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Saturday, November 05, 2005

Bonhoeffer or Gandhi

The Reverend Martin Luther King Junior once said "If your opponent has a conscience, then follow Gandhi and nonviolence. But if your enemy has no conscience like Hitler, then follow Bonhoeffer." In the clear, elegant fashion that he was known for, Rev. King articulated the moral case for action in the face of evil.

For those who don't know, Dietrich Bonhoeffer was a German Lutheran theologian who was active in the German anti-Nazi resistance during World War II. During the war, Bonhoeffer came to understand that violence is justified in the face of an implacable evil, and that to love one's neighbor is to take a measure of responsibility for their life. He followed through on his convictions and became involved the unsuccessful Wolf's Lair bombing plot to assassinate Hitler, and was subsequently arrested by the Gestapo. On April 9, 1945, he paid for his convictions with his life in the Flossenburg Concentration Camp. Had he been successful, millions of innocent lives could have been saved.

Gandhi was successful in his bid for an independent India by non-violent means because of the nature of his opponent. Through a series of mass public demonstrations the Indians showed the British that they faced a stark choice: they could either engage in slaughter, or leave. The British chose the latter, and a newly independent India was born.

In China from April to June 1989, student protestors engaged in a massive non-violent protest for democracy in Tiananmen Square, with greatly different results. Threatened by the size, duration, and fervor of the protest, Deng Xiaoping and the Communist party leadership declared martial law. The resulting crackdown claimed thousands of lives.

These examples find relevance in current events. When the alternative to war is leaving in place a regime that has proven its lethal intents on its neighbors and its own populace, and is likely to continue to cause the deaths of more, then it is time for good intentioned people to the mental calculus: what are the odds that nonviolent action will cause a change of policy, and what is the cost, in human lives and suffering, of not taking violent action?

To engage in war is to cause suffering and death. However, it is equally true that to sit and do nothing while others are persecuted and killed is to be culpable for that very same suffering and death. One must do the calculus and determine not only what the costs of action are likely to be, but also what the costs of inaction are likely to be. Then you will know if you should be Bonhoeffer or Gandhi.

Comments

Avatar for Graeme Anfinson

If you are implying that Dr. King would have supported the war in Iraq, I don’t think you know much about him. THe democratic socalist probaly would have had the same view as Vietnam. Here is a quote of him pretty much changing his mind on what he said in your post.

“More recently I have come to see the need for the method of nonviolence in international relations. Although I was not yet convinced of its efficacy in conflicts between nations, I felt that while war could never be a positive good, it could serve as a negative good by preventing the spread and growth of an evil force. War, horrible as it is, might be preferable to surrender to a totalitarian system. But now I believe that the potential destructiveness of modern weapons totally rules out the possibility of war ever again achieving a negative good. If we assume that mankind has a right to survive then we must find an alternative to war and destruction. Don’t ever let anyone pull you so low as to hate them. We must use the weapon of love. We must have the compassion and understanding for those who hate us. We must realize so many people are taught to hate us that they are not totally responsible for their hate. But we stand in life at midnight; we are always on the threshold of a new dawn.”

--Martin Luther King, Jr., “Pilgrimage to Nonviolence” in Strength to Love

Graeme Anfinson on November 5, 2005 at 10:12 am
Avatar for keep it simple

fight or flight? I think philosophising war is as stupid as it gets. “War”...it’s a conglomerate idea in itself for something that should be seen for what it is: people killing people. It’s not an institution, it doesn’t deserve philosophy, it doesn’t deserve praise or reward anywhere within it’s self inclusive ranks..."war" should be seen as a ridiculous idea our ancestors had, and our government shouldn’t even humor the notion.

keep it simple on November 5, 2005 at 11:12 am
Avatar for Dave

Er, did a quick internet search and I had the wrong essay. It was actually in Orwell’s “No, Not One”.

Since pacifists have more freedom of action in countries where traces of democracy survive, pacifism can act more effectively against democracy than for it. Objectively, the pacifist is pro-Nazi.

Dave on November 5, 2005 at 12:11 pm
Avatar for Sluggo

Simple,

What do you do if there are people bent on your destruction?  How do you stop someone who does not want peace?  Surely you are not naive enough to think that if you just put down your arms, you will be spared from the suicide bomber.  At some point, pacifism equates to suicide.  Do you remember the lessons learned from the conflict between the Mori and Maori tribes in the South Pacific?

War is the last alternative for a nation, when diplomatic and peaceful measures fail.

Sluggo on November 5, 2005 at 12:11 pm
Avatar for Dave

At some point, pacifism equates to suicide.

At another point it equates to genocide.

As Orwell pointed out in his essay on Gandhi, pacifists were objectively pro-Nazi.

Dave on November 5, 2005 at 12:12 pm
Rob
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I’m not going to presume to speak for Dr. King, Graeme, but that quote is hardly convincing of the idea that he would have opposed the war in Iraq.

After all, what are the Islamo fascists if not a group of people seeking to foist a toltalitarian regime on the whole world?

And, for that matter, where do you get off calling King a socialist?  The man was clearly against toltalitarianism, so why would he be for socialism?


The war against illegal plunder has been fought since the beginning of the world. But how is… legal plunder to be identified? Quite simply. See if the law takes from some persons what belongs to them, and gives it to other persons to whom it does not belong. See if the law benefits one citizen at the expense of another by doing what the citizen himself cannot do without committing a crime. Then abolish this law without delay … If such a law is not abolished immediately it will spread, multiply and develop into a system.

Frédéric Bastiat, The Law

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Rob on November 5, 2005 at 01:11 pm
Avatar for likwidshoe

Carl B. holier than thou holier than marty get a grip keep it simple said, It’s not an institution, it doesn’t deserve philosophy, it doesn’t deserve praise or reward anywhere within it’s self inclusive ranks…”war” should be seen as a ridiculous idea our ancestors had, and our government shouldn’t even humor the notion.

This only makes sense to the naive and/or moral relativist or in a world of peace where evil does not exist. We do not live in a world of peace where evil does not exist.

likwidshoe on November 5, 2005 at 02:11 pm
Avatar for WOOF

Toltalitarianism is a political system not an economic system.

King endorsed “democratic socialism,” while making “it clear to close friends that economically speaking he considered himself what he termed a Marxist.”

http://www.lewrockwell.com/archives/fm/02-91.html

WOOF on November 5, 2005 at 02:12 pm
Avatar for The Whistler

Toltalitarianism is a political system not an economic system

Don’t the leaders of one get to make all economic systems.  You could either go with the Facist system where the dictator where the benefits of ownership go to the owners but they have to run it as the dictator wishes.

Or you could go Socialist/Communist where benefits of ownership go to the bureacrats, but they have to run it as the dictator wishes.

Doesn’t make much difference to me, but don’t say they don’t have a wish to decide how the economy is going to be run.

By the way, anybody notice that they NEVER talk about Iraq’s pre-war econimic system.  What I’ve found is that is was Stalinist communism.

The Whistler on November 5, 2005 at 03:12 pm
Avatar for Graeme Anfinson

And, for that matter, where do you get off calling King a socialist? The man was clearly against totalitarianism, so why would he be for socialism?

You are talking about the bureaucratic communists, not democratic socialism. Democratic socialists are for socializing basic needs. They think the market works fine for alot of things. They favor mixed economy . democratic socialists are some of the biggest critics of those totalitarian regimes. MLK, along with Albert Einstein, george orwell,hellen keller among others, stated his support for democratic socialism many times.

Graeme Anfinson on November 6, 2005 at 10:11 am
Rob
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So, in a democratic socialist state the government picks which part of the market will be socialized and which parts will not be?

That sounds like a benevolent dictatorship to me, something that is one step away from toltalitarianism.


The war against illegal plunder has been fought since the beginning of the world. But how is… legal plunder to be identified? Quite simply. See if the law takes from some persons what belongs to them, and gives it to other persons to whom it does not belong. See if the law benefits one citizen at the expense of another by doing what the citizen himself cannot do without committing a crime. Then abolish this law without delay … If such a law is not abolished immediately it will spread, multiply and develop into a system.

Frédéric Bastiat, The Law

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

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Rob on November 6, 2005 at 12:11 pm
Avatar for WOOF

Does anyone know of an original source of the quote

But if your enemy has no conscience like Hitler, then follow Bonhoeffer.”

?
WOOF on November 6, 2005 at 01:11 pm
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