we haven’t built electric plants fast enough to suit Miles because, I dunno, maybe people are still shooting at us! The war isn’t over yet, dimwit! The same types of people who would kill sick children for political gain are not above blowing up water purification plants or electric substations, either. Sorry the progress doesn’t meet your high standards. Maybe the evil George Bush is allowing the insurgents to blow up infrastructure to allow his friends at Halliburton to make more zillions!

And for all you “environmentalists”, how about Saddam destroying 90% of Iraq’s wetlands (over 3000 sq. miles)? From the Iraq Foundation ( Iraqfoundation.org) “a multibillion dollar effort, funded in part by the U.S. State Department and overseen by the Iraq Foundation, a U.S.-based Iraqi opposition group, aims to reverse Hussein’s damage.” Gee, Saddam destroys the environment at the end of the First Gulf War, the “evil” George Bush seeks to restore it. (Gee, maybe the Iraq Foundation is closer to the truth about what’s happening in Iraq than, I dunno…American liberals?)

So, let’s recap so far…the “evil” George Bush is for free healthcare for children, women’s suffrage (That means the right to vote, Miles!), equal opportunity for women, (I noticed you had nothing to say on the fact that women comprise 25 percent of the Iraqi parliament, which is the highest proportion in the Arab world and one of the largest percentages worldwide) That “evil” George Bush must have gotten your tongue!

So, where was I? Ah, yes! Free healthcare for children, equal rights for women, freedom of speech, freedom from intimidation, freedom of commerce, restoration of the environment… Notice anything in common about any of these? The word “freedom” plays a large part. That’s what your cousin died for. That’s what Casey Sheehan died for. Freedom for the Iraqi people and to close down a safe haven for the terrorists that wish to deprive twits like you of their freedom to criticize the “Crazy, evil” George Bush.

Well, here’s the final irony, Miles. If George Bush were as crazy and as evil as Saddam, you’d already have been fed feet first through the shredder! So, rail on against the evil of Bush and the military as much as you like. They’ll still be here defending your sorry ass and the right to say it! Ingrate!

And Casey still has no headstone.

And 30,000 children will die today from preventable diseases. What shold we focus on?

"I thought the Constitution preserved the right of free speech without fear or intimidation?"

Wherever did you get that silly idea?  It certainly didn’t come from the Constitution of the United States.

What Rob said. I care very little about Cindy Sheehan.

.

what is the meaning of your last post?

no more meaning than yours. 

Miles, The opposite of what you say is documented here on, nearly, a daily basis.  Perhaps if you gave up your preconceived notions you would have a better understanding. 

We seem to have to explain everything we’ve reviewed for the past three years, which, I suppose, is what we have to do from time to time

Regarding the war in Iraq being for not, you’re flat out wrong.  The strategic position alone makes it worth it.  

In human life terms, Saddam was on target to kill many, many more.  How many did we save by not allowing Saddam to kill indiscriminately?  How many lives?  We won’t ever know, but you should try setting yourself in the shoes of a man watching his family being executed for no other reason than speaking.   

Hugh:

What is your plan to fix the mess in Iraq …Step 1, Step 2, Step 3….Step N, Done?

You’re either part of the problem, part of the solution, or part of the landscape.   

 

 

HughK…The irony of your sermon, preaching against christianity is humorous. Your arrogance and self importance is typical of individuals like yourself. You lash out and cast your opinions as if you know. Apparently you are so impressed with yourself that other people don’t really matter to you? Obviously you find your self so appealing you don’t need faith. It is good that you like yourself so much because I really doubt other people can stand you…You have elevated yourself as though you think you are God himself. Hmmmm! That sounds like someone the Bible speaks of???

PS, your comment:

"I’m sorry your cousin died in Iraq. But he was a volunteer, like Casey. And you do your cousin no honor to repeat the half baked conspiracy theories of blood for oil/Halliburton/Katrina/Bush-is-as-dumb-as-a-rock, etc.  And the fact that you continually call people names and question their intelligence and honesty calls into question your own intellectual honesty."

I’m sorry he died too, for nothing. Not to preserve the national security of the US, not to protect Iraqis, not to preserve ‘freedom’, not to make the world a better place. He wasn’t a volunteer, he was in the army. He couldn’t go ‘well, actually, I don’t feel like going to Iraq, I think I’ll stay in bed’, he was sent to Iraq. He volunteered to be in the army, but not where to go. After his first stint he was shocked and complained it was all for nothing, the carnage was raw, people dying everywhere, no-one was being helped, murder, rape and humiliation was rife. Such is the war, and we’re all paying for it.

My theories are not half baked conspiracy theories, they are fact. Maybe if you read more widely you’d actually be clued up. As for my intellectual honesty, I’m honest in the fact that I don’t like seeing people dying and being tortured for nothing and I’d like to help people see the truth. However, some people cannot see the truth. I apologise for my low name calling, it’s a raw topic for me.

Likwidshoe…You can say that again!…

You are all carrying on and on about someone elses life.  Do you all know what was said in casey’s will?  there are so many maybes to this situation.  He might have said dont give me a huge stone…no one knows better then her and caseys father what is really being said or not, she is winning this whole situation just because she has got  each and every one of you continually discussing it.  One, its her son, its her life, you were not in it for the any part of and you need to leave it alone, everyone would do something different cause everyone has that right.  I neither agree or disagree because  i dont have every single fact of this familys life and all the desisions they have made throughout it to even make assumptions or an anylisis.  They are not hurting you, or your family or your friends, she is just speaking out, turn away, flip the page or turn the tv off if you really dont like it. You dont even Know any of them.

joeb: His plan is probably to cut and run;  in other words, defeat for the evil US.

Dave… HughK comes off as a know it all. He seems like he really likes himself alot! He preaches his sermons on what our founding fathers said and acts as if it is the only truth. I am feeling a perpetual arrogance about him that I have a low tolerance for. It is one thing to be ignorant. BUT, it is quite another to listen to attacks by someone who tries to come off like a know it all. He is no better than a Sunday morning at a Pentecostal church. He is rude and annoying! That is my perception of him. I could be wrong about him. BUT, I doubt it.

After 2.5 years of globe trotting Cindy Shithands put a stone on Casey’s grave. Casey admired John Wayne and even posed next to a life sized photo of him. Casey also RE-ENLISTED of his own free will.

Cindy wasn’t a ‘peace activist’ protesting Casey’s sign up. No, she is a media whoremonger who wants attention and thinks of herself as important. That’s why he clung to Jessie Jackazz’s back like a fly on cowdung and why she went to Venezuela to kissbutt with their dictator who is killing his own people and claims to be able and willing to kill the President of the US.

She should be hung for treason.

Thank you Stubbe

Well, I can clearly back up everything I say. Your soldiers returning from combat in Iraq say the same thing (http://www.truthout.org/docs_03/101703E.shtml), your government is involved in cover up after cover up, and that, sadly, can also be proved. I suppose that the world media is all wrong? The BBC, ABC, NBC? Journalists on the ground report the same, are they wrong, in the pockets of the liberals? I admit Saddam Hussein was not a nice man, an evil dictator. However, he was friends with the Americans until around 1989. The sureveillance maps and weapons he used were supplied by the US and UK. Fact, it’s documented. Maybe you should read more?

However, what’s not documented is how Hussein had links to terrorism, or that he had the means to make, store and use chemical or biological weapons, the basis for going to war. I thought these were your reasons for invasion? These later turned into Hussein must be deposed because he’s an evil man. Now the coalition forces are more feared than Hussein ever was, and the Iraqis are worse off. Fact. you invaded someone else’s country although they were not a threat and then killed and tortured the population. Fact.

Halliburton allowed soldiers water to be poisoned then covered it up. Fact. Halliburton were the only company in contention for the Iraq contract. Fact. Halliburton invoiced for work they never did, and still got paid. Fact. Over 30,000 CIVILIANS (Amnesty estimated figures) have been killed in this conflict, including women and children. Fact. Cheney has links to Halliburton and is making a lot of money. Fact.

Ah Proofreader, I feel very sad for you. You cannot argue effectively against anything I say – you’re a sad, little man? You live in your little fenced off mind, unable to accept anything else, even though the proof is all around you to see.

 I’ll watch with interest as the truth comes out about what is happening in Iraq, and within your own government, which appears more corrupt and incompetant every day – do the media lie about this too?

I’ve realised something about writing on this thing. Whatever I say makes no difference. I can quote every source I have, news story after news story from independant and reliable sources, and you’ll never read them. if you did, you could choose to dismiss them, not just see it as ineffective liberal rubbish. Proofreader, I read your sources, my mind is open and I was willing to have it changed, as the truth is too terrible to imagine – that a lot of people have died and been maimed, physically and mentally, to satisfy the ego of a crazy, stupid man (Bush) and to make money for his friends. I pity your country, it’ll change a lot in the next few years and some terrible truths will be realised.

Goodbye, forever.

Proofreader: I did deabate Sir, I had my say, quoted endeless sources and all ylou can do is scream hysterically like a stuck neo-con pig. I was confused as to why you want me to debate on of my stupider points and lapses of emotional judgement, but then I realised that I’ve made a few very valid points about your government and the war that you can’t defend, so you settle on my only purile remarks. I’ll think before I write next time. Oh well.

The ‘skull and bones’ Society, based at Yale, of which George Bush and his father were members, and made up almost exclusively of Republicans, did in fact, steal the skull of Geronimo (http://p216.ezboard.com/frigorousintuitionfrm18.showMessage?topicID=32.topic). Fact. It’s most notable member at the time was Prescott Bush, grandfather to good old George. I hate to mention this embarassing fact, but you did ask. What’s to stop Republican arseholes doing it again? still, he was only an American Indian, and you probably see them as useless no hopers too, don’t ya?

kisses.

PS (how the hell did George get into Yale, he’s pretty stupid. oh yeah, MONEY).

Hugh is doing the typical American atheist thing.  He claims belief that all religions are false.  Yet he has espoused ANTI-religion as his own belief system.  He treats atheism as a religion in itself.  That smacks a bit of hypocrisy, don’t you think?  Earlier he asked Likwidshoe why comments about Christianity would get her so riled up.  Seems the only one getting riled up about comments about religion here is Hugh.

Back on topic, I think the case has well been made that Cindy Sheehan is a self-serving hypocrite.  Personally, I hope she continues her dog and pony show for another ten years.  Of course, if a Dem wins the next Presidential election, she won’t have any problem with the war continuing.  All of a sudden it will be just and good.  You know, the same opinion Hugh will have. 

It is provided free on request to the Dept. of Veteran Affairs.

Nothing is "free" that comes from the government. We need to stop with that kind of thinking.

I got that from the Crawford Peace Mission – one of the organizations associated with Sheehan.

There might be a very justifiable reason that Casey’s grave doesn’t have a headstone.  I think y’all are just seeing this as an either-or proposition and missing an enormous amount of middle ground. 

Emeritus: You are fantastic with verbs and nouns; you express a temerity with your adjectives not heard since the late great sage Christopher Wallace. When it comes to argumentive skills I witnessed a flawness execution of Miles leaky arguments and semantic erring…relax grasshopper the man speaks with his heart, you with your mind…who can know the subtle and illusive center point? Will it even lend stability if discovered, and could it even be retained? Anyway great arguments but terrible rebuddle about the enviroment and cell phones and cheetos…you know that post (I just read it, sorry to comment on it so late but…) So I read it and realized you have a great mind but you are still completely and utterly full of B.S. when it comes to your FINAL analysis of the socio/economic/enviromental/bla,bla/Matrix. The matrix has many layers, and although you can see the layers you have broken free from below, it is nevertheless sometimes hard to believe that there are still many more beyond. In the end you will or will not Launch some type of rebuddle to this and I probably will read it so go for it of course. I hope you are feeling better with the bronchitis hopefully already on its way to the next carrier. Adios Cunado!

Rick:  "Robert, just saying that someone is wrong doesn’t make it so. Now, if you’ll please stick to reasoned discussion you might have more of a chance of making a valid point.  I’d suggest cracking open an introductory-level Philosophy Text."  Nothing in that post has anything to do with anything I wrote, nor with anything reating to me.  non sequitur=does not follow

I’m not a member of the "right wing".  Wrong again. The only reason for speculation about why Casey has no headstone is Cindy’s lack of being forthcoming about it.  She is quite enthusiastic about using Casey’s death to get her spot in the limelight, but won’t tell us why he has no headstone.  She can clear it up in a moment with some honesty and straightforwardness. 

I also Despise Michael Savage and Fred Savage, but god bless Cindy Sheehan!

Finally!

A lot of what you say is true, from your persepective. I admit it’s easy to be hyper cynical about the whole thing and I must say I am. It still doesn’t detract from the fact that the Iraq war was conducted on a series of false premises and a lot of people have died as a result. These are civilians that have been killed my coalition forces, the Americans having the highest death count. The americans have conducted a lot of blanket bombing, this has has been confirmed by the US military. That means that a LOT of bombs are dropped on towns and villages in order to help end insurgeny operations. It also means that a lot of innocent people are killed as a result. These are men, women and children, ordinary families who just want a peaceful life. Being the liberal pinko that I am, I can’t see the justification for this. If the Americans were so welcome from the evils of Saddam Hussein, thn why all the attempts to kill them and get them out of Iraq?

Talking of winning hearts and minds, torture has no justification. People may have been shredded under Saddam – I’ve already said he was an evil bastard. Also, blanket bombing, night execution raids, phosphorus weapons, fragmentation bombs, landmines, civilian killings and beatings have no place either. Originally some Iraqi people saw the coalition forces as liberators, to save them from an evil dictator. I say to you that that has changed, the Americans have botched the job, there’s also no real plans for reconstruction – Bush, in his wisdom, has withdrawn funds from that. This war has been badly planned and executed, and Bush, as ultimate leader, must be made accountable for this.

I admit that some areas of the Iraqi population are better off now, but  these are the religious groups once persecuted under Saddam. I really don’t think people are better off as a whole and now civil war is starting, lots of people are dying and this has been directly caused by the invasion of Iraq. Yes, INVASION. Iraq posed no threat to the USA, all the terrorists responsible for 9/11 were Saudi. Why not invade them? It’s too hard, that why, America’s infrastructure is too tied up in oil they get from that region – how hypocritical.

As you’re so concerned about environmental issues in Iraq, why not look closer to home? Alaska is f*cked and has been by Bush, he’s an environmental nightmare, so don’t be too concerned about Iraq. I don’t think the US military is either and certainly not about cultural heritage. The ancient ity of Babylon is now totally destroyed, levelled and sacked by American forces who also have to regard for the local population and the bulk of GI’s can’t even speak a word of Arabic, hence the regrettable and unfortnate accidental killing of civilans. It’s a mess, I hope someone can clean it up. Meanwhile, deaths will rise and rise and ave now exceeded Saddam’s wild, evil imaginings.

Still, I don’t think we’ll ever agree, I do concede on a couple of points, but the US is bound to get lucky sometime. I wouldn’t say that I’m an ‘ingrate’, but I can see through the bullshit, shame you can’t. It’s your government and your mess. Bye and good luck.

Dave… you are a brat!…

No, Robert.  You were using the Two Wrongs Make a Right argument style.  You refuse to acknowledge that there is a problem with vitriole and death threats because you assume that Cindy hasn’t taken responsibility for her own actions (profanity and death threats, I’m assuming – who is she threatening to kill, by the way?).  You argue that she has it coming, thereby excusing behavior coming from your camp as justified, and therefore not bad.  This is a classic example of the Two Wrongs Make a Right argument and for you to deny that in your next post either points to a lack of understanding of basic logic, or intentional obfuscation.

 

Rob, you can "continue to assume that she is self-centered and [sic] uncarring" if you want . . . I wouldn’t expect any less.  Sometimes however, when parents have different values and interests regarding their children, and when those parents are divorced, and when the courts are involved, don’t you think even the most simple and straightforward seeming things can become convoluted and confused?

Dear Jeff,

(Ref your comment March 23)

Every now and then I put my own name into Google to see what turns up.

It’s a vain habit I know: I hope you can forgive that. But every now and then it does turn up something interesting: perhaps someone has read one of my political articles and has had something interesting to say about it, good or bad.

When I came across a reference to this page, I was surprised. I hadn’t come across it before, and I hadn’t written on the subject of Cindy or Casey Sheenan. I was curious to see how my name had come up.

It was therefore with some interest that I read your comments. Searching for the name Gene Bruskin, you had found a copy of his interview in the Red Star, published by the Red Party. Doing a "whois" then turned up my name as the registrar for the site, and presumably another Google found my articles in the Weekly Worker, the paper of the Communist Party of Great Britain. Ah – got it! I mention this partly to compliment you on your detective work, and partly as a courtesy in case my name had slipped your memory: all this happened several weeks ago now.

Anyway, I hope you don’t mind if I chip in. I realise I am talking to, well, a somewhat unsympathetic audience :0), but your comments intrigued me.

Firstly, I’d better clarify things a little. You are absolutely right: I used to be a member of the CPGB. I’d hesitate to call myself a "biggy" as you so flatteringly did :0) but I guess I was, if nothing else, a regular contributor to the paper, so I can understand the impression.

Ironically, though, a group of us had left the CPGB, and with comrades from a couple of other organisations had formed a new group: the Red Party. It’s a minor point, though. Our politics hadn’t changed, and still communists by all means. I suspect, though, that what we mean by that word, and what you mean, are probably more than a little different. It’s a big subject.

It’s partly that discrepancy which prompted me to write. You commented "Haven’t traced it the rest of the way , but why do I suddenly have the feeling there’s chinese money in here somewhere?". Well, I hope I’ve traced the rest for you now. But "Chinese money"?

I’m sorry – genuinely – but I really couldn’t resist laughing. You see, if there is anyone the Chinese Communist Party (or the old Communist Party of the Soviet Union) hates more than the western states themselves, it’s us. They would call us "Trotsyists" or "Anarchists", and I promise you the prisons of the old East Bloc were crammed with people like us. We have *never* believed that either the Soviet Union under Stalin or Red China were communist, and they know it. The dictatorships of Stalin and Mao tse Tsung have *nothing* to do with the Communist Manifesto.

This may be difficult for you to understand, because you’ll associate "communist" with the big "communist" states. I can understand that. But perhaps I can explain by analogy. If you are a Christian, you might be surprised, and even angry, if someone hated you because they associated you with the "Christians" of the Spanish Inquisition, or the "Christians" who massacred the Bosnian muslims. But it all proves the point. Just because someone calls themselves "Christian" doesn’t mean they are. Similarly, not everyone who calls themselves "communist" really is.

Don’t get me wrong: you would almost certainly still disagree with my politics if you understood them properly, but I think you’d be surprised how different they are to the politics of China: indeed, how completely opposed they are. You’d certainly realise that the Chinese would never give us a red cent, so to speak!

So be careful about dehumanising those who disagree with you. Take this whole thread about Cindy Sheenan. I know you disagree with her, but the woman has lost her son! Deep down, do you *really* believe that she doesn’t grieve? Can you not argue against her politics without smearing her love for her own son and her very humanity?

I know it’s easy to get carried away. God knows, I’ve done it too. But while I’ve met supporters of the war on Iraq who I could respect, this whole thread made me feel ashamed. I’m not saying her *views* are above criticism: noone’s are. If you disagree, criticise! But criticise her views, not the way she has coped with her loss.

Who knows why there is no headstone? I knew a couple once who simply could not face the task of organising their son’s funeral at all. They left it to someone else, because they felt that by organising his funeral, they were "accepting" his death. Grief does strange things to people: you are a better man than I if you are confident enough to know the feelings of a grieving mother.

And I don’t hate Americans, or American soldiers. One of the reasons I hated the war so much was precisely because so many young lives were ended: Iraqi AND American AND British. What does the division between countries count for compared to the division of the living and the dead? If I say I think their lives were wasted, it is not as an insult to them. It is a sign of my anger that they were – every one of them – valuable human lives, beloved sons and daughters and husbands and wives, with lives to live, families to be part of, and unique wisdom and perspective to give to the world.

You may disagree with me about the war. You may even shout at me and be angry because you think I am stupid to be against it. But please, don’t accuse me, or Gene Bruskin, or Cindy Sheenan, of not caring about the British and American lives lost: and I won’t accuse you of it either. You may persuade me that I am wrong – the issues are indeed complicated – but you will never persuade me that I don’t care, or that Cindy Sheenan, like thousands of American mothers, doesn’t cry for her son in the small hours of the morning.

In shared humanity,

Manny Neira

The veteran’s immediate family always gets to decide where a late military person’s remains are to be placed (in many instances, they are cremated). The government’s policy is to provide a no-cost, honorable grave site as an option.

As a retired military dude, I have no particular feelings for or against Ms. Sheehan; most certainly she has the American right to critique governmental policies and individuals — like that pathetic little dunce, our Chimpanzee in Chief. Obviously (I hope), backing our troops and criticizing the administration are mutually exclusive actions.

The comment about the current administration being full of deceit, etc. – has nothing to do with the topic of this blog.  But since everyone wants to go "off topic", I will follow.  I don’t believe the current administration has any more or less problems than any other – just different problems.  I do not agree with every decision that our President and administration make, but I have great respect for all of them and I pray for them all each day.  I had very little respect for President Clinton because of the personal choices that he made while in office and yet I prayed for him each day too.  The problems with our country have more to do with the people of America than with the President and administration of America.  Sadly we live in a culture of BLAME rather than a culture of PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY.  Some of the issues that "threaten the republic as we know it" are the high divorce rate, parents with no time for their children, legal abortion, the push for same sex marriage, the current immigration issue, and the concern about doing what is "politically correct" rather than what is logical.  We cannot blame the President and administration for all these things.  GOD BLESS AMERICA!

actually, that’s not true, Robert108.  You seem to care very much for Cindy Sheehan as you spend a lot of time and energy worrying about her, talking about her, criticizing her, being angry at her.  You might not like her, but you most certainly care what she’s doing, who she’s talking to, what she’s done with her money, who’s paying her, what’s happening with her private life now and in the past . . . you care much more than 99% of the people in America. 

It’s okay, though . . . we’re used to you lying. 

I came upon this blog quite by accident while doing some research.  It grieves me to see so many people veering so far off the topic and tearing eachother apart. 

The bottom line is that Cindy Sheehan disrespects the memory of her son each time she protests the war that he fought in.  Since we have no draft, we know that Casey volunteered to serve his country.  I am sure that Cindy Sheehan loved her son very much and will always suffer much pain from losing him.  I also have a son and can only imagine the grief that she feels.  However, standing against a cause that Casey obviously believed in, is not a fitting way to honor her son.

From looking at the picture at the beginning of this blog, I do not believe that Casey is buried in a VA Cemetery.  It looks like a private cemetery.  Still, everyone deserves to have a headstone or a marker, in my opinion, just to "mark" their life here on this earth.  Casey was an American Hero!  However, it is up to his family as to what is done, and they will have to live with their decisions. 

In regard to the comment made by one person that "I laugh at the cross and would never let one touch my body…", just know that one day your knees will bow at the name of Jesus along with everyone else. 

 

A headstone for this soldier costs the family absolutely nothing. It is provided free on request to the Dept. of Veteran Affairs. It would be provided free on request by millions of Americans, myself included.

This soldier’s earned his headstone, and I think he would be proud to have a military marker. Here’s why.

He voluntarily enlisted in the U.S. Army. He voluntarily re-enlisted when his first commitment was up, when he learned his unit would be going to Iraq. That tells you something about this soldier that his mom has obviously missed altogether. He was a jeep mechanic, yet he volunteered to be a part of a Quick Reactionary Force to respond at a moment’s notice and help his fellow American soldiers.

Yes, Mrs. Sheehan, the loss of your son was a great tragedy. No one but his mom could feel the way his mom does. But his headstone isn’t about you, it’s about him.  

What Rob said. I care very little about Cindy Sheehan.

Did you also hear that there were rapings and murders in the Superdome following Huuricane Katrina?  I mean, I read it on the Internet, so it must be true!

Rick: I mean Cindy and her organization not answering the question is weak.  It’s not all about you.

actually, that’s not true, Robert108.  You seem to care very much for Cindy Sheehan as you spend a lot of time and energy worrying about her, talking about her, criticizing her, being angry at her.  You might not like her, but you most certainly care what she’s doing, who she’s talking to, what she’s done with her money, who’s paying her, what’s happening with her private life now and in the past

Judging from his posts here, he certainly cares more about Cindy Sheehan than he does about, say, the genocide in Darfur.

Proofreader: I was angrily typing, I’ll be more careful next time. I may have misspelled, but misused? I think I must have used ‘Iraqi’, ‘killed’ and ‘family’ – those words are not often seen in the US press in combination! Indeed, have you thought about those words?

Anyway, a classic right wing tactic: Instead of addressing problems honestly, you attack small irrelevant mistakes, effectively clouding the real issues. A bit like shouting ‘We don’t care!’ at Cindy Sheenan and her supporters when they try and argue against the war – you have no interest in the real issues, you place your hands over your ears and shout ‘la, la, la!’ to avoid hearing the real issues. These are:

• The war is a sham, it’s been started on a lie and has led to the deaths of many thousand innocents.
• The war has not made anyones life better. In America you can’t even handle a crisis effectively (Katrina), a lot of your people live in poverty and cannot afford adequate food and healthcare.
• George Bush is a liar and a coward. Cindy Sheenan asked to see him face to face and he refused. He cannot give reasons why her son, and many other sons, daughters, husbands and fathers, have been killed. In fact, he knows the real reasons, it’s a war of profiteering and he doesn’t care who’s killed or injured in the process, George and his buddies are rich!
• The war will not stop terrorism, in fact, it’s made it worse.
• The war will not bring peace to the Middle east, in fact, it’s made it worse.
• The war will not make right the killing of many innocents in September 11. Their memories have been besmurged by all this, they have been used to justify a false and illegal war.
• The war has not made the people of Iraq better off. They are killed, harassed and tortured in the name of ‘freedom’. They have inadequate infrastructure, hygiene, healthcare, education and food supplies. The money allocated to make their lives better has been embezzeled and squandered. It’s made a few people very rich, Iraqi and US citizens live in poverty.

Cindy Sheenan has a right, as have every decent, thinking American citizen to demand answers to help justify her son’s death, and many others. Who cares about a headstone?

So, Proofreader, can you argue fairly on the points I’ve made, or will you continue to attack my spelling and diction? Anyone else care to comment?

The bottom line is this Soldier deserves the respect that he earned in the defense of his country. I get out of the Army in two months and have fought in Panama, the first Gulf War, and in Operation Iraqi Freedom. He was a young warrior and should get the just recognition for the ultimate sacrifice he made. His mother has no say over his choice to serve so she should quit her whining. He made a choice and enters the hall of warrirors. This bitch needs to shut up and respect her son. Freedom insn’t free!!!!

I’d be willing to bet that Casey is turning in his grave over the way his "mother" is using HIS sacrifice to further her own twisted goals.

Aren’t Republicans using his sacrifice to further their….oh, "noble" goals? If not, what was the point of this thread?

Robert, what exactly do you think I’ve said that is non sequitur?

To your question.  There are many more possible reasons for Casey not having a headstone than the only one you and the rest of the right-wing have suggested.  There is also the possibility that it’s currently out of Cindy’s hands. 

Cindy Sheehan, and all other pro-jihadi fiends are impacting my life. She and her comrades are telling the terrorists, "hold on, the American people’s will can be broken." They are playing with the security of the US. They send money to terrorists (CodePink gave $600k to Fallujah), they "get in the way" of US troops (CPT), they visit with the enemy (Sean Penn, Rep Moran etc)…Last, but not least, these people, call our leaders & soldiers Nazis, Pol Pot (Kennedy, Deanna Durbin). They are harming the US, and her security. They are endangering our troops. I have nothing but pity & disgust for these "people."

mtvjock – What the heck does your comment have to do with this blog?  

Robert: 

I think when Cindy takes responsibility for her death threats and profanity, we might be able to have a discussion.

So, you are arguing that two wrongs make a right. 

Why is anyone surprised by this? She’s an ignorant cunt, and a tool of the left. As for the headstone, the "point" is symbolism. I’d be willing to bet that Casey is turning in his grave over the way his "mother" is using HIS sacrifice to further her own twisted goals.

Bat One,

Please refrain from using the excluded middle in your arguments.  Bifurcation intentionally leads to worst possible conclusions and, as you should be aware, there are a myriad of other possibilities.

 

I assume if they had answered the question, you would have included that in your quote.  My reading of it is that they wouldn’t answer it because of the hatred from the other side.  Weak.  I think when Cindy takes responsibility for her death threats and profanity, we might be able to have a discussion.

Brittany:  What does what you say have to do with Casey not having a headstone?

1500 nude people in Venezuela recently took part in an art project in front of the Simon Bolivar memorial. When they bent over, 1499 had the mistaken impression they had come face to face with Cindy Shatcan, Hugo Chavez’s favorite hand puppet. All immediately realized their mistake when the other participant turned around, the group immediately started chanting, "Hugo, Hugo, Hugo".

Gee. If it’s such a big deal to ya, whyn’t you go and BUY him a headstone? For a conservative, ya sure have a way of butting into people’s lives. I thought conservatives were more ‘stay outta my yard’ types.

Will the headstone be a certain shape? A c ertain shade of marble? Perhaps granite. What will you mandate for the mourning family? 

 and, for the record, Terri Schiavo? Her brain was jelly. May God take her into His merciful arms.

So, Brittany is a sniper.  Don’t debate if you can’t make your argument.

>

>

> Cindy Sheehan is "operated" by Military Families Speak Out

> (http://www.mfso.org)

>

> MFSO was founded by Nancy Lessin and her husband Charley

> Richardson , the internic listing for the site goes to Charley.

>

> Nancy Lessin is the Health and Safety Coordinator for the

> Massachusetts AFL-CIO and is a member of USWA 9358 and OPEIU

> Local 6. Charley Richardson works for the Labor Extension

> Program at UMass Lowell and is a member of SEIU Local 254 and

> USWA Local 8147.

>

> Their son Joe (age 25 in 2003) is a Marine who was deployed

> in August 2002, and who returned from Iraq on Memorial Day 2003.

> Richardson refuses to discuss his son’s reaction to his

> anti-war activism, saying he can speak only for himself and

> his wife.

>

> "The way we address that is we keep in touch with him, and

> make sure he understands that in opposing the war, we are

> not opposing him," he said, adding that the start of the war

> had strengthened rather than weakened his resolve.

>

> [Note from Jeff- Counting the years, Joe should be out of the

> military now, and free to speak. He shows up nowhere on the

> web though... On either side of things. He appears at none of

> his Dad's public appearances, and he would be a big draw.

> He's also not in Iraqi Veterans Against the War.]

>

> "We were both in the antiwar movement during Vietnam,"

> Richardson said of he and his wife.

>

>

> MFSO is linked to USLAW, US Labor Against War. Funding seems

> to slip back and forth between them, which is not surprising

> since Nancy and Charley run both.

>

> Tom DeBruin, President of SEIU District 1199P set the pace by

> presenting USLAW with a check for $50,000 contributed by

> SEIU. He challenged others to seek substantial contributions

> from their national unions. Organizations at the Assembly

> pledged a total of nearly $93,000 in affiliation fees, over

> 800 new individual memberships and many new affiliations.

>

> At the meeting where this money was handed out:

> Bill Fletcher, President of TransAfrica Forum and former

> Education Director of the AFL-CIO, delivered the keynote

> address on the presidential election and challenges facing

> the labor movement. He stressed the importance of the labor

> movement addressing the security concerns of working people

> and the danger of failing to do so – the need for unions to

> struggle for a foreign policy based on solidarity rather than

> empire. He received a standing ovation, reflecting broad

> support for his views. His remarks can be found at

> http://www.uslaboragainstwar.org/article.php?id=7310.

>

> During the lunch break that followed, Clarence Thomas,

> National Coordinator of the Million Worker Movement, and

> Nancy Lessin and Charley Richardson of Military Families

> Speak Out, addressed the Assembly.

>

>

> The number of co-convenors (officers) will be expanded from

> two to five. Gene Bruskin and Bob Muehlenkamp were

> unanimously reelected. The remaining open positions must be

> filled by women and people of color. [Comment from Jeff - It

> appears Gene and Bob will run the thing, since the already

> had been, and the other slots may just be PR positions]

>

> USLAW should organize speaking opportunities before labor

> bodies for returning Iraq veterans and members of military

> families, and should work closely with Military Families

> Speak Out, Iraq Veterans Against the War, Veterans for Peace,

> Vietnam Veterans Against the War and other similar organizations.

>

> BUILDING INTERNATIONAL LABOR SOLIDARITY AND TIES WITH THE

> LABOR MOVEMENT IN IRAQ

>

> This group recommended that USLAW continue to support and

> deepen its ties with both of the major labor federations in

> Iraq. It recommended that another union delegation be sent to

> Iraq as soon as safely possible to expand relationships with

> Iraqi unions, and to provide first-hand information on the

> situation confronting working people and the labor movement

> there. A budget for this delegation was projected, half of

> which would be contributed directly to Iraqi unions.

> [Question from Jeff - since they're expanding prior

> relations with Iraqi unions, this implies they had them

> before the fall of Saddam - especially since those unions

> existed soley at the pleasure of the regime]

>

> In August 2005, Gene Bruskin meets in the UK with Abdulah

> Mushin of the Iraqi Trade Federation, and slips him $5000.

>

> But who else did Gene meet with in the UK?

>

http://www.redparty.org.uk/redstar003/usa.html

 

Domain name:

redparty.org.uk

Registrant:

Manny Neira

 

Who’s Manny?

He’s a biggy in the Communist Party of Great Britain.

Haven’t traced it the rest of the way , but why do I suddenly have the feeling there’s chinese money in here somewhere?

 

Me and everyone on this blog are a bunch of retarded losers who need to find something better to do with our time.

 

Ever hear the saying that arguing over the internet is like the special olympics? well that’s not even a valid comparison because at the least the special olympics is trying to do something worthwhile.

 

Stop trolling forums and trying to reinforce your own ideology.

 

Everyone from the left and the right can suck my salty balls.

 

Stop getting your panties all riled up and go do something useful with your time you retards. And yes, I need to find something better to do with my time too, so goodbye fuckers.

to my knowledge no…but having to dennouce cindy and the with no real reason expanding it to democrats or liberals a) doesnt add to the discusion and b) has nothing to do with whether or not theres a headstone. thats all this has to be. im saying to turn the comment board to shes a bitch and so is soros and loony libs doesnt do anything to discuss the matter at hand. we cant just say thats not right that he doesnt have a headstone, we have to invoke death to a political party or the religious right or something similar.

I’d be willing to bet that Casey is turning in his grave

That’s a bet I’ll take.  Your shovel or mine? 

Robert, just saying that someone is wrong doesn’t make it so. Now, if you’ll please stick to reasoned discussion you might have more of a chance of making a valid point.  I’d suggest cracking open an introductory-level Philosophy Text.

Dave –

You are so right, nothing that comes from the government (or anywhere else) is free. Someone has to pay.  However, the gravestone or marker that is provided by The Veteran’s Dept. has already been "paid for" by every soldier who had enough love and pride in his country to serve.  I have no problem with my tax dollars going towards a soldier’s marker. 

Planker you are right.. I will tip one for the young hero myself.. I just cant help but wonder what he would think about all this

 

S.

and i agree about cindy…i think while her message matches many of the anti-war ones…her actions not only dishonor her son but damage the message of those who feel similarly. While i agree with her point that we should leave iraq, i wholly disagree with her meeting people like hugo chavez. not because hes evil or anything silly like that but because it makes it so easier for her to be called the anti-american and thus take everyone of her points and call it anti american. Her actions make it tougher for those who agree with a point or two of hers. As another example its like saying because hitler created jobs in germany anyone who fights against layoffs is a nazi…obviously thats ludicrious and slightly extreme for my points sake but thats what happens when she goes and makes outrageous claims or meets unfriendly heads of state

Rick, she doesn’t even have to pay for the headstone.  One is provided free of charge.  All she has to do is fill out some paperwork.  What possible excuse can there be, other than your need not to see someone you champion exposed as being cold and self-centered?

Maybe there is a good explanation.  I haven’t seen one come forth yet, and until one does (Cindy has had plenty of time) I’ll continue to assume that she is self-centered and uncarring. 

Symbolism, Davey.

Thins like that do matter. 

Dave… you are a brat!…

Dave’s just mad because somebody made fun of his haircut.