Al Gore As Churchill?

Jon Henke over at QandO (one of my favorite blogs) has a post up comparing recent Nobel Prize-recipient Al Gore to…Winston Churchill.

The Right likes to cast its leaders in the role of Churchill in 1938 – a visionary, warning the world of a gathering threat on the horizon. The US invaded Iraq because of an uncertain risk that we thought it important to guard against, spending thousands of US lives, tens/hundreds of thousands of Iraqi lives, and around a trillion dollars so far.
Well, climate change – to some extent or another – is a far more certain threat to the world than was Iraq, and Gore is genuinely playing the role of Churchill to warn the public of the risk. In that sense, he seems like a very good choice [for the Nobel Prize].

I couldn’t disagree more, for several reasons.
First, I don’t think global warming has been proven to be anywhere near the threat Hitler/fascism was, or even the threat Iraq was under Saddam. For one thing, we don’t even really know if global warming is anthropogenic in nature (that is, caused by humans) or if it simply the result of natural cooling/warming trends that have been taking place on this planet for eons before mankind came along. Why are we trying to stop something we can’t even prove we caused? What’s more, the “threat” Gore is talking about is the globe warming a degree or so a year (or something like that). So what? Does a degree difference in change really pose that much of a threat? And if it does, when will this threat arrive? In the next century? The next millennium?
If you ask me, Gore’s global warming movement has less to do with Churchill’s warnings about fascism and more to do with the Millerite movement of the mid-19th century. Multiple predictions of armageddon and all.
Second, how in the world can anyone who claims to be a proponent of limited government support a carbon tax? We don’t even know if human carbon emission is causing global warming (or contributing to it in any meaningful way) or even if global warming is the apocalyptic event Gore and his disciples make it out to be, so how can we justify such a tax? Also, since when did people believing in limited government start thinking that the tax code should be used for social engineering? The tax code exists to raise necessary amounts of revenue for the government in a transparent way. It doesn’t exist to manipulate the behavior of citizens in the way politicians want. Now I’m fine with going to a consumption-based tax system (see: The Fair Tax), but going to a tax on the use of a particular fuel doesn’t strike me as very “free market.”

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  • http://Array Dave

    When you say “we don’t know”, you’re referring to yourself. Anthropogenic global warming is far more scientifically certain the was the possibility that Saddam would attack the US or provide WMD support for such an attack.

    Sure, it’s easy to be scientifically certain when you throw out the opinions of all disagreeing scientists on the grounds that they must be shills for evil Big Oil. It’s also really easy to get a “consensus” when you take away grants and call for Nuremberg-like trials for scientists who disagree — as has been done by people on your side.

  • http://proof-proofpositive.blogspot.com/ proof_positive

    Al Gore As Churchill?

    How about:

    Al Gore as mole hill?

  • http://proof-proofpositive.blogspot.com/ proof_positive

    Ward Churchill?

    My thoughts exactly! Had it not been for the Maker’s Mark and lobster penne, I’d have been here sooner!

  • http://QandO.net/ Jon Henke

    When you say “we don’t know”, you’re referring to yourself. Anthropogenic global warming is far more scientifically certain the was the possibility that Saddam would attack the US or provide WMD support for such an attack.

    Regarding the Carbon Tax, you should note that I did not simply support a carbon tax. I support a carbon tax that replaces the payroll tax. We’re already being taxed. Given a choice between those two taxes, I would far prefer the carbon tax which attempts to internalize what are currently negative externalities not accounted for in the price of gas, etc. A payroll tax doesn’t solve negative externalities…it imposes them. On employment. Plus, a carbon tax is more visible to consumers – another plus, from my perspective.

    I can’t really think of a single reason to prefer the payroll tax over the carbon tax.

  • http://QandO.net/ Jon Henke

    Well, some of the objections that arose – particularly within the comment thread – are the standard criticisms that have been answered long ago. The “trend” question, for example. Do you think scientists hadn’t thought of that? Do you think it hadn’t occurred to them? Do you think that they haven’t taken that, solar output, variations, etc, into account?

    I choose not to argue about this for the same reason I choose not to dive too deeply into debates about evolution. Many of the criticisms of evolution are answered in Biology 101, and yet they are still widely used by critics who demand answers – and, once answered, move on to the next inaccurate criticism.

    There’s no end to that argument, and I just don’t see much utility in pursuing it. So when I see people bring up the arguments that I initially accepted, but which a modicum of research demonstrated to be weak, misleading, deceptive, poorly-informed, etc…I tend not to find it useful to pursue the discussion further. It never ends well – only in unfortunate alienation.

  • http://SayAnythingBlog.com The_Whistler_ofnd

    Ward Churchill?

  • Mickey

    With all his chins I always thought Al looked more like Jabba the Hutt

  • http://totherightofwrong.blogspot.com/ Caomhin

    In so much as he is giving aid to Stalinist communisim
    -Caomhin

  • http://sayanythingblog.com/readers/author/Anna/ Anna

    LOL,

  • http://QandO.net/ Jon Henke

    I don’t have the time or enthusiasm to delve into debate over the science. I don’t usually find such debates productive, as they end up being endless hopscotching from one question to another.

    I should point out that I’m aware of the criticisms of global warming and of Al Gore. In general, I find the criticisms shallow, over-simplistic, often-unfamiliar with the science, or gross distortions and selective misuse of the facts at hand. And I find the rebuttals far more convincing than the criticisms.

    If you have a criticism of global warming, don’t simply trot it out. Look for the answers. They are readily available. It’s easy to be a skeptic when you stop looking once you’ve raised a question about it.

    I’m sure many of you disagree on this subject, but I doubt we’ll have much satisfaction in arguing this out, so I’ll leave it there.

  • carrick

    Jon Henke:

    If you have a criticism of global warming, don’t simply trot it out. Look for the answers. They are readily available. It’s easy to be a skeptic when you stop looking once you’ve raised a question about it.

    The converse to this works quite well too:

    It’s really easy to be a believer when you stop asking questions.

    I choose not to argue about this for the same reason I choose not to dive too deeply into debates about evolution. Many of the criticisms of evolution are answered in Biology 101, and yet they are still widely used by critics who demand answers – and, once answered, move on to the next inaccurate criticism.

    What horse manure.

    I accept the validity of evolution, but that doesn’t require me to accept every other theory that is out there as a result of that acceptance. Nor is it logical to conflate criticisms of evolution based religious zealotry with criticisms of Al Gore that are centered on his own erroneous statements.

    For example, Gore is wrong about the science of the effect of global warming on ocean levels; he’s also wrong about the effects of global warming on inland ice fields, on hurricane genesis, and so forth.

    The fact is, within the scientific community, there is an active debate as to whether Gore has helped things more than he has hurt.

  • http://SayAnythingBlog.com The_Whistler_ofnd

    Wouldn’t it be nice if saying that was proof. Too bad it’s not.

    We’ve got to see proof that these scientific THEORIES are correct.

    Proponents of manmade global warming need to design models that accurately predict how we got to the point we are at in the climate.

    Then they need to make predictions in the future. The more predictions of the future that they make the more likely that they have it correct.

    A few things they need to explain. If it was much warmer during the Roman times up until a thousand years ago then how can it be global warming causing what we’re seeing today.

    And what about the little ice age that we’ve been recovering from for centuries.

    And why did we see warming in the first part of the last century, then see the trend stop after WW2, and then start up again for the last 30 years?

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    Jon,

    Do you think scientists hadn’t thought of that? Do you think it hadn’t occurred to them? Do you think that they haven’t taken that, solar output, variations, etc, into account?

    If they have, I certainly haven’t heard them account for it in their research. Perhaps you could educate this “shallow” fool by pointing me towards enlightenment.

    But what of the scientists who oppose Gore? Who are saying that links between global warming and human activity are unfounded? Are we to dismiss these people?

    But what I’m really wondering is why, if you aren’t going to engage anyone here in debate, you even bothered commenting? It seems like a waste of everyone’s time for you to come in here, call our arguments shallow, and then refuse to substantiate any of your own arguments.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    Pretty disappointing response, Jon. You assume, because we disagree with you, that we have not spent enough time reviewing the science on both sides of this debate. So you call our arguments shallow and distorted.

    I’d that while I disagreed with you, I was not nearly so dismissive of your opinions.

  • http://sayanythingblog.com robport

    When you say “we don’t know”, you’re referring to yourself. Anthropogenic global warming is far more scientifically certain the was the possibility that Saddam would attack the US or provide WMD support for such an attack.

    That’s not how I see it, but clearly we disagree. I’m looking at studies that show the earth warming and cooling – going in and out of ice ages – and wondering why the latest warming trend isn’t part of that natural cycle.

    I don’t think you or anyone else can provide that answer. So let me say that when you say that anthropogenic global warming is “more certain” than WMD’s in Iraq, you’re speaking for yourself.

    As for the carbon tax, yes it’s an improvement over payroll taxes, but do you really want to set a precedent whereby we limited government types (conservatives, libertarians, what have you) are ok with the tax code as social engineering?

    I, for one, don’t want to go down that road. But then, I don’t see global warming as a threat either.

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