Say Anything Blog

Claiming that Israel has one is about as naive and short-sighted as claiming that pulling out of Iraq will solve our problems in the middle east.

Thank gawd he didn’t land on a carrier to declare Israel Won.

I find it fascinating that Americans are so enamored of clear-cut victories—perhaps the result of nearly 60 years of half-hour sitcoms and dramas where every crisis, not matter how complex, is neatly resolved.

The real world is not so tidy.

Objectively, Israel won the “war” by any military standard you care to use.  Everything else is just spin.  I give my reasons more extensively here.

Mick: Isn’t that what the President said?

If govt control of the economy were the way to go, the Soviet Union would be the richest, most powerful nation in the history of the world.

Thanks to Obama, America remains the only country where it is illegal to drill our own oil!

israel has “one” the war.
not won the war !!!

When the other guy comes to the deck of your battleship and signs unconditional surrender papers, you can call it a win.

Whe the US troops leave a stable Iraq under democratic rule, with Saddam dead or in jail for life, we can call that a win. Anything else is half assed.

Getting your entire neighborhood destroyed and have your a** kicked across a river over 20 miles away seems like a loss to me. Now Israel knows the operation of the terrorists cowards, next time they start at the river and work back to the border and destroy everything in between. Leave nothing standing and no one alive. Let roto-reuters photo shop that.

“Thank gawd he didn’t land on a carrier to declare Israel Won.”

Why bring up that old discredited leftie canard?  The Navy put up the banner that said “Mission Accomplished” signifying the deposing of Saddam, which was their mission.  No claim of victory was made, only that they had done what they came here to do.  I thought you would have known that.

If govt control of the economy were the way to go, the Soviet Union would be the richest, most powerful nation in the history of the world.

Thanks to Obama, America remains the only country where it is illegal to drill our own oil!

Absolute, complete victory for Hezbollah. They fought a technologically and numerically superior foe and didn’t lose, and Israel will be sent back over their border with their tail between their legs.

Hezbollah will remain armed, and will remain part of the Lebanese government, calling the tune. 

Getting your entire neighborhood destroyed and have your a** kicked across a river over 20 miles away seems like a loss to me.

You make the naieve assumption that these things actually matter to Hezbollah. Civilian casualties, and images of a shattered infrastructure in Lebanon are actually *good* for Hezbollah.

now that israel “won”, who will be part of the UN collition in Lebanon ?

It is going to be an ‘enhanced’ UNIFIL force, so that means it is going to be Ghana, India, China, Poland, Italy and the possible addition of France.

From http://www.rte.ie

Earlier, the Lebanese President said he would welcome Irish troops as part of the International Peacekeeping Force due to take over southern Lebanon as Israeli forces withdraw. 

Speaking in an RTÉ interview, Emile Lahoud said Irish troops had shown during their years with UNIFIL that they were a reliable and neutral force.

He said it was important that the force was made up of a number of different nationalities and that it was not dominated by any one country.

Yeah, reliable and neutral cause we simply dont give a fuck.

This is what frustrates me about the current administration.  Declaring Israel the, much less a, winner is ludicrous.  In a purely military sense that may be correct (though still debatable).  But in reality, Hizbollah wins a major PR battle, ends up able to re-arm itself, gets the opportunity to lay low and regain its strength, and will certainly be back again—in a much stronger position than before.  Israel can’t afford too many more victories like this. *sigh*

Regards…

It’s only “Half - Time” , Middle East style.

Really the war with Islam will never be over as long as Islamic tyrants rule and imam/mullahs preach hate. Consider the recent Hezbollah-Israeli conflict a mere border skirmish.  The real battles are yet to be fought.

R108, Oh, it’s the Navy’s fault the “Mission accomplished” sign was put up there?  Give me a break.  Nothing, and I mean nothing gets put up anywhere the Prez is without his people knowing about it and approving it.  Puhleeeeze, anyone who know anything about the stops any politician makes including the Prez, is orchestrated down to the last detail. 

so don’t give me that tripe that it was the Navy’s fault the sign was up there.  He loved it, he reveled in it and now it is coming back to bite him.

P: You missed it, as usual.  I never used the word “fault”, as none was involved.  The sign expressed the truth that the Navy had accomplished their part of the overall mission.  You can’t understand that?  It was a compliment to the competence and heroism of the Navy.  Your operatives have tried to twist it into something bad, but you don’t have the truth on your side, as usual.

If govt control of the economy were the way to go, the Soviet Union would be the richest, most powerful nation in the history of the world.

Thanks to Obama, America remains the only country where it is illegal to drill our own oil!

I am a strong supporter of Israel, but to me there is no way to interpret what happened here as anything other than an overwhelming political defeat for Israel.  NONE of Israel’s stated pre-War goals (securing the release of the kidnapped soldiers, eliminating Hezbollah’s ability to launch rockets into Northern Israel, etc.) were achieved.  And, as usual, public opinion ended up squarely on the side of those who Israel was fighting.

Israel did not accomplish half the goals it sett out for itself, ..the two kidnapped soldiers overwhich this whole thing started are still in Hezbullah’s hand.

Is that what Bush considers a win?

Hezbollah may be dancing in the streets, but Arabs do that after every losing conflict.  The Egyptians are still celebrating their “victory” in the Yom Kippur war.

I think the media is being fed a line of bull about Hezbollah’s political victory.  There is no love lost between the various rival groups in Lebanon. They are simply biding their time until the furor dies down and they can stab Hezbollah in the back.  Remember, Israel is still in-country, and will be for sometime.  In effect, the war really starts now, and Hezbollah will have to deal with reconstruction, rearming, Israel, the Druze, the Christians, rival Shia groups (Amal?), various Sunni regional governments.

Its notable that the Lebanese refusal to disarm Hezbollah is already a technical violation of the ceasefire.

No one seems to have considered that the current ceasefire was the result of international pressure.  If Hezbollah breaks it—and they already have, Israel can go at it hammer and tongs and no one can really say a thing.  I suspect that is also the reason everyone is saying its going to take a year to deploy—they know just as well as anyone else that this sham cease-fire isn’t going to last.

Consider the proposition that Syria uses the cease-fire to rearm Hezbollah—to what effect?  Israel went where they wanted to and killed everyone they met.  What will change the next time?  Can Hezbollah really afford to destroy south Lebanon yet again?  We talk about Israeli vunerability to Hezbollah, but has anyone considered how the Lebanese are viewing the destruction of half their country?

I am just astonished at how so many otherwise obviously intelligent people are buying the Hezbollah spin on this.

Mick: Probably for the same reason buy the doctored and staged photos and the phony “documentary” footage.  They want the terrorists to win.

If govt control of the economy were the way to go, the Soviet Union would be the richest, most powerful nation in the history of the world.

Thanks to Obama, America remains the only country where it is illegal to drill our own oil!

That should be “they buy”.

If govt control of the economy were the way to go, the Soviet Union would be the richest, most powerful nation in the history of the world.

Thanks to Obama, America remains the only country where it is illegal to drill our own oil!

Was the mission complete for the ‘Fleet’ that he welcomed home? 100% and the dimorats can get over it. Talk about coming back to bite you in the a**, the day is coming when you will hide in a hole like your hero terrorists to keep the bite or bullet from being applied to you. It won’t work, like the terrorists you will be dragged from your hole (ex. Saddam). Too many hunters and not enough of you cowards to complete the game.

“I am just astonished at how so many otherwise obviously intelligent people are buying the Hezbollah spin on this.”

“Mick: Probably for the same reason buy the doctored and staged photos and the phony “documentary” footage. They want the terrorists to win.”

NONSENSE!  I have family and friends in Israel, and desperately wanted Israel to wipe Hezbollah off the face of the planet.  Let’s not forget that up until 9/11, Hezbollah had killed more Americans in terrorist acts than any other terrorist group.  That said, the facts are the facts.  Olmert did not accomplish any of his stated objectives.  No amount of “spin” can change that.

Maybe, Mick, you are right, but I just can’t see it.  You asked how Lebanese are viewing the destruction of their country.  Well, I admit that I am forced to rely (too much) on the drive-by media for information in this regard, but it seems as though all the past five weeks have done is push Lebanon back into Syria’s sphere of influence.