NO. I understand that some people don’t want to pay any taxes.

Mostly Democrats in Obama’s cabinet. Go rail at them!

Yes, we should pay them 125,000 a year in pension benefits.
they deserve it.

When their pensions are breaking the bank I would put it to you that its a little excessive. What do I know though. Being broke is a good thing right?

we shouldn’t have government involved in firefighting.

What are you going on about now? You do know that most of the country IE the rural parts have these things known as volunteer fire departments. Its not like we will do without fire protection. That being said, I would not like to do without fire fighters. However, do you think we should pay them 125,000 a year in pension benefits?

Government is the problem.
———-
That said, I don’t wish any harm to come to your family members. This shows how important government services are.

See here you are pretending to be all lucid. Not three treads ago you said this.

It’s government and we hate government so I’m not pledging allegiance to any land mass.

So do you hate government or were you lying?

When their pensions are breaking the bank, I suggest we break the piggy bank.

The liberal solution for everything, more taxes! You understand that people hiding money in offshore accounts is a reaction to high taxes. In general, once you start taxing over 30% people start hiding their money. Even you Dems. Why do you think Rangel hid half his assets. (They were in the US).

Dino:

But we shouldn’t have government involved in firefighting

Maybe you should pull that shit out from between your ears and get a brain. Nobody except a few hippie freaks like your butt buddy Anarchist Vegetarian Brain advocate against the existence of government.

Of course firefighting is a legitimate function of (state) government. All one has to say.

Being as fucking stupid as you are, do you manage to put your own clothes on, or do you have help?

Dino aka “shit for brains”

That must be why conservatives have worked so diligently to destroy it.

More fucking lame shit from the brilliant mind of
You really got fucking nothing going on in your head, do you retard?

NOBODY is decrying the existence of government except ironically your butt buddy Anarchist Vegetable Brain. Deal with it, fecal breath.

You’re just afraid your grant will get pulled and you’ll have to find a real job.

You’re just all pissed off because nobody likes you or thinks you are worth paying.

You deserve yourself and the shit life you lead.

Thanks, Randy.

That was the point of this post. No political points were intended.

My prayers are with the firefighters and anyone that places his life in the front lines for the public good.

Mickey, Ellinas….

Thanks.

((())) I will pray. I grew up in So. Cal and almost all of my family still lives down there. The Palos Verdes fires are right near some of my family, so I have been in big time prayer mode. I will add your sil to my prayers.

It is hard to tell out here exactly where the fires are because the news tends to generalize the fire in a wider location, vs the specific point…kinda like a tornado warning for xxx county vs the specific town where the tornado is.

((())) Hot Shots are some of the best firefighters in the country, God Bless Them.

The effect of just about everything the Left does is destructive. Truly, they are like an AIDS virus — preventing the infected country or society from defending itself.

Under the guise of environmental protections, thousands of more acres of land and thousands of homes have been burned because the Left refused basic forestry preventive measures like creating and maintaining firebreaks, culling drywood and underbrush that makes any stand of trees a forest fire in the making.

Worse yet, by preventing citizens from clearing brush around their homes or denying firefighters the use of local streams to fight fires, many of which are far from other sources of water, such Environmental terrorists have caused deaths.

“We’ve lost two people in my family because you dickheads won’t cut trees down…”

I’m no stranger to wildland fires. Longtime readers may recall that my own home had the threat of wildfires here in Chico, California this past summer, as did many Butte County residents who not only were threatened, but lost homes.
…

They were labelled law breakers, fined $50,000 and left emotionally and financially drained.

But seven years after the Sheahans bulldozed trees to make a fire break — an act that got them dragged before a magistrate and penalised — they feel vindicated. Their house is one of the few in Reedy Creek, Victoria, still standing.
…

Anger at government policies stopping residents from cutting down trees and clearing scrub to protect their properties is already apparent. “We’ve lost two people in my family because you dickheads won’t cut trees down,” Warwick Spooner told Nillumbik Mayor Bo Bendtsen at a meeting on Tuesday night.

“While our forests burn, our professional land managers continue to be hamstrung by a broken process,” said Martz, who was recently elected chair of the Western Governors Association. Martz said she’ll use Montana — and the Forest Service’s inability to quickly cut trees burned in the Bitterroot National Forest during the 2000 fire season — as “the best example of how badly the federal process is broken.”

Martz said while the Montana Department of Natural Resources logged its burned timber, the Bitterroot National Forest spent $1 million and 57 man-years of work writing an environmental impact statement on its salvage logging proposal. “And after all that work, the federal government still ended up in court,” she said. “Fifty-seven man-years of work and $1 million later, and for what? It ended up being a mere 15,000 acres of salvage logging out of 307,000 acres burned.”

THOSE HORRIBLE FIRES AND GOVERNMENT REGULATIONS
According to a feature story in the Washington Times, and coverage in Insight, extreme Clinton/Gore Administration actions have made the disastrous Summer fires in the West and Midwest much worse than they needed to be. Funds budgeted for fire-fighting have instead been used for other purposes, especially continued aquisition of privately owned land. Once the fires began, they have been made much worse by fire-fighting restrictions, largely inspired by extremist environmental policies. Refusal to allow thinning by loggers in recent years has made the fuel potential much worse; but even during the desperate fight to stop the fires, extreme limitations have repeatedly tied firefighters’ hands. For example, firefighters have been forbidden to use bulldozers to create fire breaks, for they are associated with logging and will scar the earth. Rather, firefighters have been forced to cut the trees by hand; then, U.S.Marines have been forced to carry the downed trees away on foot, rather than have them dragged by heavy equipment and “disturb the ground.” Fire retardant chemicals could not be dropped in some places for fear of injuring animals and plants in streams. In one instance, firefighters were made to cease pumping water out of a stream because lower water levels were causing water temperature to rise, endangering the trout. As a result, the fire was not stopped and its heat completely vaporized the water in the stream, killing everything in it. In short, the hot, dry weather has made the natural fires bad; but Clinton/Gore environmental regulations have made them much, much worse.

What a gravy job, you work like 2 months a year and get a shit load of cash, can’t we get some illegals to do it for a sixth of that?

Pil: No conservative begrudges govt employees who do actual work and service; the ones we don’t like are the army of useless clerks and drones who get bloated salaries and pensions for doing nothing. Real service should always be rewarded.

treehuggers have prevented local municipalities from reducing the amount of underbrush in the forests to safe levels.

Hats off to the brave fire fighters but mudcat and zig are both right. It’s the environ wackos that have create the environment for these cataclysmic events that put fire fighters in harms way. Yeah, fires are always going to happen in Cal in the dry season but with proper forest and brush management, the fires could be more easily controlled.

I am praying for the firemen who are so bravely trying to save lives and property in California. These are brave heroes who, as Mud says, risk life and lungs, for those who are threatened by the fires. Mickey’s Dad is a first class hero, never ever to be forgotten! I’m so sorry for his family’s loss.

My advice to Dino is this. When your house is on fire or you’re being robbed… call a Democrat. (Darn, I wish I could figure out how to block that guy!)

For Mud, Pilgrim, Mickey and all those who have families in the fire areas… forget what Dino and his like say here and know that the truly good people are praying for you as well as your friends and family in California.

Pil: No conservative begrudges govt employees who do actual work and service; the ones we don’t like are the army of useless clerks and drones who get bloated salaries and pensions for doing nothing. Real service should always be rewarded.
robert108 on August 30, 2009 at 05:29 pm

Give us a few examples of govmint jobs “the ones we don’t like” that you would like eliminated.
No generalities. Specifics.

Little e: Let’s start with all the wasteful social spending programs; fund only welfare for truly needy people, and make the govt employees do rigorous means testing, to determine who the truly needy are.
Eliminate the Dept. of Education, since it educates no students.
That’s a start. Do you have any ideas, or are you just sniping at your betters?
Let’s see you hold up your end of a real debate, if you can.
Any counter argument? Something in your own words, preferably, not just some leftie boilerplate talking points.

Eliminate the Dept. of Education, since it educates no students.
That’s a start. Do you have any ideas, or are you just sniping at your betters?
robert108 on August 30, 2009 at 07:36 pm

Ummm….OK.
Is that all you got?

Your statement, Do you have any ideas, or are you just sniping at your betters? has nothing to do with anything.
Why are you patting your self on the back over your unsubstantiated claims?

Nice cherry-pick to lie, little e; now why don’t you deal with everything I said, instead of just the part you cherry-picked out of it? When you say “unsubstantiated claim”, are you claiming that the D of E actually does educate any students?
Can you answer in your own words? Can you actually make an argument, rather than simply trying to snipe at what I say?
You have yet to enter into any debate here, even though you have whined about others not debating.
Are you finally going to live up to your own words?

Robert108:

Eliminate the Dept. of Education, since it educates no students.

Well the USDA raises no crops, should we eliminate them too?

Little e: You have yet to make an affirmative argument for any position here; instead you try to ignore the facts and logic of my position. That’s known as sniping.
It’s what you do, since you never make any affirmative argument for anything here. You just troll and snipe.
I don’t expect you to be honest enough to admit what you do, since I have caught you lying countless times, proved it with your own words, and you keep lying and denying.
Until you make some sort of affirmative argument, I’m done with you.

Why do idiots in California keep planting trees, grasses, shrubs, flowers that CAN NOT SURVIVE IN THAT CLIMATE?

Look at the historical records of human settlement in the region. As far back as the first Spanish settlements there are accounts of wildfires. It is a semi-arid climate, all the shit idiots in California can not survive there, they grow rapidly during wet periods, then die and dry out and burn during the other 90% of the year. Fucking morons deserve to have their shit burn down.

The fact is..only a very few california whackos control the environment. Typcally, a handful of GREENIES sue over some silly shit like a snail darter and the stupid, ultra liberal officers of the calif court grants the law suit. Calif needs to eliminate its liberal judges. this is where the whacko conspiracy starts. The judges think the people in Calif aren’t capable of the right decision.

You understand that people hiding money in offshore accounts is a reaction to high taxes

NO. I understand that some people don’t want to pay any taxes.

So, buzzy admits he is a tax evader. Good job, stupidass.

BTW, you have yet to justify your claim that any govt employee “deserves” a $125,000/year pension. What’s your affirmative argument for that particular amount?robert108 on August 30, 2009 at 10:11 pm

The $125,000 dollar figure was brought up by Greg in Alabama
and it concerned firefighters:

“That being said, I would not like to do without fire fighters. However, do you think we should pay them 125,000 a year in pension benefits?”Greg in Alabama on August 30, 2009 at 03:10 pm

From firefighters you went to “any govt employee.”
I never made an argument that any govt employee should get $125,000 dollars a year in pension benefits, only the ones that place their life in the front lines for the public good.
You moved the goal posts, and are arguing against yourself.

However, if by “any govt employee” you also include those that place their life in the front lines for the public good, here is the answer you are so desperately seeking:

LOS ANGELES — Firefighters tried to hold back a wildfire……they mourned two of their own who were killed……..down a mountain side.

&heellip;

Fire Capt. Tedmund Hall, 47, of San Bernardino County, and firefighter Specialist Arnaldo “Arnie” Quinones, 35, of Palmdale, were killed in the crash, the department said in a statement. Authorities did not give a cause for the crash.

Hall was a 26-year veteran, and Quinones had been a county firefighter for eight years.

You understand that people hiding money in offshore accounts is a reaction to high taxes. In general, once you start taxing over 30% people start hiding their money. Even you Dems. Why do you think Rangel hid half his assets. (They were in the US).

Greg in Alabama on August 31, 2009 at 04:35 am

None of us likes or wants to pay high, or low taxes. Yet the vast majority pays anyway.
Not everybody is able to hide their money in offshore accounts.
Because they disagree with the tax rates, is not an excuse.
The ones that hide their money/assets in the USA are sooner or later caught, Evidence of that, is Rangel.
Too bad the government can’t catch all the cheats and make ‘em pay through the nose.

None of us likes or wants to pay high, or low taxes.

False! Economic history demonstrates that most people are OK with tax rates not exceeding 20%, total. Most people consider that as much as the govt deserves for what it does for them.
When govt gets greedy, and wants more than it deserves, people go into avoidance mode. However, as Bat points out, putting money in offshore accounts isn’t in that category. They just want more return than they can get in the govt-rigged US markets. The more Obama attacks the private sector, the more that solution is needed.
Contrary to your false statement, people are OK with an appropriate(low) rate of taxation, which is why President Bush’s tax rate reductions resulted in an increase in revenues to the Treasury.
It’s simple economics.

e,

Coward!

As usual, ignorant little e has no affirmative argument for anything; he is just a sniper troll, trying to garner attention from his betters by being annoying.

As usual, ignorant little e has no affirmative argument for anything; he is just a sniper troll, trying to garner attention from his betters by being annoying.
robert108 on August 31, 2009 at 08:19 am

There you go again. Making unsubstantiated claims.

Still no affirmative argument for anything, sniper e?

e,

My question was directed at Buzz first, and then at you. Both of you asserted that people put their money in overseas accounts to avoid taxes. Buzz went so far as to say that this was done because people “don’t want to pay any taxes” which is little more than liberal class warfare hyperbole.

Those of you on the Left conveniently assume that people put money into overseas accounts to avoid taxation, but I doubt that you can substantiate that claim to any great extent. No doubt some do. But there are other, far more pressing reasons for doing so. With interest rates where they currently are, your explanation might cover about two-thirds of a penny for each dollar deposited. The bank’s various fees will just about eat up the same amount as would the taxes you say they are avoiding, so your explanation really doesn’t make much sense, does it?

Pil, I choked up when I read the age of these fine men who died. I grieve over every son of this country at home and abroad who gives the last great measure of devotion to keep us safe and free.

And thank you for your service sir.

NOW, to he horticulture (biodiversity) question. Mr Hort here.

I spent some time in the hills surrounding LA. I saw the huge undergrowths of shrub oak that would burn hot. And there were sages.

The stuff people plant 2H isn’t the issue, the issue is people LIVE where there is this huge undergrowth that when people 200 years ago lived there would burn out from the undergrowth with regularity.

Just like the Prairies of Dakota. Prairefires were God’s way of hoeing weeds, thinning out deer and fertilizing the ground.

The problem is Smokey the Bear is WRONG. We have to have fires. In fact, they should not be fought. Development should be such that there is no need for firefighting.

BUT I saw people who loved building a house right in the middle of a coniferous and Oak brush environment. When that burns, it burns hot and high.

I know it sounds cruel, but the way to stop fires is to let her burn. It takes YEARS for the tinder to accumulate again and then let her burn again.

Man has a way of getting in the way of a cycle that operated pretty well for millenia.

If you don’t want a fire, build a 5 mile black dirt firebreak around your development and then build with less vegetation around your property. Kind of like downtown LA.

No fire problems there.

What a sad, sad update

NO. I understand that some people don’t want to pay any taxes.
Buzz on August 31, 2009 at 04:50 am

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