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Thursday, August 30, 2007

Again, Why Was Larry Craig Arrested

Another view from Radley Balko:

Is it really illegal to try to find a sexual partner in a public bathroom using code? How would that be any different than looking for a sexual partner at a dance club, be it using code, pick-up lines, or any thing else in your singles arsenal?

[...]

I’m okay with laws against actually having sex in a public bathroom, provided that the actual owner of the bathroom, which I guess in this case would be the airport, doesn’t want it going on. But Craig doesn’t seem to have been guilty of actually having sex. Only in seeking out a sexual partner.

Another big problem with Craig’s arrest and conviction is that the law he ultimately plead guilty to is so hopelessly vague that it could be applied to just about any sort of public behavior somebody somewhere might find objectionable.  Take a look at the Minnesota law Craig has been convicted of violating:

Whoever does any of the following in a public or private place, including on a school bus, knowing, or having reasonable grounds to know that it will, or will tend to, alarm, anger or disturb others or provoke an assault or breach of the peace, is guilty of disorderly conduct, which is a misdemeanor.

Pro-abortion protesters anger me.  Is that disturbing the peace?  The other day a guy I was standing behind in line broke wind, and I was disturbed.  Was he disturbing the peace?

Reasonable people would say no, but a strict reading of Minnesota’s law would seem to allow for the arrest of these people.  This law is so vague that it seems to hinge almost entirely upon the discretion of the police and/or prosecutor.  And that’s a problem.

I still maintain that what Senator Craig did was creepy, but not illegal even if it can be defined as such by Minnesota’s current cadre of vague laws.

Comments

Avatar for Dave

As I wrote before…

I think it’s almost indisputable that--if the officer’s facts are correct--Larry Craig was guilty of the more serious charge of interference with privacy, a gross misdemeanor. Minnesota law states:

“Interference With Privacy: A person is guilty of a gross misdemeanor who (...) surreptitiously gazes, stares, or peeps (...) (in a) place where a reasonable person would have an expectation of privacy and has exposed or is likely to expose their intimate parts (...) and does so with intent to intrude upon or interfere with the privacy of the occupant.”
.” (MN 609.746)

The police officer’s report states:

“I entered the men’s restroom and proceeded to an unoccupied stall in the back of the restroom. (...) At 1213 hours, I could see an older white male with grey hair (i.e., Larry Craig) standing outside my stall. I could see Craig look through the crack in the door from his position. Craig would look down at his hands, fidget with his fingers, and then look through the crack into my stall again. (...) I was able to see Craig’s blue eyes as he looked into my stall.”

If the officer’s account is based in fact, Craig is guilty of interference with privacy, a gross misdemanor. Hence, he should have been arrested.

Personally, I think he should consider himself lucky for escaping with just the disorderly conduct charge.

Dave on August 30, 2007 at 11:02 am

Would you say that, considering Mr. Craig is a US Senator, his behaviour was unethical?

RoxanneAkimbo on August 30, 2007 at 11:20 am

Craig was arrested because he is a nuisance.
Rubbing your foot against the guy in the next stall and making hand signals makes you a nuisance.

Policemen sitting in public toilets waiting to be propositioned must be being punished or else more perverse than Senator Craig.

Let the electors decide Larry’s
fate.

A misdemeanor arrest is not much reason to resign from the Senate.

As Al Swearegen might say in Deadwood:
2000513994730244923_rs.jpg

One cocksucker more or less will hardly be noticed.

WOOF on August 30, 2007 at 12:16 pm
Avatar for Dave

If the officer’s account is based in fact, Craig is guilty of interference with privacy, a gross misdemanor. Hence, he should have been arrested.

Uh, how exactly do you figure out if a stall is empty or not without glancing at the stall in some manner?  The fact that the officer mentioned Craig’s “blue eyes” without any indication of the distance that Craig was from the stall implies to me that the officer was trying to selectively include facts to show guilt.  Glancing at a stall when you’re 10 feet away and waiting for an open stall is a heck of a lot different than standing 2 feet away and staring through the crack.  Why did the officer fail to include a simple indication of distance in an otherwise highly detailed report? 

The police interview transcript that was just released makes it clear that Craig pled guilty because the officer told him that would be the quick way out and the media wouldn’t find out.  The officer’s statement from the transcript:

So we’ll start over, you’re gonna get out of here. You’re gonna have to pay a fine and that will be it. Okay. I don’t call media, I don’t do any of that type of crap.

The whole story with the left hand casts doubt on the officer’s story.  It would be incredibly awkward to reach into a stall to the right of you with your left hand.  When Craig points this out, suddenly the officer tries to change his story and asks if he moved his wedding ring from his left hand to his right.

Dave on August 30, 2007 at 03:31 pm
Avatar for Bill Mitchell

Craig deserves to go because he handled this (potentially bogus) arrest the same way that Bush has handled every scandal since he came to office.

Badly.

I digress, but case in point, the Gonzales affair.

When it first came down that Democrats were gonna make noise about Gonzales firing DA’s for “political reasons”, Bush should have immediately come out and said the following:

“Hell yes I fired them for political reasons.  I am a politician and they are political appointees.  They serve at my pleasure and I wasn’t pleased with their politics, so they are gone.  Next question...”

But no, he waltzed Gonzales out wo wimpily declare that they were fired for “poor performance”.

Same thing with Craig.  He should have immediately come down hard on the cops for putting “perverted officers in the men’s rooms that see a homosexual advance in every gesture!”

But no, he plead guilty to the lesser charge and hoped it would go away.

So yes he should resign, not for being gay or a pervert, but for being a fool.

Bill Mitchell on August 30, 2007 at 04:10 pm
Avatar for WETBACK

I guess Larry is going to spend more time in the bathroom with Rudy Giuliani and George Bush playing peek-a-boo and footsie.

WETBACK on August 30, 2007 at 04:34 pm

I guess Larry is going to spend more time in the bathroom with Rudy Giuliani and George Bush playing peek-a-boo and footsie.

Won’t Ron Paul be jealous!



Those who think the party or the country, will be “taught a lesson” by handing the levers of power over to the liberals will learn a lesson, but it will be at the expense of our country and her liberties. And there are no guarantees that the party or the country will come out stronger, more conservative or better positioned to win elections against the incumbent liberals.

Proof on August 30, 2007 at 04:36 pm

I always thought it would be cool to be a guy because they can use the bathroom anywhere. BUT I am not so sure now???  There are no safe public mens rooms anymore. I wonder if there will be an increase in kidney and bladder problems amoung men because of the bathroom police?

Zsa Zsa on August 31, 2007 at 11:37 am

I don’t know.  I heard a rumor that Rob will be visiting the scene of the crime early in October.

Maybe he can do some reporting of the goings on.


The Debate is over!  Global Whining has been confirmed.


The Whistler's signature
The Whistler on August 31, 2007 at 11:47 am

I always thought it would be cool to be a guy because they can use the bathroom anywhere.

There’s more to it than that and it’s not all easy.

You have to be able to learn which way to turn a bolt, understand baseball, and master the fine art of Duct Tape.


The Debate is over!  Global Whining has been confirmed.


The Whistler's signature
The Whistler on August 31, 2007 at 11:56 am

Duct tape?

Zsa Zsa on August 31, 2007 at 12:01 pm

The Power Tool in a roll.

Although I’m quite fond of Gorilla tape nowdays as it’s brought the genre to a whole new level.


The Debate is over!  Global Whining has been confirmed.


The Whistler's signature
The Whistler on August 31, 2007 at 12:04 pm

I don’t understand…

Zsa Zsa on August 31, 2007 at 12:09 pm

Don’t worry your pretty little head about it.  It’s just guy talk.


The Debate is over!  Global Whining has been confirmed.


The Whistler's signature
The Whistler on August 31, 2007 at 12:12 pm
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