Are Voter ID Requirements Equivalent To A Poll Tax?

On his reader blog, Goon posts about Minnesota’s Rep. Keith Ellison comparing voter ID requirements to a poll tax while giving a speech supporting some legislation that would prevent voter ID requirements in federal elections.
Here’ what Ellison had to say:

Requiring photo IDs to vote in federal elections would be banned under legislation introduced Wednesday by Rep. Keith Ellison, who said such requirements disenfranchise minorities, the poor, women, elderly and young people.
“While photo IDs seem harmless, they are in fact the modern day poll tax,” Ellison, D-Minn., said in a statement.

There are a couple of problems with this argument.
First, every voter ID law that has been passed in this country has had a provision in it to provide ID free of charge to those who a) don’t already have an acceptable for of ID and b) can’t afford to purchase ID. Now, people like Ellison are quick to say that the mere process of having to obtain an ID is in and of itself a tax. But that’s pretty absurd. Every single state in the union (with the exception of my home state North Dakota) requires voters to register before they can vote. The registration process often includes picking up forms at a local government office (or downloading them from the internet, though it’s not likely that the indigent have internet access), filling it out and mailing it in to the proper authorities who, in turn, will mail back a registration card. As an example, here’s the registration process for California.
Now if that process isn’t a “poll tax,” how could obtaining an ID be a poll tax?
Second, what are we say “minorities, the poor, women, elderly and young people” are incapable of securing an ID? Is the suggestion here that women, along with these other demographics, are too uneducated or lazy to go through the rather simply process of obtaining an ID for voting? That’s…rather insulting. Certainly there may be people in the world who may have a hard time getting down to their local court house or DMV to get an ID, but it’s pretty discriminatory to suggest that those people are all going to be women or minorities. What’s more, the number of people who are unable to get an ID is going to be so small as to be almost insignificant. But even so, there will no doubt be groups out there to help these people get the ID’s they need to vote. Just as there are groups now who help the indigent register to vote.
Ellison’s arguments are, frankly, just plain silly. Compared to the anti-vote fraud benefits made possible by requiring voters to identify themselves with some sort of official ID, his concerns (and the concerns of those who think as he do) about a fractional slice of the voting public not being able to ID’s are absurd.

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  • http://Array robert108

    As usual, the lefties confuse rights with entitlements. In fact, voting is a responsibility of the real citizen, and is forbidden for the non-citizen. Establishing citizenship is the first responsibility of the voter. Duh.

  • Bat One

    Actually the ones who are disenfranchised are the legal voters, whose legitimate ballots are diminished by by the fraudulent votes of illegal aliens, dead persons and those Democrats who manage to “vote early… and vote often.”

    The whole purpose of the left’s attempts to “enfranchise” illegal aliens, through nonsense such as proposed by Keith “Muhammed” Ellison, or Elliot Spitzer’s NY state drivers license scheme, is to steal elections by stuffing ballot boxes with the votes of illegals, while disenfranchising those of us who care about the integrity of the electoral process.

  • carrick

    WOOF:

    Not your call Carrick, but it displays your arrogance.
    Universal suffrage disturb your sense of propriety?

    Obviously it’s not my call. Never said it was. I just voiced my opinion.

    It also costs money for transportation to vote. Is that a tax too? And why is that OK but a once in a life-time purchase (equal to a raid on Taco Hell) is a “tax”.

    You really make no sense at all.

  • Hoss

    It demands certain groups of voters jump through hoops.

    All are required to do so, so no, there’s no special demand on “certain groups.” If you fly in an airplane or drive a car you have to have an ID, and now they’re gonna want a passport to travel to Mexico or Canada, are we being disenfranchised from our right to travel freely. Of course not, it’s just silly BS like the whole voter disenfranchisement routine by the left.

    I think it’s cute how Woofie uses liberal blogs as sources of evidence. The left’s not much good past the talking-points, but we already knew that.

    Democrats lose elections when the dead aren’t allowed to vote.

  • http://ndgoon.blogspot.com/ goon

    7 years of Republican DOJ
    voter fraud priority,
    where are the convictions?
    Voter fraud, not much of a problem.

    Denying the franchise to perhaps millions of the poor, elderly and
    infirm that’s the Republican voter suppression agenda.

    Nice to see that Woof is still spewing the Moveon.org and talking points memo…

  • robert108

    The potential for fraud is not trivial, as federal privacy laws prevent cross-checking voter registration rolls with immigration records. Nevertheless, a 1997 Congressional investigation found that “4,023 illegal voters possibly cast ballots in \[a\] disputed House election” in California. After 9/11, the Justice Department found that eight of the 19 hijackers were registered to vote.

    This is an excerpt from an article in OpinionJournal, which you can find here:

    http://www.opinionjournal.com/diary/?id=110010814

  • carrick

    WOOF:

    24 convictions of voter fraud over three years.
    Hardly a reason to deny the franchise to millions.

    24 convictions…because of a lack of resources put forth by DAs, not because of a lack of evidence. Most cases where there is evidence never go to trial. It either has to be pretty egregious, or have been done by a peon with no protection.

    Truthfully it happens pretty routinely.

    Proof, by the way, that it would disenfranchise anybody? Poor is poor, but your idea of poor isn’t very realistic. Most poor own their own house, at least one car and several TVs, but they can’t afford to drop a few bucks to get proper registration? Get a grip.

    This is nothing but a bullshit argument and you know it.

    The truth is as I have said it, it mostly prevents dead people from voting, not legal ones.

    In any case, every fake vote cancels one legitimate one for the opposite party. You apparently don’t care for those voters who take the trouble to get to the poll, to have proper ID and so forth.

  • http://proof-proofpositive.blogspot.com/ proof_positive

    they benefit from illegal and dead voters

    Don’t forget “snow birds” and college students!

  • robert108

    Voter fraud is a myth — not an
    urban or rural myth, as such, but a Republican one.

    You mean like the last two Presidential elections? Oh, wait, that was the Dems.

  • carrick

    WOOF:

    Justice required every U.S. attorney to designate a district election officer, whose job it would be to end this epidemic of electoral fraud.

    And when they didn’t, the DOJ fired them, or at least the worst violators.

    You know what happened then: Your Democrats on the Hill gang-banged the DOJ for firing them.

    Really though, you are hopelessly naive if you really think that a mere bureaucratic decree does anything. I guess that’s why you think Kyoto would work: Technology revolution by fiat.

    There are people who don’t have cars or houses, millions of them.

    Which is irrelevant to the question of whether they should be required to make a one-time life purchase of a birth certificate so that they can get their free ID.

    Really if they can’t be bother, I sure don’t wan them voting.

  • carrick

    Rob:

    If the fee on getting a birth certificate is the hold-up here, I’m all for waiving that as well as the charge for the ID.

    Of course that’s the real solution.

    The DNC isn’t interested in this because they benefit from illegal and dead voters.

  • robert108

    Of course that’s the real solution.

    I disagree. The real problem here is illegal voting, not the phony “poll tax” rhetoric. As usual, the lefties are lying to conceal their real agenda.
    It is the responsibility of every citizen to prove their eligibility to vote. By the present leftie rhetoric, even registering to vote before the election isn’t OK; they want people to simply drive up to the polls, and to vote without even having to register, simply by showing a driver license. No screening at all, which is what they really mean by “universal sufferage”-anyone in the world can vote in our elections.

  • http://joellpalmer.blogspot.com/ Robbin Stewart esq.

    1. In order to get the “free” ID, where I am in Indiana, you need a birth certificate – cost, $10.
    80% of Indiana residents aren’t eligible for that “free” ID – they pay, is it $15, for a voting/driving/drinking license. No ID is required to cash a check – it’s up to the bank – I go to my local bank where they know me. No ID is required to fly.
    2. The constitution doesn’t prohibit poll taxes just for poor people – it prohibits poll taxes for everybody. 24th Amendment.
    3. If they want to go thru my pockets to see my voting license, they can get a warrant. 4th Amendment.
    4. My right to vote is protected by my state constitution – ID or no ID. When they refused to count my vote because I don’t choose to show D without a warrant, they deliberately engaged in voter fraud.

  • carrick

    WOOF:

    The aged and poor are most likely to be in that situation, millions of people. They can prove their identity and residence other ways, as they always have at the polls.

    And more importantly, it helps you stuff the ballots using still-registered dead voters. Complaints about ID cards aren’t so much for protection of voters, but really protection for voter fraud.

    It happens every election, mostly in poor districts, which translates into free votes for the DNC.

  • halatbis

    My purchase is nearly complete—”Sir, will you give me an I.D.”? If it is ND, they sometimes say “please” at the end of the request. I just bought a couple of 2X4′s and paid by check. Didn’t get me peeved–”sure, here you are”. Jeez, I can’t even buy a couple of 2X4′s without an I.D. anymore. Polltax, indeed. I lived in Texas and paid a polltax in 1964–I know what that is.

  • robert108

    The poll tax was designed to prevent legal citizens from voting; voter ID is designed to prevent non-citizens from voting. Big difference.
    As usual, the lefties are confused.

  • robert108

    7 years of Republican DOJ voter fraud priority,
    where are the convictions?

    Glad you asked: Here’s one about some lefties pleading guilty to election fraud. It just doesn’t get coverage in the MSM, but there’s a lot of it.

    http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2007/10/missing_headlines_leftwing_vot_1.html

  • http://www.radicalnegative.blogspot.com/ Blake Emerson

    These new techniques of disenfranchisement are of a piece with the poll taxes and literacy tests as intruments of white privilege and institutional racism. Combined with the gutting of the Voting Rights Act and Brown v. Board at the hands of the Supreme Court, these laws represent a radically reactionary effort to overturn the Civil Rights Movement. We are on the verge of reauthorizing a racial aristocracy in which our sovereign, “the people,” signifies not all citizens, but rather the white economic elite…
    Read on at http://radicalnegative.blogspot.com/2007/11/redistricting-voter-ids-and-new-racial.html

  • 2Hotel9

    woofie is so full of shit it is not even funny. No ID, no Medicaid, Welfare, Socialist Security, tobacco purchase, Medicare, movie rental, check cashing,offtrack betting, lottery ticket cashin, prescription pickup, alcohol purchase, utility accounts, vehicle purchase, etc etc.

    Come on, woofie. Squeeze out some tears for us. Prove how much you care about illegal aliens.

  • http://ndgoon.blogspot.com/ goon

    24 convictions of voter fraud over three years.
    Hardly a reason to deny the franchise to millions.

    Thats the ones we know of. How many fraudulent votes were used by the Dems in Washington state to steal the governorship.

  • 2Hotel9

    woofie keeps spewing this lie, fact is if you are required to present ID to buy cigarettes and alcohol then you damn well should show ID to vote. No ID to vote? No ID for anything else.

  • 2Hotel9

    As for the Passport without ID, that is a lie. You must produce valid, photo ID before you are given that Passport. You can begin the process to have that Passport issued without ID, before it is put in your hand you must produce a valid ID. Period.

  • 2Hotel9

    “Are Voter ID Requirements Equivalent To A Poll Tax?”

    No. Next question please.

    woofie, all these people who you claim will be “disenfranchised” by showing ID to vote have to produce ID to cash checks and access their welfare benefits. Why are you not screeching that they are being “disenfranchised” by that? Lets hear it, America hating fuckbag. Why is it OK to require ID for Welfare, check cashing, cigarette and alcohol purchases, and not for voting? Entertain us, America hater.

  • Sam I Am

    It is patently obvious to anybody with the slightest amount of honesty in their body that the Democrats want to make voting illegally as easy as possible because they know they will profit the most from illegal(s) voting, and have. Thus, they oppose any measures that can help prevent vote fraud. They do not put the integrity of our elections process–the foundation of our entire political system–above their own Party interest. This kind of cynical and even treasonous behavior is being repeated in numerous other issues too.

    It’s really gotten to the point that voting for a Democrat is equivalent to an act of treason, or at least sedition because you are enabling them.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/ likwidshoe

    2Hotel9, you have to understand that people like Blake Emerson and to a somewhat lessor extent, WOOF, see everything through the lens of race. When race doesn’t exist in the subject, they invent it! This is what racists do.

    I do have to wonder why WOOF and Blake Emerson believe that black people and women are too stupid to get a free ID. Then again, sexism and racism aren’t based in logic, so there’s no good answer as to why they think the way they do.

  • 2Hotel9

    woofie, you will not be given your passport until you provide valid ID. Period. Tell us some more lies. I just finished this process, Wifey, Boy and me. We could not take possession of our completed passports till we presented valid ID. Period. So, lie some more.

  • robert108

    You really make no sense at all.

    That’s because his real agenda is to get the vote for the invaders.

    Lefties lie; it’s all they have.

  • Bat One

    Blake,

    Your rant about racial disenfranchisement is the sort of tedious drivel that even a high school drop-out with a low-octane IQ would find laughable. The Voter ID requirement of the Georgia statute, for example, is no more onerous than what is currently required to cash a paycheck, or purchase a pack of Kools or a six-pack of malt liquor.

    The fact is, it’s you and your tiresome tantrums about victimhood who perpetuates the stereotype of Black Americans too poor, too dumb, or too lazy to obtain the necessary documentation to establish their legal identity. The only ones being “disenfranchised” are those who have no business voting in the first place… or the second, or the third, if they are Democrats.

  • robert108

    Are Voter ID Requirements Equivalent To A Poll Tax?

    No.

  • robert108

    They’re trying to conflate one with the other on purpose.

    Of course, and not only that, but they get a twofer: they also get to play the race and poverty cards.
    The poll tax was originally dreamed up by Southern Dems to keep black citizens from voting.

  • 2Hotel9

    Democrat National Committee, repository of Racism and Sexism since 1865.

  • 2Hotel9

    So, Blake, what you are telling us is that Democrats such as yourself believe minority citizens are too stupid to obtain IDs? Does that sum it up, you racist scumbag?

  • http://ndgoon.blogspot.com/ goon

    woof you know and I know that the dems want to mine for vote and vote early and often… That is what this is all about, also they know that they will get illegal aliens to vote for them…

  • robert108

    It may be beyond your ken democracy haters, but it is possible to be a citizen without a drivers license , or a checking account.

    No one here is denying anyone citizenship, only the ability to vote without proving your identity. You change the subject, America hater.

  • 2Hotel9

    Oh, and Joel, glad you let us know sellers of tobacco and alcohol in your state violate the law. That was real intelligent, moron.

  • 2Hotel9

    Notice who it is supporting suffrage for non-citizens.

  • Bat One

    Robbin,

    Please let the rest of us know exactly how you do in court… that is if you’re not too embarrassed.

  • carrick

    WOOF:

    You can get a passport without a picture I.D.

    That’s a fucking stupid idea.

    Are you actually advocating that it’s a good idea?

  • http://ndgoon.blogspot.com/ goon

    As usual, the lefties confuse rights with entitlements. In fact, voting is a responsibility of the real citizen, and is forbidden for the non-citizen. Establishing citizenship is the first responsibility of the voter. Duh.

    Very well said. I am sick and tired of these dems clouding the issues. It is not that hard to get a id, in ND if I am not mistake you have to have Drivers license or some kind of a governemnt ID. Doesn’t seem all that unreasonable…

  • 2Hotel9

    Joel Palmer, glad to see you support No ID For Anything. Good thing you can use any name you want.

  • Lestat

    24 convictions…because of a lack of resources put forth by DAs, not because of a lack of evidence.

    You have any proof of these allegations. We know that it was a priority of the US Justice Department. We know that US attorneys were pressured to bring bogus charges. Where is your evidence that there was evidence that wasn’t prosecuted.

    From what I have seen there is much more evidence of voter suppression be Republicans that wasn’t prosecuted.

  • WOOFX

    Those weren’t lefties pleading guilty those were over enthusiastic capitalists.
    Names for money fraud.

    No votes were cast in the names of the phony voters.

    Extent of the problem, Republican DOJ,

    between October 2002 and September 2005, just 38 cases were brought nationally, and of those, 14 ended in dismissals or acquittals, 11 in guilty pleas, and 13 in convictions.

    Citizens Vote Republican Lose

    It may be beyond your ken democracy haters, but it is possible to be a citizen without a drivers license , or a checking account.
    The aged and poor are most likely to be in that situation, millions of people. They can prove their identity and residence other ways, as they always have at the polls.

    You can get a passport without a picture I.D.

  • WOOFX

    drop a few bucks

    Carrick, you mean a poll tax?
    There are people who don’t have cars or houses, millions of them.
    They have the right to vote.

    No lack of resources.

    38 cases were brought nationally, and of those, 14 ended in dismissals or acquittals, 11 in guilty pleas, and 13 in convictions

    .

    a major Justice Department concern. Starting in 2002, Justice required every U.S. attorney to designate a district election officer, whose job it would be to end this epidemic of electoral fraud. These officers’ attendance was required at annual training seminars, where they were taught how to investigate, prosecute and convict fraudulent voters. The statutes were adequate; the investigators were primed, well-funded and raring to go.

    And nothing happened. For the simple reason that when it comes to voter fraud in America, there’s no there there. Voter fraud is a myth — not an urban or rural myth, as such, but a Republican one.

    Citizens Vote Republicans Lose

  • WOOFX

    I sure don’t wan them voting.

    Not your call Carrick, but it displays your arrogance.
    Universal suffrage disturb
    your sense of propriety?

  • WOOFX

    No picture ID ?
    You need this to get a passport/

    1. Some signature documents, not acceptable alone as ID

    (ex: a combination of documents, such as your Social Security card, credit card, bank card, library card, etc.) AND

    2. A person who can vouch for you. He/she must:

    * Have known you for at least 2 years,
    * Be a U.S. citizen or permanent resident,
    * Have valid ID, and
    * Fill out a Form DS-71 in the presence of a passport agent.
    .Passport

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    They’re not confused in the slighted. They’re trying to conflate one with the other on purpose.

  • WOOFX

    24 convictions of voter fraud over three years.
    Hardly a reason to deny the franchise to millions.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    These new techniques of disenfranchisement are of a piece with the poll taxes and literacy tests as intruments of white privilege and institutional racism.

    So…you’re saying it’s harder for blacks and Hispanics or whatever to get a state ID than it is for white people?

    Can you explain why this is? Are there different lines at the DMV for minorities? Or are you just full of it?

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    Carrick, you mean a poll tax?
    There are people who don’t have cars or houses, millions of them.
    They have the right to vote.

    Absolutely. And they get can a free ID to do so.

    Why is that so unreasonable?

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    For the indigent, the process of registering (since I’m assuming most of them don’t have internet access) requires at least one trip down to a government office. That may cost $3 – $5 in gasoline.

    How is that not a “poll tax” using the logic on display here?

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    It demands certain groups of voters jump through hoops.

    It requires that all citizens who vote have appropriate ID, not “certain groups.” It’s not like there are people saying “Oh, you’re rich. You don’t have to have ID.”

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    If the fee on getting a birth certificate is the hold-up here, I’m all for waiving that as well as the charge for the ID.

    Seems like a small price to pay for increased vote security.

  • WOOFX

    It is an impediment to the franchise.
    The vote is what empowers the citizen.
    It demands certain groups of voters jump through hoops.

  • WOOFX

    7 years of Republican DOJ
    voter fraud priority,
    where are the convictions?
    Voter fraud, not much of a problem.

    Denying the franchise to perhaps millions of the poor, elderly and
    infirm that’s the Republican voter suppression agenda.

  • WOOFX

    Establishing citizenship is the first responsibility of the voter.

    This is known as voter registration.

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