Say Anything Blog

They “don’t want to debate with people who don’t understand [their] point of view”? 

I wasn’t on the Debate Team, and I routinely got verbally trounched by my college girlfriend (who undoubtedly is now a powerful attorney), but I think the debaters are supposed to have opposing viewpoints.

When reading Introduction to Socialism by Leo Huberman and Paul M. Sweezy; Copyright. 1968, I understood why they do not want to debate those they disagree with.  They have convinced themselves that they are intellectuals and that it takes intellectual strength to hold true to the socialist movement.  This applies even when faced with overwhelming evidence that their movement is a failure.  Socialism is a belief system in which dogma rules out over reason for the sake of the cause.

In other words, it is OK to say and do anything, that convinces others to join the revolution.
“Right now, socialists will be accomplishing a great deal if they succeed merely in keeping alive the faith.  For us, as for the early Christians, preaching our gospel is the supreme duty”. p. 101

It is not that they don’t get it.  It is that they don’t want to get it.

Its because they think people who don’t hold their point of view are stupid, and thus unworthy of conversation.

Which goes to the larger point of why the President sholdn’t meet with Sheehan or any of the rest of them.  Its not about asking questions or debating, its about getting a chance to scream in the face of somebody they hate.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

I don’t think a debate is even worth it.  It’s not going to sway any opinions or change any minds.  Plus Sheehan’s group will probably get their asses handed to them.

they are clearly running away from what they know will be a Rob Port styled smackdown.

I think you might have something brown on your nose.  Hehe, j/k.

So glad I checked in on THIS thread! RPSS. That is going into the reference file! And slug, Huberman&Sweezy are stacked away somewhere in this house. Don’t know how extensive your reading has been, you should definately read The Roots of Counter-Insurgency, edited by Ian F.W. Beckett, and The Guerrilla Reader, by Walter LaQueur. Also Three Who Made a Revolution, by Bertram Wolfe. If these are of any interest to you, give me a yell. I will work up a more extensive list, mostly pre 1980. Nothing wrong with old knowledge, it is very often correct, even if archaicly phrased.

Andrew, I pay him to say stuff like that.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Thanks for the reading list Hotel.  I am interested.  I picked Huberman and Sweezy from the late 1960’s because most of the anti-war movement’s thinking is still in that time period.  The difference now is that they are the disaffected deserving, who see the US as the preventer of their revolution.  The US has become their scapegoat in very much the same way that the Jews were the scapegoats of the German petty bourgeoisie and the National Socialists Workers’ Party.

Has the spam resorted to responding to itself?  Good grief!

[...] Something tells me that Sheehan and her supporters won’t be participating. [...]

Gold Star Families for Peace

I can understand your sorrow and grief for loved ones because I just lost my
dear mother. Of course, she did not die fighting valiantly against the
terrorists who are determined to destroy our way of life and take over the
world. Your loved ones were brave, courageous, and patriotic. We all owe them
our deepest appreciation for their ultimate sacrifices. Finding these type of
young men and women, who love their country and the freedoms that they and their
families enjoy, is a little harder today than it was during World War I and
World War II. You and I owe those soldiers in those wars many, many thanks, and
their families, our prayers. And, today we need to bow down to those soldiers
in Afghanistan and Iraq, who have given their lives and those that might give
their lives for our freedoms. By them fighting the terrorists on foreign soils
saves thousands of lives here in the United States. We lost about 3,000 lives
on 9/11, but with the determination and bravery of our young fighting men and
women, hopefully we won’t have to suffer anymore catastrophic attacks on our
country. I pray for them daily and my heart goes out to them.

President Bush went to war with false information, but he also went to war with
good information and good intentions. Sadam and the Tailaban were torturing and
killing their fellow countrymen and ladies. Sadam used WMD’s against his own
people and illegally used the money for oil to build big castles and houses for
himself and payoff greedy politicians in the United Nations. He and the
Tailaban had training camps in their countries to train and arm terrorists.
Sadam may not, as yet, have been tied directly to 9/11, but he was involved in
training terrorists to attack free countries, including ours. He was smart
enough to cover up his terrorist activities so that even some well meaning
American citizens could not see it, and for that matter, still does not see it.
We are not a nation building country, but any country that wants and needs our
help to stamp out terrorism and build a free nation should have our support.

President Bush received bad information from our intelligence groups, but he
also heard top Democrats, such as President Clinton, Al Gore, John Kerry, Ted
Kennedy, and many, many others say that Sadam had WMD’s. So, we know that the
President wasn’t the only one misled. But now, we can all relax because Sadam
is out of power and has no way of developing WMDs. Our country is much more
safer without the Tailaban and Sadam. Sure there are other training grounds for
terrorists; maybe some in our own country. But, with our brave men and women
fighting these beasts, we will win. And, with the full support of their loved
ones and all the other grateful Americans, they will continue to be brave and
fight to protect the American way of life. We, as proud Americans, need to come
together to fully support our troops so that they can continue to protect our
freedoms and rights that our forefathers fought so hard for and sacrificed their
lives for. We cannot give up now! We cannot afford to lose this fight!

You and I know that we have been attacked by terrorists for many years, but
nothing has been done about it until now. If we had tackled the terrorist
problem years ago, 9/11, in all probability, would not have occurred. So, let’s
join hands and see this thing through so that we don’t have to look back and say
that we should have completed the job. Let’s look forward with our children,
who so desperately need us right now, so that they can enjoy the same standard
of life that we do now. Some children have lost their dads and moms in this
war, but they can always look up to them as heroes who made everyone’s lives
better. They can say that their dads and moms joined their forefathers fighting
for what they believed in. They don’t need to be filled with hate, but with the
love of their moms and dads. They need to remember their moms and dads as the
brave men and women that fought galantly for their country. They don’t need to
see bitter moms and dads, grandmas and grandpas, aunts and uncles, brothers and
sisters, and friends that won’t honor their lost loved ones.

I hope and pray, over the next few days, that the news media will cover the
hurricane victims and our brave men and women fighting for their country and not
the bitter and ungrateful protesters. The protesters have the right to think
what they want and say what they think, but there is always a right time to
protest. The protesters could show more poise by finding the right time to do
their protesting, and show less bitterness and not use hate words and actions to
try to convey their beliefs.

Let our brave soldiers rest in peace and be remembered for their bravery and ultimate sacrifice.  They volunteered to serve to their country, as I did, and died for their country so that their families could live in peace.  Someday I will meet them and I will hug each one of them and tell them how much the American people, at least most of them, appreciated what they did for their country.  I would like to tell each of them to ignore the ungrateful protesters, the Fondas and Kerrys, that only look for fame and publicity.  These type of people, ride on the backs of their brave friends, sons, daughters, husbands, wives, uncles, aunts, etc. who gave their lives for what they believed in, just to grab a little attention.  These type of people normally don’t have any pride or a backbone, and must leach off the brave and successful.  But, let them execute their rights that you died for to protest as much as their little hearts desire.  The majority of Americans ignore them and usually laugh at them, not because of their loss of their loved ones, but for their lack of scruples and inability to understand the world around them. 

Mr. Sheenan, I have the deepest respect for you and your brave service to our country and I hope that your mom does not continue to paint you as an idiot for serving your country and paying the ultimate sacrifice.  You can bet that your dad and the biggest majority of Americans are on your side and we will always think of you as you would like to be remembered.  God bless you, forever!