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Sunday, November 27, 2005

Poll: Democrats Hurting Troop Morale

Interesting...

Washington Post - Democrats fumed last week at Vice President Cheney's suggestion that criticism of the administration's war policies was itself becoming a hindrance to the war effort. But a new poll indicates most Americans are sympathetic to Cheney's point.

Seventy percent of people surveyed said that criticism of the war by Democratic senators hurts troop morale -- with 44 percent saying morale is hurt "a lot," according to a poll taken by RT Strategies. Even self-identified Democrats agree: 55 percent believe criticism hurts morale, while 21 percent say it helps morale.

The results surely will rankle many Democrats, who argue that it is patriotic and supportive of the troops to call attention to what they believe are deep flaws in President Bush's Iraq strategy. But the survey itself cannot be dismissed as a partisan attack. The RTs in RT Strategies are Thomas Riehle, a Democrat, and Lance Tarrance, a veteran GOP pollster.

Their poll also indicates many Americans are skeptical of Democratic complaints about the war. Just three of 10 adults accept that Democrats are leveling criticism because they believe this will help U.S. efforts in Iraq. A majority believes the motive is really to "gain a partisan political advantage."


That last point is one I've been making again and again. All this dissent from Democrats over Bush's foreign policy decisions has less to do with sound policy than it has to do with winning elections.

Many will ask, in response to this poll, "Are Democrats not allowed to speak out against foreign policies they disagree with?" The answer is: Of course they are. The problem is not the dissent itself but rather the what is driving the dissent.

Democrats have been telling Americans, almost since the beginning of this war, that Iraq is a "quagmire." That we cannot win. That things are going terribly and we should just cut and run. Yet our troops, who are actually on the ground and dealing with the day-to-day realities of our occupation of Iraq, don't feel that things are going terribly at all. They believe in their mission and feel that they're making great progress. They are inflicting casualty ratios on the enemy that near 20 or 30 dead terrorists to every one dead American soldier. They are rebuilding schools and hospitals. They are watching as democracy they fought for takes root in a long-oppressed land.

So when they compare their reality with the bill of goods being sold to the American people by leftist politicians and the mainstream media what else are they to feel but demoralized?

Perhaps they wouldn't feel demoralized if the story from Democrats and the media matched, in any way, the reality they know in Iraq, but the fact is that it doesn't, and the disconnect between Democrat griping and reality is what has the soldiers feeling down. Perhaps if Iraq really was going terribly, if the situation were really as hopeless as the left would have us all believe, the troops would feel encouraged by the idea that someone at home was getting it right. Instead, because the rhetoric from the left doesn't match reality, the troops feel like they're being undermined at home by a bunch of power-hungry politicians.

And that's a shame.

Comments

Avatar for MikeAdamson

Geez Rob...you had me believing that I shouldn’t trust American polling data and now you pull this about face. The sound of your ambivalence is deafening. wink

MikeAdamson on November 27, 2005 at 11:11 am
Rob
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I have problems with polls that over-sample certain demographics and engage in less-than-accurate polling practices.  If you can show me where any such thing happened with this particular poll I promise you I won’t be “ambivalent” toward it.


When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

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Rob on November 27, 2005 at 12:12 pm
Avatar for 2Hotel9

Troops I talk with say the opposite. This anti-American bullshit pisses them off! And when they are in a position to not have their absentee ballots thrown in the trash, they are going to F**k the Dems in their bloated A**es. Then they are going to push for prosecution for treason. And they are SERIOUS, no shit! They are PISSED. And educated. Polls are irrellevent, they only sample the same 400 people, over and over and over. The American military is not full of uneducated trash. Our military has the highest precentage of college educated ENLISTED MEN of any in the world. And they are pissed off! Shit is getting ready to hit the fan, better put your goggles on.

2Hotel9 on November 27, 2005 at 04:11 pm
Avatar for modern instances

They are inflicting casualty ratios on the enemy that near 20 or 30 dead terrorists to every one dead American soldier.

I think that a discussion of casualty rates needs to include civilians.

It’s not just Democrats who are criticizing Bush’s execution of the war.  A majority of Americans are criticizing it.

modern instances on November 27, 2005 at 05:12 pm
Rob
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I think that a discussion of casualty rates needs to include civilians.

I open to discussing it, but I really don’t see where its an issue.  Unless there is some fallacious left-wing rumors you’d like to debunk.

It’s not just Democrats who are criticizing Bush’s execution of the war. A majority of Americans are criticizing it.

Says who?  Some poll of 1,001 people overly-weighted with Democrats who still talk to unsolicited callers and still have land lines in this age of cellular telephones?  Give me a break.  The opposition to the war in Iraq is being manufactured by the media and the left.

If you want to convince me that the majority of Americans are against the war in Iraq (just a little over a year after 62,000,000+ of those Americans but George Bush back in office in an election where Iraq was issue #1) you’re going to have to do better than that.


When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

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Rob on November 27, 2005 at 06:11 pm
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I’m glad to see that you approached the poll that showed criticism was hurting troops’ morale with the same acuity.

modern instances on November 27, 2005 at 07:11 pm
Avatar for Paulie B

We could have a Sayanything.com poll.  We could have all active duty soldiers that post here say whether or not criticism of the war by Democratic senators hurts troop morale.

Paulie B on November 27, 2005 at 08:11 pm
Avatar for Paulie B

Are you currently deployed to in support of OIF of OEF?
( )Yes
(X)No

Have you previously been deployed in support of OIF or OEF?
(X)Yes
( )No

Does criticism of the war by Democratic senators hurt your morale?

(X)Yes
( )No
( )Sometimes
( )Abstain

Paulie B on November 27, 2005 at 08:11 pm
Avatar for Dave

How silly of me, I forgot that we’ve deified the Armed Forces. rolleyes Never mind, then: Down with criticism!!!

Dave on November 27, 2005 at 09:11 pm
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Criticism from my boss hurts my morale, but I don’t think that’s a sign that s/he should stop criticizing me.

Dave on November 27, 2005 at 09:11 pm
Rob
Rob
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Down with criticism!!!

Change that to “down with dishonest criticism” and I’m with you.


When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

robport.gif border=0

Rob on November 28, 2005 at 01:12 pm
Avatar for Gekkobear

Hey, so all this anti-Democrat bashing is lowering their poll numbers and convincing the masses that they are in fact harming the troops?

Sorry, had to give a quick Devil’s Advocate, and maybe the next poll.  What do you think other people think about what you think when other people tell you stuff?

So, do you belive that the incessant carping on the lack of patriotism of Dems for their lack of support for the war is harming their chances at election?

Or maybe you believe that the lack of polls is giving too few people the opportunity to call and bug me during dinner…

Gekkobear on November 28, 2005 at 03:11 pm
Avatar for Paulie B

Maybe I should explain myself, as I was not very clear.  The thread topic is a poll.  The poll states what people believe soldiers feel.  If someone wants to know how soldiers feel, then poll them.

If people do not care about soldiers’ morale, then so be it.  They shouldn’t get angry when soldiers don’t care about them.  Not that it will matter for those people, because here in America (there in America, rather, since I don’t live there), where there is no mandatory conscription/civil service like some other nations, that person will get a free ride of freedom.

Which brings me to a related, but separate, topic.  What does it mean when people say they “support the troops?”

Paulie B on November 28, 2005 at 04:11 pm
Avatar for modern instances

Paul-man, the only poll that counts is the one where you drop your ballot in the box.

Those who use electronic voting machines don’t even get this satisfaction.

modern instances on November 28, 2005 at 05:11 pm
Avatar for 2Hotel9

And people think electronic voting is a good idea because......?

2Hotel9 on November 28, 2005 at 05:12 pm
Avatar for 2Hotel9

Paul-man, the only poll that counts is the one where you drop your ballot in the box.

2Hotel9 on November 28, 2005 at 05:12 pm
Avatar for Paulie B

Polls, whether accurate or inaccurate, do matter.  What’s reported in a poll affects many people’s opinions because people are followers, not leaders.  Many people believe what they think others because it is too much work to find the facts, look at the facts, and then evaluate the facts based upon that individual’s world view.  I would argue that most people couldn’t state their world view in casual conversation, using a few sentences.  I believe that people may spit out a statement that they believe to be their world view, but either don’t make decisions accordingly, or change it at a later date to fit whatever topic they choose to rally behind for the moment.  A world view isn’t shaped by what one supports, what one supports is shaped by one’s world view.

Statistics can be manipulated by the people gathering and presenting them.  Truth can be presented without showing all of the truth.  For that reason, I dislike polls, but because of mankind’s likeliness to follow, I believe that polls are important.

Paulie B on November 28, 2005 at 06:11 pm
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