Say Anything Blog

I believe I speak for many people when I say, uhhhhhhhhh, Beavis, what in the heck are you talking about?

And Hillary feels justified in this"Crusade"because she is pushing the prosecution of her husband for sexual assualt, soddomy, and rape. Oh! That’s right! Only Repugs are held responsable for criminal activities. Dems are allowed to do as they wish, regardless of the law. Silly me.

Your tax dollars, hard at work. I mean, what’s to investigate here?

Lets see, what we have here is a game company marketing products to children that include pornography.  News flash—selling pornography to kids is against the law. 

What, we’re all supposed to just let it slide? Why dont you just come out and say it Rob—you support giving porn to kids, don’t you.  Just say so.

Wow, 355 to 21 for the investigation. There were 59 who didn’t vote. For those of you in Rio Linda, 355 + 21 + 59 = 435.

Any government involvement in this is stupid.

I don’t support giving porn to kids, I’m just wondering why Congress needs to be involved in this.

And while we’re at it, why on earth does sex merit an “adult” rating while the assault, armed robbery and cold-blooded murder in the rest of the game does not?

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Sorry Rob, I have to disagree with you on this one.  Rock Star Games built the game from the ground up to have an adult element, then at the last moment, disabled it to get a better rating.  But what has been disabled in software is notoriously easy to re-enable.

True, Congress needs a prolonged session with the hickory switch for getting involved with this.  It would be far better handled by a prosecuter pressing charges.  But somebody needs to investigate this company.  They’re pretty unethical.

What, we’re all supposed to just let it slide? Why dont you just come out and say it Rob — you support giving porn to kids, don’t you. Just say so.

I have the hardest time discerning sarcasm sometimes.

It would be far better handled by a prosecuter pressing charges. But somebody needs to investigate this company. They’re pretty unethical.

They are unethical because they are profiting by the glorification of violence in the name of entertainment?  And they should face legal ramifications…

If this is the case every director/producer/film distribution and production company should face the same backlash.

It already had a ESRB rating of “M” (Mature) and I felt that they appeased their opponents by relabeling their game with the “AO” (Adults Only) rating.  What a difference a year makes (17+ v. 18+)

The software was released without access to these taboo scenes and to “unlock” them, one had to actively seek out the crack and patch the game.  No innocent 17 year-olds just stumbled upon this.

Rob:

I don’t support giving porn to kids, I’m just wondering why Congress needs to be involved in this.

I don’t know about congress per se, but criminal charges are certainly in order, don’t you agree?

And while we’re at it, why on earth does sex merit an “adult” rating while the assault, armed robbery and cold-blooded murder in the rest of the game does not?

Good damn question, but i’m willing to bet a nickel that you wouldn’t support limiting that to Adults Only either.  Am i mistaken?

APBT, in the same vein as Rob:

The software was released without access to these taboo scenes and to “unlock” them, one had to actively seek out the crack and patch the game. No innocent 17 year-olds just stumbled upon this.

Bullspit.  No kid ever “stumbled upon” his dad’s porn collection either, right?  But when he did, he never ever shared it far and wide with all of his friends, did he?

Another nickel says that practically every high school kid in America who owns that game has already got the crack on his thumb-drive.  It’s not a matter of “actively seeking it out”, it’s just doing what kids will do.  Trading porn with friends is part of growing up.  Trying to stop it is part of being a grown-up.

Marty said, I don’t know about congress per se, but criminal charges are certainly in order, don’t you agree?

What are you going to charge them with?  What law or laws have been broken?

Can you say"political opportunism”? I knew you could! Billary is all pissed off about computer game that shows her daughter"bobbing on a knob” and she cares not a single wit about her husband sodomizing a Federal employee. Is that clear enough? Or should I engage my CAD and draw you a picture?

This a phenomenal non-issue...the idiots in the case are thus:

1) any parent who goes “Sure junior, you can have the game. Spend your days chiansawing old ladies to death and blowing cops’ heads off with a sawed off shotgun...wait, what’s that...SEX??!?! You are forbidden to ever play the game again!”...and along those lines. It is for parents like this that abortion should remain an option...they do not need to reproduce, I can scarce believe they exist in the first place.

2) the government for not only following a rating scheme based on that thinking, but for giving two flips in the firstplace. Elect me emperor of the united states and I promise if a case like this ever hits my desk I’d tell the prosecution to get a clue...it’s a game that clearly advertises, like its FOUR predecessors, that you must kill your way to the top against corrupt cops, military, drug dealers and good ol’ fashion gang bangers...what did you expect. Go play tetris instead, sheesh. Bunch o’ idjits. These are the people that are deciding our political fates? 355 to 21?!?!

You libertarian anarchists crack me up.

Really?  Because you moralizing nanny-staters give me the heebie jeebies.  You have no problem forcing morals down peoples throats...as long as they’re your morals.  But lets not let this descend int name calling, shall we?

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

I don’t know about congress per se, but criminal charges are certainly in order, don’t you agree?

No, I don’t.  The game itself was marked for mature audiences.  17+.  And there was certainly no secret made about the violence in the marketing or even on the very cover of the game itself.  With the level of violence already so high, why is everybody getting pissed off about the sex?

If you want to blame somebody for this game getting into the ahnds of kids...blame the parents.

Good damn question, but i’m willing to bet a nickel that you wouldn’t support limiting that to Adults Only either. Am i mistaken?

I support parents making their own decisions about what games kids should and should not be playing.

Bullspit. No kid ever “stumbled upon” his dad’s porn collection either, right? But when he did, he never ever shared it far and wide with all of his friends, did he?

This goes to a fundamental misunderstanding of the issue at hand.  This is not like checking for dust bunnies under your dad’s bed and coming out with his Playboy.  This is like purchasing a game, searching for information about that game on the internet, finding a “sex hack,” downloading said hack and installing it on the computer.  Quite a different situation.

Trading porn with friends is part of growing up. Trying to stop it is part of being a grown-up.

Right.  There’s just two things to remember with that.

1) Anytime you put the government in charge of what is and is not acceptable content in any venue you’re going to end up with censorship.  Period.  This is a decision that should be left up to non-legislating grown-ups.  Like parents.

2) Video games aren’t just for kids these days.  There are plenty of adults who play them as well.  This game was marked for kids 17 and up.  Period.  Basically, adults.  If kids younger than that have this game I’m not wondering about the game makers, I’m wondering about the parents.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

What morals did anyone force down your throat Rob? Your fellow citizens have decided through their representative democracy that 17 year olds shall not purchase pornography.

This isn’t what I was talking about.  I was talking about sending the government down a path that ends with it telling us what we can or cannot play/watch.  That’s not where I want to be, which is why I am squarely behind parents making these decisions.  The more we bring government into this the more we’re in for a world of hurt.

You DO disagree with that after all, don’t you? C’mon, be a man and admit it. You wont kids to have access to porn. Just say so — I can handle it.

You know, Marty, just because you and I don’t see eye-to-eye on this one doesn’t mean you have to be a fucker about it.  Seriously, accusing me of supporting porn for kiddies?  C’mon now…

18, to me, seems a reasonable age at which kids should be introduced to porn.  In this case, the porn was locked away in such a way that required a special set of circumstances in order for it to be viewed.  The game isn’t supposed to be played by anyone under 17, which is just a year away from the age you speak of.  Mostly, this game is for adults.  I’m just not getting the outrage here.

Or perhaps you just have a problem with your neighbors and fellow citizens voting for laws that you disagree with…

Well my neighbors and fellow citizens voting for stupid things has never stopped me from speaking out against those things in the past, but in this instance I’m pretty much in favor of the no porn until 18 law.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

You DO disagree with that after all, don’t you? C’mon, be a man and admit it. You wont kids to have access to porn. Just say so — I can handle it.

Seriously, this is ironic, right?

be a man and admit it. You wont kids to have access to porn. Just say so — I can handle it.

I will...but it has nothing to do with being a man. My folks let my friends and I watch whatever we wanted...they’d roll their eyes if they thought it was stupid but they knew if we were treated like intelligent human beings, taught as intelligent human beings, that we’d turn out as such. Nobody I hung out with has gone off the deep end...we’re all doing quite well I might add. I found porn when I was 8, I hardly cared. When I started to care, it was there...big deal. I was scared of the dark after watching horror movies too, but that blew over real fast. Essential education: differentiating between fact and fiction.

Give kids access to porn? that’s ridiculous. How about making it available to adults, and if some kids get their horny mitts on it oh well.

You libertarian anarchists crack me up.

LIQ: What are you going to charge them with? What law or laws have been broken?

Hmmm, contributing to the delinquency of a minor?  Dessiminating pornography to underage children?  Are those not laws that were broken in this case?  Can i sell a Hustler to a 17 year old, so long as it’s still wrapped in plastic?

What morals did anyone force down your throat Rob?  Your fellow citizens have decided through their representative democracy that 17 year olds shall not purchase pornography.

You DO disagree with that after all, don’t you?  C’mon, be a man and admit it.  You wont kids to have access to porn.  Just say so—I can handle it.

Or perhaps you just have a problem with your neighbors and fellow citizens voting for laws that you disagree with…

ROB: This isn’t what I was talking about. I was talking about sending the government down a path that ends with it telling us what we can or cannot play/watch

Already there pal.  You cant watch rape or snuff or kiddie porn, so sayeth “the gubmint” AKA your fellow citizens.  And if you’re a minor, you can’t even watch porn legally.  This is a road well travelled friend.

Marty, just because you and I don’t see eye-to-eye on this one doesn’t mean you have to be a fucker about it. Seriously, accusing me of supporting porn for kiddies? C’mon now…

Hopefully not a fucker in the same line as Jadegold.  I hope you dont mind if i occasionally take a hard line with you friend—thats a long way from being a “fucker” though.  I do this to all my friends, when i think they are full of shit.

In this case, the porn was locked away in such a way that required a special set of circumstances in order for it to be viewed. The game isn’t supposed to be played by anyone under 17, which is just a year away from the age you speak of. Mostly, this game is for adults. I’m just not getting the outrage here.

That’s a fair statement, but what are you advocating—that we lower the age from 18 to 17?  Well should we?  I mean, go DO have to draw a line SOMEWHERE don’t we?  If not 18, why not 17,16,15,14,13,12,11,10,9,8,7,6,5,4,3,2 ?  Where shall the line be enforced Rob?  I’ll settle for the democratic process, and where myself and my neighbors and fellow citizens say it should be drawn, personally.  Are you with us? Or agin us?

Well my neighbors and fellow citizens voting for stupid things has never stopped me from speaking out against those things in the past, but in this instance I’m pretty much in favor of the no porn until 18 law.

Well good!  Thats actually nice to hear—what the hell are we arguing about anyway?  If the line is 18, and this game was sold to 17 year olds, then the law was clearly broken.  Can we have a beer now?

Oh wait, i forgot the moonbat down at the end of the bar:

HTT: My folks let my friends and I watch whatever we wanted…

That explains SO much, Carl… thank you for sharing.

is that the only sentence you read? Have you played the game? In the first hour of play I saw a drive by, countless carjackings, several beheadings, hundreds of innocent bystandards killed...the list goes on and on. And right before I proceeded to bludgeon a room full of cracksmoking gangbangers to death with a baseball bat, I SAW A CRACKWHORE GIVING A GUY A BLOWJOB! Sex is already in the game! oh noooo!!! This is such a great thing for our government to take so seriously. Are you a prude marty? be a man and admit it. You see something wrong with sex. Just say so - I can handle it.

A prude carl?  Hardly.  But since i grew up i’ve come to have a certain respect for law, order, and how they come about.  (hint: it’s not by accident)

I’m pretty much in favor of the no porn until 18 law.

I don’t see how you can be outraged about this Rob.  You can find flaws in rating system (having one rating for 17+ and another for 18+ is kinda dumb) but if you sell a video game that includes pornography and sell it as though it does not, they are guilty of peddling pornography.  Plain and simple.

I’d be the same thing if the makers of a R rated DVD included an Easter Egg where I could watch an explicit porno scene.  If it includes porn, it needs an X rating. 

Unless you just feel we need to get rid of the rating systems for movies and games altogether, but I wasn’t getting that vibe…

I am often reminded of what Milton Friedman (I believe) said:

If you put the government in charge of the Sahara Desert, in 5 years there’d be a shortage of sand.

Regards…

I am finding very difficult to understand why Rob’s point is being missed here.

Our elected officials need to be dealing with more serious matters than this. If in fact a law was broken that would mean the law is already on the books and it is time for a prosecutor to do the job they are paid for and prosecute.

This isn’t a Hillary thing this, like the Schiavo thing is a bunch of elected officials (Repub and Dem) doing the I know whats best for you thing again and not doing the fucking job the were elected to do.

Seriously what are they going to do pass another law that says we were really serious about the first law that you broke.

Our elected officials need to be dealing with more serious matters than this.

So says you.  Others say otherwise.  Whose definition of “more serious” wins the day?  I’ll tell you whose—the constituents that are calling their congresspersons and demanding that something be done.  Squeaky wheels getting greased, etc.

That is, after all, what they are elected to do—respond to the concerns of the people who elected them.

(notwithstanding grandstanding, of course)

Not so says me. How many polls overwhelming said that Congress should not get involved in the Schiavo thing yet the still did. It is my guess thqat you would find very similar results with this issue.

Richard, people who answer polls in the negative are not the same folks who call their congressmen in the affirmative.  I now for a fact that a certain segment of our society was calling daily, asking for intervention on Terry Schiavo’s behalf.  How many people do you think were calling to say “just let her die already, we’ve got more important business at hand”?  Very few, i assure you.

What is more likely was those that called and said “THIS (whatever their pet cause is) is a very important issue”—never mentioning Terry at all.

Same thing here.  If something is important to you, you call.  If it is not, you typically don’t call.

I wrote to my congressman to communicate my disappointment that he chose to support the effort to interfere in the Schiavo family’s private affairs.

You wont kids to have access to porn. Just say so — I can handle it.

That’s a bit loaded, ya’ think?

I don’t think kids should be prosecuted for accessing pornography, nor should the adults that make it available for them.

Then again, I also oppose laws criminalizing drug use, prostitution, and homosexuality.

Yeah, I voted for Michael Badnarik last fall.

Marty

Oh I get it so sorry that I did not understand. 

So if I follow you correctly 100 up tight people who feel the need to influence other peoples lives call their elected official and that is in actuality more than the 100,000 when asked directly what their opinion is.

Let me explain something to you Marty people did call and write their elected offials and told them that they were unhappy with them interfering in a matter that they did not feel they should have been involved in but get this they did after they got involved nobody called and said just let her die because they did not know that they were going to get involved.

And by the way your certain segment of society are the ones that probably want to determine what you and I read.

Let me explain something to you Marty people did call and write their elected offials and told them that they were unhappy with them interfering in a matter that they did not feel they should have been involved in but get this they did after they got involved nobody called and said just let her die because they did not know that they were going to get involved.

That is probably the longest runon sentence I’ve ever seen at SA

Thanks

You’re right, Sphaganum, I haven’t been clear:

Here are my points:

1) I don’t think its 100% clear that Rockstar Games broke the law.  Was the content present in the game and only unlocked by the hack or did the hack add the content?  If the content was present in the game, they’re guilty.  If it was added by an aftermarket hack, I don’t see how they’re guilty of anything.

2) The ratings system is stupid.  Sex with a hooker is “adults only,” but shooting hookers in the face is 17+?  Give me a break…

3) The parents who allowed their children to purchase this game (or purchased the game for them) don’t deserve to be outraged.  The sexual content is no worse than the violent content they were apparently fine with when they allowed the game to be bought.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

Rob~

Given the clarification, we are 100% in agreement

Ditto.  100% agreement on 1,2 and 3.  See how easy that was?

But i think everyone is in agreement on #1—the content was included in the original game, not added by the hack that reveals it.

If the content was in the original crime they are guilty of a crime and should be prosecuted.  The reports I read seemed to imply that the content was added by the hack, which has been my experience with hacks and video games (though I’m not much of a gamer).

Still don’t see where Congress needs to be involved though.

When the people fear their government, there is tyranny; when the government fears the people, there is liberty.

-- Thomas Jefferson

Rob’s recently listened-to songs:

First of all, i want to make a comment to Marty. If you watch a rated R movie , they tend to have nudity and sexual scenes. They have full frontal nudity, at times, and even sexual content including sex. So my question is, if you have to be at least 17 to view a rated R movie with sex and nudity , what makes Grand Theft Auto’s short sexual sequence really any different? I mean i have seen the sequence in the game, first of all, there is NO PENETRATION viewed, secondly, it has nudity of only the woman in cetain instances and it is pixelated and not digitized. So in other words, this game should actually remain to be M rated, but with one added comment on the rating box, nudity. There are plenty of games with nudity and sexual content that are rated M. I believe if this game didnt have the attention of dumb ass politicians like Hillary Clinton complaining about games like these “corrupting” our nations youth, then this wouldnt have caused any issue whatsoever. I mean, Marty, come on, these games have ratings to them. By law, the game makers and the esrb dont have to do any more to say, “hey these games arent made for children”. Either the damn parents abide by the esrb rules and regulations or there child will get there hands on it, period. That goes the same way as movies, music, and anything else that has age limits.

The hot coffee mod in GTA, most likely was created by either Rockstar or Take Two interactive. What sources really point to, is that the scene wasnt suppose to be in the final version of the game. But instead of deleting the scene, as this could interrupt the rest of the data on the game, the creators probably disabled the scene. So, one day, some dumbass hacker found out about it and made it public. So you see, the scene wasnt, most likely, suppose to be viewed. I doubt that it was intentionally suppose to be viewed as a sneak attempt, as this would cause more fire on Rockstar and Take Two and they know that. So why would anyone think that a successfull company like them would intentionally abuse the system like that? I believe in the first reason i just posted, an accident, as do most gamers. Which goes back to what i was saying before. Even with this modification, the game STILL is NOT extreme enough to be Adults Only.

Even with this modification, the game STILL is NOT extreme enough to be Adults Only.

Yes it is. The extreme violence alone ensures that it should remain only in an adult’s hands.

likwidshoe, when i say Adults Only, i mean the AO rating. I believe that this game should be rated M for mature, 17 and older. This game if you really think about it, is a gangster/mobster style game. Very much like The Godfather,Goodfellas, Scarface, The Krays, and especially like the gangster movies of recent times. Those movies are ALL rated R for 17 and older viewing. Why should this game be any different? Just because you control your character? Just because you decide who to kill and who not to? In many violent gang and mob movies, you see INNOCENT people killed all the time. And they are real actors, not cartoon characters. So there is a sense of more realism in these films rather then this game. The only realism in this game, are the options and choices you make. Other then that, just a bunch of pixelated cartoon characters.

So i have to disagree with you likwidshoe, this game shows no more violence then any RATED R gangster and mobster film, so therefor it should be rated just the same, 17 AND OLDER. Just because it is interactive doesn’t raise the rating. There is no law saying that an interactive, harmless form of entertainment, even though graphic, has to be raised a rating compared to other forms of graphic entertainment that is only viewed.

oh sorry about that likwidshoe, lol. im glad we agree then

So i have to disagree with you likwidshoe, this game shows no more violence then any RATED R gangster and mobster film, so therefor it should be rated just the same, 17 AND OLDER. Just because it is interactive doesn’t raise the rating. There is no law saying that an interactive, harmless form of entertainment, even though graphic, has to be raised a rating compared to other forms of graphic entertainment that is only viewed.

Actually I think we agree. I’m against governmental nanny statism as well. I was thinking more along the lines that these kinds of games should be adult only (lowercase). Didn’t catch that you were talking about the ratings system.