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Sunday, January 08, 2006

Dean Lays It All On Republicans

Howard Dean:

There are no Democrats who took money from Jack Abramoff, not one, not one single Democrat. Every person named in this scandal is a Republican. Every person under investigation is a Republican. Every person indicted is a Republican. This is a Republican finance scandal. There is no evidence that Jack Abramoff ever gave any Democrat any money and we’ve looked through all of the F.E.C. reports to make sure that’s true…I know the Republican National Committee would like to get the Democrats involved in this. They’re scared. They should be scared. They haven’t told the truth. They have misled the American people, and now it appears they’re stealing from Indian tribes. The Democrats are not involved in this.


Video of Dean's comments here.

I hate to burst Dean's bubble but my Senator, Byron Dorgan, has admitted to accepting money from employees of Abramoff's firm. Sure that's not directly, but since when did one need to have received a personal check from Jack Abramoff to be connected to this nonsense? If Abramoff employees gave money to Democrats at the direction of Abramoff, is that not the exact same thing?

Suggesting that, in order for a politician to be involved in the corruption they had to get their money directly from Abramoff, is spin. Pure and simple. Nothing more.

Abramoff was a go-between for major Indian gambling interests and politicians in Congress. On Abramoff's directions those gambling interests made big-time donations to a lot of politicians. Mostly Republicans, sure, but a lot of Democrats as well.

To deny that this is a bi-partisan scandal is to ignore the problems at the heart of the issue. There needs to be lobbying reform, but if we allow the issue to be spun off as the corruption of one party and not the other - thus implying that replacing one party with the other will fix the problem - all we will do is sweep the problem under the rug until the next Jack Abramoff comes along, be he Democrat or Republican.

Congress is corrupt. Our politicians clearly cannot resist the temptations posed by big-money lobbyists, so we need to change some of the rules. But before we can do that we have to resolve that the problem resides within the system, not with one political ideology or the other.

howard dean, politics, jack abramoff, corruption, lobbying

Comments

Avatar for FreeRepublicans.com

Dean belongs in an asylum repeating the numbers ‘4 8 15 16 23 42’

FreeRepublicans.com on January 8, 2006 at 05:01 pm
Avatar for 2Hotel9

You pick a nice, simple, easy to remember lie, and you stick to it. No matter what.

2Hotel9 on January 8, 2006 at 05:02 pm
Avatar for ellinas

Democrats took political contributions from Abramoff and co.
Republicans took bribes.
Therein lies the difference.
Vive le differans...........

ellinas on January 8, 2006 at 06:01 pm
Avatar for Brandon

So that mega-partisan idiots like Oliver Willis and Duncan Black will just eat it all up.

Brandon on January 8, 2006 at 06:01 pm
Avatar for robert108

ellinas: So you say.  We will see when this gets adjudicated.  Nice leftie spin.

robert108 on January 8, 2006 at 07:01 pm
Avatar for Tom_with_a_Dream

Why can’t we wait for the papers to be released?  All this is simply noise, well except for the 40 of 45 Senators who are reported to have taken $$$…

Tom_with_a_Dream on January 8, 2006 at 07:01 pm
Avatar for Flopping Aces » Blog Archive » The Dir

[...] Rob from Say Anything has a few things to say: Abramoff was a go-between for major Indian gambling interests and politicians in Congress. On Abramoff’s directions those gambling interests made big-time donations to a lot of politicians. Mostly Republicans, sure, but a lot of Democrats as well. [...]

Avatar for LowLife

Many in the press are saying that Abramoff gave money to Dorgan.  He did not.  You point out that the situation is more complicated than that and perhaps you are right.  Yet I don’t know why you criticize Dean for stating the Democratic talking points and not get after Wolf for stating the Republican talking points.  It’s Wolf’s obligation to make the situation clear

LowLife on January 9, 2006 at 07:01 am
Avatar for LowLife

I thought some more about your post and I still don’t think you have a gripe about Dean’s statement.  If a special interest goes to a lobbyist and ask how to direct political contributions to politicians that support their cause and the lobbyist does so then nothing illegal has been done, has it?  I mean, this isn’t what Abramoff is being investigated for, is it?  I’m probably missing something but it seems that, so far, all these invocations of Democratic involvement are just smoke.

LowLife on January 9, 2006 at 07:01 am
Avatar for LowLife

Rob - Abramoff and his firm are different things.  And I’ve not read that an employee gave Dorgan money but that a client gave Dorgan money.  I don’t think that’s illegal, but if it is, how do lobbyist ever do business?

LowLife on January 9, 2006 at 07:02 am
Rob
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18086 comments
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Many in the press are saying that Abramoff gave money to Dorgan. He did not.

But employees of Abramoff’s firm gave Dorgan money.

What’s the difference?


When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

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Rob on January 9, 2006 at 07:02 am
Avatar for Carrick

Ellinas shows incompetence at reality checking:

Democrats took political contributions from Abramoff and co.
Republicans took bribes.
Therein lies the difference.

People are people.  Republicans are not inherently evil.  Democrats are not inherently good.  Except in a world created by popping red pills or eating psychedelic mushrooms.

Real world contributions:

Cycle .......... Dems ..........GOP........GOP/Dems
2000 .......$216,470........$409,513 ........1.9
2002........$552,230.....$1,478,740.........2.7
2004........$620,503........$843,835.........1.4
2006........$152,470........$177,500.........1.2

Average 2-1 GOP to Democrat ratio, but Democrats trending to 1-1.  When money is available, everybody gets greedy.  Where’s the surprise?

Carrick on January 9, 2006 at 05:02 pm
Rob
Rob
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Lowlife, here is where I’m concluding that Dorgan took money from Abramoff’s firm.

And you’re right, simply accepting the money is not illegal.  But then...what politician implicated in this scandal has thus far been proven to have done anything more sinister than simply accept money, legally, from Abramoff?

This is not a Republican-only scandal, though Abramoff was Republican in his personal politics and made all of his personal donations to Republicans.  Democrats, as Carrick has just pointed out, were getting their fair of the loot too. Now the key is to see what they did in return for that loot.


When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

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Rob on January 9, 2006 at 05:02 pm
Avatar for LowLife

Poor guy.  Seems like it was just a big misunderstanding.  Thanks for the dirt on Dorgan, Rob.  It will be interesting to see how the whole thing unfolds.  But why do you think that Dems getting 1/3 of the Abramoff lucre is “their fair share”?  I feel cheated.

Carrick - glad that we agree that people are people.  And I can see that through the phychodelic haze I’m in.

LowLife on January 10, 2006 at 03:02 am
Avatar for Tim

Rob,
Yeah, Dorgan took money from the LAW FIRM at which Abramoff was employed. It wasn’t his firm, and the managing partners originally denied they even knew what Abramoff was up too.
Law Firms give money to all sorts of federal candidates. That has more to do with tort reform than Indian tribes or Mr. Abramoff.
So, I disagree with your premise that this isn’t a distictly republican stinkpile. Sometimes you’re the hammer, sometimes you’re the nail.

Tim on January 10, 2006 at 11:01 am
Rob
Rob
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Tim:

Dorgan took money from Abramoff’s employees and clients.  Dorgan then took favorable action for those same people.  Tell me how this involvement is different from the Republicans involved?


When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

robport.gif border=0

Rob on January 10, 2006 at 02:01 pm
Avatar for Kingdom of Idiots

Dean Lays It All On Republicans

Kingdom of Idiots on January 11, 2006 at 09:02 am
Page 1 of 1        

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